Space Wolves: How many are there?

[The Son of Russ]

This is a question about the true numbers of each space marine legion.

My friend keeps telling me the black templars number 8000 or so, most of them kept in secret from rowboat girlyman.

 

I really would like someone to post on here a full list of the numbers of space marine legions

 

And are the space wolves numbers many? i mean if there is seriously only 100 to a company, then we number just over 1000 marines.

That is really shocking.

I thought we were the defenders of armageddon and outside the warp!

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

If we assume 150 wolves per company, because Ragnar has the largest at about 200 an they're larger than a marine company, we get 1,800 Space Wolves.

[The Son of Russ]

but is the 8000 black templars true?

 

and if so why are the space wolves so few? because of casualties during the HH?

[Starkhan Fellblade]

but is the 8000 black templars true?

 

and if so why are the space wolves so few? because of casualties during the HH?

 

I dont know if there are really 8000 Black Templars but there are more than a 1000 for sure. As for why the space wolves number so few there are two main reasons

1.) When the SW destroyed the thousand sons they lost quite a few wolves. I don't know how many but we can assume that it was a lot.

2.) They had one small sub chapter the wolf brothers. They spit off in the first founding.

 

These two things combined limit there numbers in the present day

 

Edit: on the lexicanum it says that there are 5000-6000 black templars spread on several crusades. (http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Black_Templars)

Also most chapters only number 1000 so even though the SW only have around 2000 thats twice as many as most chapters.

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

5000-6000 Black Templars sounds about right.

[dswanick]

but is the 8000 black templars true?

 

and if so why are the space wolves so few? because of casualties during the HH?

5000-6000 Black Templars sounds about right.

Black Templars = quantity

Space Wolves = quality

'nough said?

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

Beautiful!

For the majority of the other chapters, there are 1000 marines per chapter. I'll probably think of some sort of major exception and wake up in the middle of the night. The Salamanders follow a different organization but they account for that by having only seven companies. Actually, that means they have a bit less than a thousand.

[Tsavong Lah]

The universe can only handle a certain amount of badassmother****ers like the Space Wolves... if there were any more of us, everything outside of Fenris would implode under the weight of our sheer awesomeness.

[Grey Mage]

Remember- the Black Templars recruit from all over the galaxy....

 

The Space Wolves have Fenris.

 

Its an inherent limit.

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

But the BT defect to the Wolves whenever they see the Wolves fight. They are just stunned by the awesomeness and wish that they had as good a codex. That's why we have 13 Great Companies. Several have been destroyed, only for the BT to defect to the Space Wolves and now there are three extra companies because of that.

 

I'm not sure of my Great Company estimate, does anyone have any fluff related to that?

[Orphus]

But the BT defect to the Wolves whenever they see the Wolves fight. They are just stunned by the awesomeness and wish that they had as good a codex. That's why we have 13 Great Companies. Several have been destroyed, only for the BT to defect to the Space Wolves and now there are three extra companies because of that.

 

I'm not sure of my Great Company estimate, does anyone have any fluff related to that?

 

Here we go again :lol: with the can, with it's worms...

There's plenty of threads on this already if they have survived the thread culling. Search for them ;)

[MaveriK]

WARNING SPOILERS!!

from the Horus Heresy B&C forum topic "Prospero Burns"

 

just curious, what were the exact estimate on the numbers on the Thousand Son's Legion? from known fluff and stuff.

 

Think it says they were about 9,000 (not including spireguard) before the attack

MMm, interesting! it looks like this is one of the many new changes Abnett has incorporated in the SW fluff. I've always known the Wolves to be a small legion, heck we have been all told this since C:SW 2nd Edition! or at least that's what outsiders have always been made to believed?!? I can understand each Wolf Lord having different numbers compared to other great companies, just didn't think so until the Prospero Burn novel.

 

I'm not sure how qualified a Remembrancer's account first hand can be in today's standards but, SPOILER ALERT!!!

The full force of the Sixth was something I did not believe needed strengthening. There is not an Astartes in the Imperium who can out-match a warrior of the Rout, one to one, and we held a significant numerical superiority. Much is said of Prospero’s noble Spireguard, and other auxiliary contingents, but the only true consideration was Astartes numbers, and Magnus the Red’s Legion was small compared to the Vlka Fenryka.

 

just curious, what were the exact estimate on the numbers on the Thousand Son's Legion? from known fluff and stuff.

