Kelborn Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 sorry guys but what is this thread about? Reading via phone and getting to the first page would take some time. ^^" something like the cluster? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380126 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Debonair Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 Let me explain. No wait, there's not enough time. Let me sum up: What began as a humours satire about the soul-crushing process of enduring Old Liber C&C eventually developed into fifty pages of complicated bragging about how great the Liber is and particularly how great it's inhabitants are, with interludes of violence and exuberantly ridiculous events taking place throughout. It's nothing like the Liber Cluster, because the Liber Cluster has a point, a purpose and a goal of sorts. This thread... not so much. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380234 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 So saying I dislike the fact that I don't get amy feedback for my chapter although being an awesome guy would fit this thread? ;P Just kiddin Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380240 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hunter Ydalir Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 I feel the satire is a little to near the truth here. By the by, the current Liber is slow and mellow. Not a touch on Old Liber, which by comparison to what I've seen these days was the wild west. Threads were started and burned to the ground within a matter of hours. No one was spared and the knives were eternally out, for better or worse. In character I'd put it closer to being the subforum populated by Inquisitors rather than a gathering of supreme warriors from various brotherhoods. Ah well. Maybe we should satirize the Liber again, sure. Though perhaps we could make it a somewhat more humble, rather than playing the humility card for japes. Hm, that was a little maudlin. We're still part of the best subforum in the entire gorram B&C mind you, no question. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380316 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt_Reaper Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 Yes. Yes we are. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nomus Sardauk Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380446 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Debonair Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 We're still part of the best subforum in the entire gorram B&C mind you, no question. http://m.memegen.com/ubgzbw.jpg Pretty sure that goes without saying. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380468 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Perils Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 The problem is, I think that people's feelings can get hurt when the Inquisitor's Knives are too sharp, and so the mods tend to restrict the more stringent commenting. Well, I say "problem": of course, it's not a problem, that's how it is. But I do also believe that both levels of criticism can be welcomed by different people. For that reason, it might be a good idea to implement a set of tags to define whether a thread welcomes harsher criticism, whether it is more of a "nice" thread, or if it is a humorous thread. Just an idea X) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380628 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Perfluous Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 (edited) For that reason, it might be a good idea to implement a set of tags to define whether a thread welcomes harsher criticism, whether it is more of a "nice" thread, or if it is a humorous thread. Good idea - we could whittle out the weak. Edit: Smileys are, it seems, useful things to include. Edited May 1, 2016 by Sir Perfluous Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380747 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Debonair Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 For that reason, it might be a good idea to implement a set of tags to define whether a thread welcomes harsher criticism, whether it is more of a "nice" thread, or if it is a humorous thread. Yeah, I'm just gonna call this now; the Mods aren't restricting the intensity of the C&C here. There's lots of factors that have effected the mood and feel of the Liber - people come and go, there's changes in the lore, changes in people's attitudes towards the lore, the Librarium and it's stringent requirements for entry are a thing of the past now (though we do have the Tabulas now, which are pretty awesome), and probably a dozen other things I'm too tired to think of, but I'm pretty sure the Mods cracking down on harsh C&C isn't one of the reasons. I'm also going to be slightly crazy here and say it's better this way - I like not having to literally warn newcomers of just how acidic, sharp and torturous the Liber's C&C can get. Just in case anyone's wondering, I really and honestly used to do that, and for a long time I was the only one who even gave the newcomers any warnings - everyone else just went straight for the throat. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380782 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hunter Ydalir Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 For that reason, it might be a good idea to implement a set of tags to define whether a thread welcomes harsher criticism, whether it is more of a "nice" thread, or if it is a humorous thread. Yeah, I'm just gonna call this now; the Mods aren't restricting the intensity of the C&C here. There's lots of factors that have effected the mood and feel of the Liber - people come and go, there's changes in the lore, changes in people's attitudes towards the lore, the Librarium and it's stringent requirements for entry are a thing of the past now (though we do have the Tabulas now, which are pretty awesome), and probably a dozen other things I'm too tired to think of, but I'm pretty sure the Mods cracking down on harsh C&C isn't one of the reasons. I'm also going to be slightly crazy here and say it's better this way - I like not having to literally warn newcomers of just how acidic, sharp and torturous the Liber's C&C can get. Just in case anyone's wondering, I really and honestly used to do that, and for a long time I was the only one who even gave the newcomers any warnings - everyone else just went straight for the throat. I'll second that. Everything Ace put forward is the Emperors sweet truth. I'll also admit I was one of the people who went for the throat. It wasn't for the faint hearted, though I don't think I was quite as brutal as some other infamous critics, even if I did have my moments. Most interesting was when the critics would turn on each other for their various criticisms if they didn't share a particular viewpoint, and then 'critique' each others criticism. On the one hand, objectively speaking it's incredibly easy to say that if you put your work up for review, you have to accept the criticism of your work as it comes. That they aren't criticising you. Truthfully that's an absolute crock. It's your work, you pour your heart and soul into your chapter and for some of the critics who enjoy ripping things to shreds more than stitching it back together to tear it down does genuinely hurt. A lot of these guys wouldn't stick around to help you put the pieces back together either. Go harsh or go home as it were. I have been both giving this type of criticism and on the receiving end of it. Was it a lot more brutally efficient back then? probably. Did we lose people from the forum needlessly when it could have been growing as a community? Definitely. While it did breed a sense of community of a kind, everyone was more concerned with how well they tore someones work to pieces and that was the bonding point. Do I wish we had more of that sense of overall community and 'cheers' like familiarity? Yes of course, it's one of the things which made me stick around. I do not however believe that the way Old Liber used to work was best. Not at all. The B&C has enough of a reputation for being overly harsh to those who don't just stick around and bear with it. To quote someone I was talking to recently: "Yeah I don't have the time (or to be blunt, the interest) of browsing B&C. I made a post some time ago on there and all I received was crickets and harsh critique of people who don't know how to have fun." -Anon And this isn't the first time I've run into this attitude. So just bear in mind that while we talk of how things are or how we wish them to be, we're talking amongst ourselves, like minded individuals. It's an echo chamber, not a true discussion. It doesn't make us terrible, but it's definitely something to keep in mind. Food for thought eh? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380809 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I hopefully missed the irony. Are you really discussing to cririzie in a more harsh and rough way? "Sorting out the weak?" That is pure arrogance. Do you see yourself as an elite or something like that? I came here to discuss ideas, to exchange thoughs and so on. Not this. As I said, I really hope that I missed the irony...can't believe that to be true. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380932 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 No such discussion is really taking place. Everyone who continues to frequent the Liber, and those who eventually will, are going to provide the C&C they personally feel most relevant to the subject at hand. A relevance that can vary according to the critic and the critiqued. It's not about one being better than another, but about both having vital roles. Some are going to be more consistently harsh than others, and some will be less likely to be accepting of harsh criticism, but the reverse also holds true. A harsh critic does not necessarily mean a bad critic, nor does a gentle critic automatically mean a good critic. All that matters is if it helps to build something better, which is what a good critic aims to do. Assist and improve. The only time the mods will become involved over criticism, harsh or otherwise, is when the B&C's rules on trolling, derailment or personal attacks have been broken. This has been very rare down here. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4380957 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I'm totally fine with this. You should criticize like you want to as long as it is useful and not abusive. It was the tone of the previous posts which made me upset. Especially "we could whittle out the weak" Maybe I got it wrong (which can occur 'cause I'm German and I sometimes lack the fine nuance of some phrases). But it just sounded like: "Let's tore their stuff to shreds. Only the strongest will survive." If I indeed got it wrong, mea culpa. If not, maybe some should think about it. It shall be fun to upload chapters and work with people from around the world. And not selecting the best writers and "whittle out the weak" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381001 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Debonair Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I hopefully missed the irony. Are you really discussing to cririzie in a more harsh and rough way? "Sorting out the weak?" That is pure arrogance. Do you see yourself as an elite or something like that? I came here to discuss ideas, to exchange thoughs and so on. Not this. As I said, I really hope that I missed the irony...can't believe that to be true. That's actually the complete reverse of what I was saying - I was saying this place is much better nowadays, since it's not so strict. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381002 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I did not mean you, Ace. But I ninja'd you. Maybe it clarifies a bit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381003 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Perfluous Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I'm totally fine with this. You should criticize like you want to as long as it is useful and not abusive. It was the tone of the previous posts which made me upset. Especially "we could whittle out the weak" Maybe I got it wrong (which can occur 'cause I'm German and I sometimes lack the fine nuance of some phrases). But it just sounded like: "Let's tore their stuff to shreds. Only the strongest will survive." If I indeed got it wrong, mea culpa. If not, maybe some should think about it. It shall be fun to upload chapters and work with people from around the world. And not selecting the best writers and "whittle out the weak" Sorry, Kelborn, I was only joking. Perhaps I should have put a smiley after it - Poe's law and all that. I apologise for any upset caused. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381012 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Hey, it's ok. As I said, I might got it wrong. Murphy's Law. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381018 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Perfluous Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Wait...I thought Murphy's law was the "Everything that can go wrong will go wrong" one. TO THE INTERNET! *Clicking...clicking...hmming* Right - Wikipedia isn't the most reliable source of information, but I'm claiming victory here. Poe's law. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381027 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Oh...Edgar Allan Poe's Law? :D Well, Murphy fits as well. I'll write something and the worst thing that could happen is that someone gets upset....or not? ^^ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381044 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Perils Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Wait...I thought Murphy's law was the "Everything that can go wrong will go wrong" one. TO THE INTERNET! *Clicking...clicking...hmming* Right - Wikipedia isn't the most reliable source of information, but I'm claiming victory here. Poe's law. Well, you learn some everyday :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381047 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Perfluous Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 (edited) Oh...Edgar Allan Poe's Law? Well, Murphy fits as well. I'll write something and the worst thing that could happen is that someone gets upset....or not? ^^ Nice save. Though getting upset is hardly the worst thing that could happen. Nobody died. Edited May 1, 2016 by Sir Perfluous Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381056 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hunter Ydalir Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I'm fairly sure deaths due to someone getting upset are fairly common, I mean, I've had some close calls with a couple of rather upset gentlemen. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381073 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Argent Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Where do you think all the old Liberati went. They all criticized each other too much and all died when they got upset over it. Some of us got better though.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381611 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hunter Ydalir Posted May 2, 2016 Share Posted May 2, 2016 So is this part of your Path to Redemption eh SP? Didn't you paint up one of my Blazing Sons way back when? You were already more generous than most. I miss the Blazing Sons... maybe I should dig out my old notepad..... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214866-this-is-the-liber-astartes-part-ii/page/56/#findComment-4381851 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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