Capt. Kenaz Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I was thinking: If you're going to add an Ind. Character to your GH squad and place them in a Rhino, do you only have 9 GH's in the pack? Also , have you found it is better to make both special weapons in your GH packs the same (i.e. 2 meltas), or do you diversify and go with, say, on emelta and one flamer? Just curious as I start to build my army... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarapham Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Well yes you are forced to have only 9GH (or 8 +WG I use) otherwise you wont fit into the rhino until after casualties which is usually not a good idea. Regarding special weapons I always use the same type so I increase effiency and do not waste any shots. Melta/Flamer can have some merit to be mixed however you should never mix Plasma with either of them since the rapid fire nature of the Plasma Gun means you will often be forced to choose between firing it and assault. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2605431 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 If you plan to use a Pack and IC in a Rhino, the total numer of models MUST NOT exceed 10. Special Weapons wise it depends on the role you see your Pack taking; anti-armour or anti-horde will tell you which way to go - off-hand I don't remember rangers, but I believe they have differing ones? So you wouldn't really want to mix and match, plus you shouldn't need to with units in support. ...(or 8 +WG I use)... Why? I'm working on the assumption that the WG is in TDA, which would then make it illegal as the Rhino chassis is not designed to be used with TDA. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2605434 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olgerth Istaarn Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 This has been asked, answered, debated and FAQd to death. 9 Grey Hunters means 9 Grey Hunters. The additional models of any kind do not count: not the WG, not the independent characters, not my grandmother's uncle's bedside slippers. You get one special weapon in the squad, no ifs or buts. As to whether to take 9GH and a special character/WG, or 10GH and 2 special weapons, it is entirely up to you. The tradeoffs are very clear. With 10GH, you: - Gain 1 special weapon. - Have 8 Ld. - Have 1/2 powerfist attack (if you choose to take it) as opposed to 2/3 with a WG. The lack of a second special weapon can be somewhat mitigated by giving a combi to the WG and/or joining a cheap Rune Priest with Living Lightning, which kills things just fine. And yes, GW FAQ specifically addresses this, and makes an asinine and giddy note that they WANT you to agonize over choices as opposed to having your cake and eating it too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2605435 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Johnson the 3rd jr Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 10 men is the max for a Rhino. Better to have both weapons the same (although of course with 9 Grey Hunters you only get 1). What a good amount of people do is 1 Grey Hunter special weapon, and 1 combi-weapon from the Wolf Guard attached to the squad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2605436 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglez Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 8man or 10man squads seem the norm for rhino squads, 8 lets you add a wg in power armour with a fist and a combi weapon, and then also an IC in power armour. also I will almost always take 2 melta as my special weapons, because melta is king :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2605510 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiguriusX Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 This has been asked, answered, debated and FAQd to death. 9 Grey Hunters means 9 Grey Hunters. The additional models of any kind do not count: not the WG, not the independent characters, not my grandmother's uncle's bedside slippers. You get one special weapon in the squad, no ifs or buts. As to whether to take 9GH and a special character/WG, or 10GH and 2 special weapons, it is entirely up to you. The tradeoffs are very clear. With 10GH, you: - Gain 1 special weapon. - Have 8 Ld. - Have 1/2 powerfist attack (if you choose to take it) as opposed to 2/3 with a WG. The lack of a second special weapon can be somewhat mitigated by giving a combi to the WG and/or joining a cheap Rune Priest with Living Lightning, which kills things just fine. And yes, GW FAQ specifically addresses this, and makes an asinine and giddy note that they WANT you to agonize over choices as opposed to having your cake and eating it too. Dude, totally uncalled for. His question has nothing to do with counting an IC as GH#10. You owe the new pup an ale. I was thinking: If you're going to add an Ind. Character to your GH squad and place them in a Rhino, do you only have 9 GH's in the pack? Also , have you found it is better to make both special weapons in your GH packs the same (i.e. 2 meltas), or do you diversify and go with, say, on emelta and one flamer? Just curious as I start to build my army... Welcome to the Fang pup. Your question has no set answer. It all depends on the IC and your style of play. Most combat ICs (WL / WGBL) don't go in Rhinos b/c it is a waste of their ability. RP are probably the most common rhino passengers. A RP can have as low as 5 GH and be viable (rear objective holder and tiny bodyguard while RP casts LL etc) I strongly suggest adding a WG to any GH squad less than 10 members. Combi-melta and PF is the standard load out Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2605514 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronShadow Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Seeing as we're on to Grey Hunters. In the GH v BC debate i'm curious is that extra attack from the BC's on charge worth always having to charge if in range and a slight drop in stats and a drop from boltgun to bolt pistol? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606182 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Seeing as we're on to Grey Hunters. In the GH v BC debate i'm curious is that extra attack from the BC's on charge worth always having to charge if in range and a slight drop in stats and a drop from boltgun to bolt pistol? Grey Hunters come with Bolter, BP and CCW do they not? Or has my mind wandered into senility? So you don't really lose anything from taking Grey Hunters except you can't upgrade them with Jump Packs or Bikes. Realistically speaking, a +1 in any inportant category like WS or BS is always more viable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606188 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronShadow Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Nah I mean BC's come with bolt pistol instead of boltgun, so the pro's of blood claws are: +1 attack on charge, can have jump pack (may aswell get sky claws though). Negatives are: -1 to ws and bs, must charge if within certain range unless with leader and not already armed with a boltgun. GH's having a boltgun and ccw begs the question is that attack worth it? Especially since it only comes on charge Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606232 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Dammit Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 GH's having a boltgun and ccw begs the question is that attack worth it? Especially since it only comes on charge I say no, I dont use them in my list at this time. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606256 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wysten Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Nah I mean BC's come with bolt pistol instead of boltgun, so the pro's of blood claws are: +1 attack on charge, can have jump pack (may aswell get sky claws though).Negatives are: -1 to ws and bs, must charge if within certain range unless with leader and not already armed with a boltgun. GH's having a boltgun and ccw begs the question is that attack worth it? Especially since it only comes on charge They can't buy jumpacks, Skyclaws are Bloodclaws with Jumpacks, but they are a different unit and bloodclaws can't buy jetpack. Generally, the extra attack is not worth it for several reasons, as they cannot take banner or mark of wolven to improve their CC abilitys cheaply, have to be taken full unit size to take the second special weapon and generally get much worse the moment they get bogged down, but if they overkill then they just get shot. Nor do they have the flexability to have decent shooting and not charge, nor gain any extra movement to gain the charge... Yeah, basically. I don't feel much for the blood claw right now. They dominated last codex, but nowadays our codex barely needs them. A raider list with all these Bloodclaws is probably the best way to use them, as otherwise they won't get the charge often enough. Otherwise, Grey Hunters work better with our tactics. If you want bloodclaws, Skyclaws/swift claws are always a better bet in a general list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606267 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Nah I mean BC's come with bolt pistol instead of boltgun, so the pro's of blood claws are: +1 attack on charge, can have jump pack (may aswell get sky claws though).Negatives are: -1 to ws and bs, must charge if within certain range unless with leader and not already armed with a boltgun. GH's having a boltgun and ccw begs the question is that attack worth it? Especially since it only comes on charge That's my point.. Grey Hunters get the Bolter, Bolt Pistol and CCW plus uprated WS/BS.. Why would you then pick Blood Claws tactically speaking? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606288 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nurglez Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 tactically? I'd guess the only advantage is that you can take them in 15 strong squads, so in a crusader with a wolf priest is the only way I could imagine taking them (and I dont use crusader, I'd prefer a 10man grey hunter squad in a redeemer ;)). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606292 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Durfast Spiritwolf Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 tactically? I'd guess the only advantage is that you can take them in 15 strong squads, so in a crusader with a wolf priest is the only way I could imagine taking them (and I dont use crusader, I'd prefer a 10man grey hunter squad in a redeemer :lol:). Yes, the WP more than compensates for the lower WS and a 15-man pack is hard to shift off an objective. They just don't leave any space and trying to tank shock a WP with a meltabomb is never a good idea not matter what armour you have! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606338 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 I have to say I feel the best way, even if you wish to do wolf gaurd in your packs, is to make full ten man squads. You can always remove the second special weapon trooper in favor of the WG, but atleast youll have the model ready to go for those days when you dont want to, or cant afford to. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606552 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Guard Nostromo Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 I have to say I feel the best way, even if you wish to do wolf gaurd in your packs, is to make full ten man squads. You can always remove the second special weapon trooper in favor of the WG, but atleast youll have the model ready to go for those days when you dont want to, or cant afford to. This is soooo true, particularly as the '11 wolf pack' with 2 cheap special weapons and a wolfguard is really difficult to counter. My current favourite is 10 GH - 2PG, WS + WG with CP and PF. 213 points of pure defensive gold. Budge that off an objective! I realise you are talking about a rhino pack, but I really think GM has nailed it... Those times when you can't afford a wolf guard (points wise!) and want the 10 man pack anyway will be really annoying if you always incorporate a WG. Specifically on WG, the standard loadout of combi + fist/hammer is really effective - these are the ones I use constantly, and most commonly in an '11 wolf pack' (as mentioned above) or alongside 8 GH and a rune priest in a rhino. Both real solid packs... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606585 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dosjetka Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Why? I'm working on the assumption that the WG is in TDA, which would then make it illegal as the Rhino chassis is not designed to be used with TDA. Nope, they can choose Power Armour too. Ludovic Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218489-grey-hunters/#findComment-2606667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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