 

Think it says they were about 9,000 (not including spireguard) before the attack

 

Ah, but here we have a problem. Those numbers aren't necessarily accurate, because the official Legion numbers were only set in stone among the Horus Heresy team after A Thousand Sons had been published. When that novel was written, it was with the assumption that an average Legion was 10,000 warriors, and the official figure has since been set at 100,000.

 

something to consider, adjust and think about.. :lol:

[Marshal Wilhelm]

This is a question about the true numbers of each space marine legion.

And are the space wolves numbers many? i mean if there is seriously only 100 to a company, then we number just over 1000 marines.

That is really shocking.

I thought we were the defenders of armageddon and outside the warp!

 

With regards to Space Wolves numbers, it is at least over 9000.

[Simo429]

It would be nice for GW to give us some exact figures but unfortunately I dont think we will ever see them

[Orphus]

It would be nice for GW to give us some exact figures but unfortunately I dont think we will ever see them

Yeah, don't hold your breath anyone!

[Grey Mage]

It would be nice for GW to give us some exact figures but unfortunately I dont think we will ever see them

Yeah, don't hold your breath anyone!

Considering itll vary month to month it would be impractical at best.

[Sturm Moonwolf]

All I know is Ragnar has the second largest Great Company, numbering close to 200. And if I understand my fluff correctly, that's not counting Blood Claws because they don't make headcount apparantly. And if Ragnar's company is 200, who's to say that the others are not 199 or something, lol. And Grimnar has the biggest company so surely many grey's are pimping with him. Not sure about 13th though, that one could be in the thousands.

[Grey Mage]

I wouldnt count the 13nth co any more than Id count lost companies- theyre just not a viable part of the chapters current strength.

[Simo429]

Do you have a reference for where it says blood claws dont count?

[Sturm Moonwolf]

No, can't recall where I had read that, maybe one of the savants here would know. It's just that I have WD's going back to '89 and I thought I read that somewhere along the lines over the years. I could be wrong, it's known to happen from time to time, lol.

[Grey Mage]

Do you have a reference for where it says blood claws dont count?

Its been one of the grey zones because the quote is 'battle hardened warriors'. Since bloodclaws are fresh meat not everyone feels that epithet applies to them.

[Brother Nathan]

id say space wolves around twice normal chapter strength. the whole dissolution of the chapters was to reduce the strength in the hands of one person. for other chapters, ba float around 1200 ish( because of things like hqs, hounour guards, sanguary guards priests etc oh yeah and death co arnt included in organisation. ) flesh tearers, between 300 and 500 depending on source.(who sayed quality ves quantity? lol) crimson fists is shown in the planetstrike book, ultras in the spacemarie book. templars? 8k seems a bit much, even with recruiting everywhere they go. wheres the grim dark in that?someone should send them to the eye of terror...

[Durfast Spiritwolf]

My GC is about the size of three smurf battle companies, but every GC is of a different size.

 

Mine is fleet based and is not one of the twelve featured in Phil's codex, ie, it's up to you as the fluff is contradictory

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

Most chapters have around 1300 marines. There's an article in the Librarium called the Thousand Marine myth. It explains all that.

[Valerian]

"Each Wolf Lord leads a Great Company comprising over a hundred of the most lethal men Fenris can breed." - page 39, C:SW 5th Edition.

 

"The Great Company of Ragnar Blackmane is second only to Logan Grimnars's, boasting almost two hundred battle-hardened warriors and led by perhaps the most talented Wolf Lord of all." - page 17, C:SW 5th Edition

 

Using an estimated average of about 150 Marines per Great Company (x12), plus about 50 men for the Iron, Rune, and Wolf Priests is probably a pretty good swag. So, 1,850 +/- a couple dozen guys is close enough. This wouldn't include any of the Lost Companies, or the 13th Company, but they aren't controlled by the Chapter, so there is no reason to include them anyway ((although their existence would mean that there are more "Space Wolves" in the galaxy, than just the Wolves operating out of the Fang as part of the Chapter).

 

This estimate makes pretty good sense to me, if you go the other direction, too.

 

The Wolves started out with about 15,000 Marines during the Great Crusade (WD 244), then fought against their Brothers on Prospero, campaigned through the Heresy, fought through the Great Scouring even so far as into the Eye of Terror, lost the 13th Company who continued the chase after Abaddon (or Magnus, if you prefer that version). Then, after all of that, they had just enough men left to split once during the Second Founding (a few years afterward), creating the Wolfbrothers and Space Wolves Chapters (not conforming to the Codex Astartes) from the original Legion.

 

Valerian