seaglen Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 On the scheme: They are Pastel Marines; baby blue does not scream "vengeance!" to me. there are a lot of odd colours for marines though. pink and black Emperoros children doesnt scream vengeance either. says more about emos to me.... Each marine will also be festooned with badges, scrolls flamable? odds are there are going to be chapters that crop up that are similar to the pre-Heresy ones. yes i dont see a problem here either. just maybe have a think about what makes them different to pre heresy WB, not how they are similar... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620399 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 how is this? UPDATED: This is now the Veterans color scheme. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620413 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I like Orange, less of a fan of Orange and Yellow though - maybe consider something other than Yellow, but not Red. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620428 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 yeah, but orange and black might be too halloweeny and orange and white would make them creamcicle marines! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620433 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 Orange and grey? Orange and.. Liche Purple*? Orange and Orange? Except for eye lenses, Wings/Skull and soft armour. *I have a thing for Liche Purple in schemes at the moment. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620469 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 how's this? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620509 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I say stick with the original color scheme. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620513 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I say stick with the original color scheme. Don't listen to him, he's old and grouchy... I quite like that one, as it goes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620516 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 I say stick with the original color scheme. which is probably what I will do, as I already have an attack bike, rhino, dread, captain and terminator squad painted like that.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620519 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted January 16, 2011 Share Posted January 16, 2011 I say stick with the original color scheme. which is probably what I will do, as I already have an attack bike, rhino, dread, captain and terminator squad painted like that.... I'd love to see how it translate to the models, have you posted them anywhere? EDIT: And ignore CJJ, he'll just derail your WIP ... its what he does best. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620520 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 I say stick with the original color scheme. Don't listen to him, he's old and grouchy... I quite like that one, as it goes. Heh, so am I. I do like that ornge and green one. I might use it for something else. I actually painted up some old Jes Goodwin World Eaters like this way back when. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 16, 2011 Author Share Posted January 16, 2011 I say stick with the original color scheme. which is probably what I will do, as I already have an attack bike, rhino, dread, captain and terminator squad painted like that.... I'd love to see how it translate to the models, have you posted them anywhere? EDIT: And ignore CJJ, he'll just derail your WIP ... its what he does best. No, I don't. The yellow is very pale. It is yellow ink over white primer. The blue is ice blue over white primer, but I have to go over it with blue ink or wash as it is very baby blue. The colors remind me of Swedish marines Oh, and the yellow shoes are gone...they will be the same color as legs. I'm not going to post anymore stuff for a while. I'm a grad student and need to get back to work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2620524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 17, 2011 Author Share Posted January 17, 2011 bumpity Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2622360 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 19, 2011 Author Share Posted January 19, 2011 Sergeants have red stripe on helmets Standard squad markings of arrow, x and chevron for tactical, assault and devastator squads. Veterans wear orange and yellow armor, sometimes with robes with a flame motif. Not sure how to denote company yet. I don't want to do the whole different color rim on the shoulders thing. Probably have a number somewhere. Maybe a kneepad, or on the squad shoulder pad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2624109 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chapter Master Ignis Domus Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 Congratulations! You are the first of my quest to critique all the IAs posted yesterday! For my family, I wept. For my Kingdom, I bled. For my Emperor, I burn. – Bertrand, 11th King of Arden, 1st Chapter Master of the Fists of Vengeance How can he be the king of the place if he's the first Chapter Master? Here're my problems with it: 1. The chief of the veterans sent to train the new chapter normally becomes chapter master. 