ChessMaster Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 I was wandering how many kill points are a BT chaplain and his cenobyte servitors. One, or two? The codex description about CS is really blur. They are wargear entries for the chaplain, but does that make them a kill point? Also, do they have to maintain coherency with the chaplain? Or do they just obey part of the units coherency rules? Taking it further, are they consider part of the unit for purposes of CC, or part of the squad the chaplain is attached to? If I get a power weapon wound against my squad can I remove a cenobyte servitor as a casualty? Is this true for attacks against the chaplain instead? I am not sure if this has been discussed before, but I could not find anything with the search option, and I decided to open a new post. Tnx in advance. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214743-bt-chaplains-and-cenobyte-servitors/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 I was wandering how many kill points are a BT chaplain and his cenobyte servitors. One, or two? The codex description about CS is really blur. They are wargear entries for the chaplain, but does that make them a kill point? Also, do they have to maintain coherency with the chaplain? Or do they just obey part of the units coherency rules? Taking it further, are they consider part of the unit for purposes of CC, or part of the squad the chaplain is attached to? If I get a power weapon wound against my squad can I remove a cenobyte servitor as a casualty? Is this true for attacks against the chaplain instead? I am not sure if this has been discussed before, but I could not find anything with the search option, and I decided to open a new post. Tnx in advance. I don't have time to look it up, but I am fairly certain similar issues have come up for space wolfs and thier more feral (and more house broken) companions the Fenris Wolves. I would check out their FAQ if I where you. For CC however, if the cenobytes have a profile then wounds may be assighned to them, and their deaths count toward combat resolution. If they form a retinue then wounds may be assighned to them instead of the the chaplain, if they are not a retinue and hits tot he chaplain must be assighned to him. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214743-bt-chaplains-and-cenobyte-servitors/#findComment-2557040 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acebaur Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 No I don't believe that they are worth a kill point. Only units are kill points and they are not an actual unit. As you said they are wargear for the chaplain. That being said since they have a profile they are like other models during a game. I would assume they must maintain coherency with the chaplain since they are his wargear. They can be taken as casualties from shooting but since they are not a retinue nor are they part of the unit the chaplain may have joined you cannot allocate wounds to them that were either struck on the chaplain or the squad he is with. Also if they are killed by attacks targeted against them they will count towards the combat res but if the chaplain is killed and they are removed it is a little more unclear. The codex says that they are "also removed from play" it doesn't say they are removed as casualties so I'm not so sure they would count in this situation. Hope that clears things up for ya Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214743-bt-chaplains-and-cenobyte-servitors/#findComment-2557205 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Algesan Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I was wandering how many kill points are a BT chaplain and his cenobyte servitors. One, or two? The codex description about CS is really blur. They are wargear entries for the chaplain, but does that make them a kill point? Also, do they have to maintain coherency with the chaplain? Or do they just obey part of the units coherency rules? Taking it further, are they consider part of the unit for purposes of CC, or part of the squad the chaplain is attached to? If I get a power weapon wound against my squad can I remove a cenobyte servitor as a casualty? Is this true for attacks against the chaplain instead? I am not sure if this has been discussed before, but I could not find anything with the search option, and I decided to open a new post. Tnx in advance. pg 48 defines retinues as: "a special unit that they cannot leave during the game". pg 91, under Annihilation victory conditions mentions kill points as: "If a character has a retinue, the character and his unit are worth 1 kill point each." So, 2 KPs, although I see where you are coming from since the Chaplain can survive without the cenobytes but if the Chaplain dies, the cenobytes get pulled. A Chaplain + cenobytes can join a squad, which would make them part of the same unit and all the various rules would apply including taking wounds in a complex unit. However, if the Chaplain ever decided to leave that squad, he would have to pull his cenobytes out and be treated as a unit. The BTs are a bit different in CC, since page 22 of the codex on the last sentence says that all BT ICs are treated as ICs in assaults so the Chaplain can be attacked directly (as he happily swings back himself) in assaults. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214743-bt-chaplains-and-cenobyte-servitors/#findComment-2557274 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Sounds like Fenrisian Wolves, or Tau Gundrones to me- I wouldnt call them a KP based on those precidents. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214743-bt-chaplains-and-cenobyte-servitors/#findComment-2557291 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acebaur Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Sounds like Fenrisian Wolves, or Tau Gundrones to me- I wouldnt call them a KP based on those precidents. Exactly pg 48 defines retinues as: "a special unit that they cannot leave during the game". pg 91, under Annihilation victory conditions mentions kill points as: "If a character has a retinue, the character and his unit are worth 1 kill point each." Key word being "unit". They are not a unit, they do not have a codex entry, they are simply wargear with a profile. Also unlike units, if the leader(chaplain) is killed they are removed from play. A BT command squad is what the BRB describes as a "retinue"(though BT characters do not benefit from the retinue rule) if the Chaplain is smushed in his command squad they command squad still lives, and they have their own codex entry and options. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214743-bt-chaplains-and-cenobyte-servitors/#findComment-2557297 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChessMaster Posted November 10, 2010 Author Share Posted November 10, 2010 Ok, I have read the FAQ on Fenrisian wolves. They are bought as wargear (like cenobytes), the IC can be normally targeted in assaults (like Chaplains) and they are not retinue. They are a unit on their own in CC. They also must stay in coherency with the IC master (like cenobytes) I don't see the reason why the cenobytes are not using the same rules. So, finally, it seems to me that: Cenobytes are NOT a KP You cannot allocate wounds from the chaplain to them, since they are a unit of their own in CC They must be in coherency with the Chaplain My 2 cents. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214743-bt-chaplains-and-cenobyte-servitors/#findComment-2558275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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