2. Even if the chief didn't, he would be too old to become a space marine. Ignore Kor Phaeron. Also, you don't need all the pictures of marines. One is fine. A core cadre of 30 Imperial Fists oversaw the raising of the Chapter. Many of the prospects selected came form the noble families of Grindelor, but many came from the hardy peasant stock and yeomanry as well. Notably, Prince (later King) Bertrand of Arden, son of Bohemond, became the first Chapter Master of the Fists of Vengeance. Normally the noblemen are not good choices for marines. Obesity was a sign of richness and power, so the fatter you are, the higher you are. After the initial period of training, arming and organizing the new Chapter, the original cadre of Imperial Fists returned to their own Chapter. Thus, while the Fists of Vengeance are formed from the lineage of Dorn, the new Chapter reflects the culture of their home world, Grindelor. Good, that removes the first of my two problems with the King being Chapter Master. Now brought into the Imperium, Grindelor was scoured of orks and ork spores...a nigh impossible feat helped by the indigenous fungus-eating fauna. You've gotta love spore-eating fungi. I like it. It is as was written, lo these many millennia ago. The Emperor once gifted Grindelor with His light, but it was lost to us through treachery. In our most desperate time of need, Grindelor was restored to the Imperium. As we once were rescued, so must we purge the Imperium of the unclean, the traitorous and the alien. - Chaplain Odo Come in, Deep Space Nine, come in. This is Odo speaking. I might ease off the references a bit. The Fists of Vengeance enter battle with chants and catachisms, braziers burning and bells ringing to honor the glory of the Emperor. The Fists of Vengeance believe that the only true way to worship the God Emperor is through combat. Therefore, every battle is a religous experience and every Fist fights with the zeal of a religous fanatic. Battlefields are hallowed ground, and after the successful culmination of a military campaign the Fists of Vengeance will order the construction of monuments, shrines and cathedrals to be built, honoring the dead and glorifying the Emperor of Man. The Jury is out on this one. I'm still thinking about it. Yea though I fight on the Planet of Death I shall fear no evil, for Thou art with me. Thy fire and mace comfort me. Thou preparest my armor in the presence of mine enemies. Thou anointest my bolter with oil; my bandolier runneth over. Surely initiative and line of sight will be mine all the days of my life, and I will fight for the glory of the Emperor forever! - Captain Valeran of the First Company The Bible, too! We're on a roll! As the Imperial Fists are adept at siege warfare, so too are the Fists of Vengeance. The original Grindelorians were well versed in medieval style siege techniques and the primary philosophy of the Imperial Fists married well to indigenous practices. The first Fists of Vengeance were quick studies to modern siege techniques and siege warfare, heavy weapons and ordinance feature prominantly in Fists of Vengeance formations. So, too. It's a common mistake. ;) The Fists of Vengeance are a Codex Chapter and are organized accordingly. I assume you'll put more in than that. The Fists of Vengeance are based off the geneseed of Rogal Dorn, and are inheritors of the traits of the Imperial Fists. The geneseed has remained pure and the Fists of Vengeance have no deviations in their geneseed. Don't forget the missing organs! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2625562 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 20, 2011 Author Share Posted January 20, 2011 Thank you very much for the feedback, I appreciate it. I will have you know, however, that I did not rip off Deep Space Nine. Odo was a name regularly seen in the early Middle Ages. My insperation was Odo of Bayeaux, who accompanied William the Conqueror at the Battle of Hastings. Odo of Bayeaux In early middle ages, nobility did the bulk of the fighting. This is between the time of the professional roman soldier and the rennaisance professional soldier. Especially in the time of William, the nobility was hardly soft. Most of the names I use for my chapter are medieval names...or names of medieval reenactors I know. ...and the 40k universe rips off from the bible and other literary sources all the time. I think a few misquoted biblical references fit right in. Thank you for pointing out the missing organs, I appreciate that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2625702 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 26, 2011 Author Share Posted January 26, 2011 I picked up some Dark Angels veteran bits (specifically for the power mace, but I am taking advantage of the robed marines, the censers and the cool architectural looking grenades) The bits will be for my Sternguard/Vanguard. Vanguard will have Thunderhammers and Storm Shields, Stern Guard will have various flamer/melta combinations (magnetized) as points permit. Thinking of getting some Legion of the Damned Shoulder pads for my veterans. Any comments on whate I have written for my IA or my ramblings thereafter are greatly appreciated. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2634768 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted January 31, 2011 Author Share Posted January 31, 2011 made some formatting edits to IA. I have a full tac squad, half assault squad, assault bike, dread, five man term squad and a rhino painted to basic tabletop standard. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2640895 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Fists of Vengeance Chapter Badge The flames might work better shorter and wider - right now it looks like it would be difficult to fit on a shoulderpad clearly. Verily, trust not in the apparent demise of the greenskin. Thought they may be brought low with arrow, mace, axe or lance, it is only with fire that truly cleanses the land of the ork’s filth. - Tenant of Fire, Psalm CCXXXVIII, attributed to King Ambrosius, 1st King of Arden Oh, ringlancer. Thou hast not yet read sufficiently well of the Octaguide, for thou hast confused 'tenant' and 'tenet'. That, or the companion work to this book is the Sublessor of Water. A core cadre of 30 Imperial Fists oversaw the raising of the Chapter. Many of the prospects selected came form the noble families of Grindelor, but many came from the hardy peasant stock and yeomanry as well. Notably, Prince (later King) Bertrand of Arden, son of Bohemond, became the first Chapter Master of the Fists of Vengeance. And why did he become so? Grindelor was a feudal planet on the south eastern edge of the Segmentum Tempestus, midway between Lyriax and Antagonis on the border of the Veiled Region, before rediscovery in the middle of the 32nd Millennium. With a diversity of climate and an abundance of natural resources, Grindelor resembled a pristine Terra in almost every way. Just as on ancient Terra, humans grouped into territorial divisions warred on each other constantly, and a strong warrior culture developed. The humans of Grindelor united in a common adversary when the Orks arrived in the early part of the 32nd Millennium. Now brought into the Imperium, Grindelor was scoured of orks and ork spores...a nigh impossible feat helped by the indigenous fungus-eating fauna. Grindelor in the 41st Millenium is still primarily a feudal agrarian based world, but its main export is recruits for the Fists of Vengeance and those that are not selected for the Marines frequently serve in the Imperial Guard or Planetary Defense Force. Er...if it's a feudal world, then they don't even have gunpowder. How scary could the PDF be? And why would they make good recruits for the Guard? If there's fauna that eat Ork fungi, this would be one of the most valuable planets in the Imperium. The Fists of Vengeance differ from most chapters in that they see worship the Emperor as a god. The deification of the Emperor has nothing to do with the Ecclesiarchy, but lay in the indigenous religion of Grindelor, which foretell of the return of an omnipotent ruler/father/god/king who walks among men. The fortuitous arrival of the Imperial Fists fulfilled a prophesy of his return and have so ingrained this god view of the Emperor as to be unshakable. The Fists accepted this? I mean, they like the Emperor, but I can't imagine them not trying to correct their charges a little. The driving force of the chapter is the purification of th Imperium. Every form of alien is to be killed, purged from Imperial Space. Consequently, Fists of Vengeance will never ally with an alien force no matter the peril. And where'd that come from? Yea though I fight on the Planet of Death I shall fear no evil, for Thou art with me. Thy fire and mace comfort me. Thou preparest my armor in the presence of mine enemies. Thou anointest my bolter with oil; my bandolier runneth over. Surely initiative and line of sight will be mine all the days of my life, and I will fight for the glory of the Emperor forever! - Captain Valeran of the First Company The source of thy reference, it is obvious to me. It's so blatant. It's not bad, but it's so, so obvious. The Fists of Vengeance are a Codex Chapter and are organized accordingly. More details than this are very much possible. Find something unique about them, and talk about it. There's more than just company structure - hell, talk about their Monastery, or their deployment habits. Cleanse this world in His Holy Flame! Burn this foe in His Holy Name! Rhyming couplets are not a good idea in this context. Honest. * * * A little barebones as yet. Looks solid enough, though. Further explanation of some of the points I mentioned will help - but each section should be at least a paragraph (well, except battle-cry). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2641962 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 Thanks Octavulg! I really appreciate the feedback! Chapter Badge: As pictured, it would be more for a banner or a stand alone icon. The badge on the shoulder pad will be more like a ring of fire or a wreath. D'oh! Tenant of fire, your rent is due. I'm better than that. Sorry, will fix. Bertrand showed the same zeal and capability for combat demonstrated by his father, King Bohemond. Bertrand earned the place of Chapter Master as he had already been in training for a position of leadership and command even before the Imperial Fists landed. He was put through the training, and rose abover the competition. Grindelor does not remain totally feudal, tech wise. More like feudal plus. Middle Ages with 41st Millenium technology. I know I have to clean this up. Er, yeah. The truffle hunting pigs eating ork spores. I hadn't thought about how they would be so valued by the rest of the Imperium and what the ramifications for what was supposed to be a funny bit of fluff on the rest of the universe. hrm. need to think on that. The IF do try to "correct" the religious aspect, but aeither aren't successful or let it go. I see the zealotry coming out and evolving over the millenia, not something that just happened bang out of the gate. I'm also thinking of tying the indigenous religion into the warrior culture, so that the knights and nobility were also priests etc. The Fists of Vengeance are xenophobic in the extreme because of their experience with orks invading their homeworld. And all other races are icky and naughty in His sight. Thank you for the comments on the quote. One of the things I've always enjoyed, since Rogue Trader, is the slightly off quotes. I absolutely love them. So this is my nod to that. I do have more stuff to add for the codex part...I have a lot of neat things in mind, like how vehicles are adorned with braziers and bells...each vehicle is like a moving chapel, that sort of thing. On the table top, it will mean I will get shot at a lot because my vehicles are more like rolling buildings, but hey, its all fun. And I'll work on the battle cry. Thanks again. I have read your guide many times over...I requently have a copy of it open while I'm working on stuff. Thank you for making the guide and taking the time to smack us around and point us in the right direction. :rolleyes: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2642000 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/uploads..._5583_13917.jpg here is an example of the kind of thing I'm talking about as far as the vehicles go. Not mine, saw it on eBay. Will build my own. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2642009 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Chapter Badge: As pictured, it would be more for a banner or a stand alone icon. The badge on the shoulder pad will be more like a ring of fire or a wreath. Fair enough. Mind you, I think it'd look good on the shoulder pad - just right now it'd be too tall. D'oh! Tenant of fire, your rent is due. I'm better than that. Sorry, will fix. You're hardly the first. Don't worry too much about it. :P Bertrand showed the same zeal and capability for combat demonstrated by his father, King Bohemond. Bertrand earned the place of Chapter Master as he had already been in training for a position of leadership and command even before the Imperial Fists landed. He was put through the training, and rose abover the competition. Might want to put that in the IA, n'est-ce pas? Grindelor does not remain totally feudal, tech wise. More like feudal plus. Middle Ages with 41st Millenium technology. I know I have to clean this up. Then they're a civilized world that happens to have a feudalistic government. Feudal's a technological classification in 40K, too, so it's a bit messy. Er, yeah. The truffle hunting pigs eating ork spores. I hadn't thought about how they would be so valued by the rest of the Imperium and what the ramifications for what was supposed to be a funny bit of fluff on the rest of the universe. hrm. need to think on that. The idea of them needing to basically burn the continent(s) to the ground in order to get rid of Orks'd be kind of neat, but sounds impractical. The IF do try to "correct" the religious aspect, but aeither aren't successful or let it go. I see the zealotry coming out and evolving over the millenia, not something that just happened bang out of the gate. I'm also thinking of tying the indigenous religion into the warrior culture, so that the knights and nobility were also priests etc. I could definitely see it happening by the 'third generation' if you will. First are more Fist, second are less Fist, third are just like everyone else on their planet. The Fists of Vengeance are xenophobic in the extreme because of their experience with orks invading their homeworld. And all other races are icky and naughty in His sight. True, but why would they be extra-anti-icky. Thank you for the comments on the quote. One of the things I've always enjoyed, since Rogue Trader, is the slightly off quotes. I absolutely love them. So this is my nod to that. I just wish it was a little more subtle. Not even that much. Just...more than it is right now. Ah well. I do have more stuff to add for the codex part...I have a lot of neat things in mind, like how vehicles are adorned with braziers and bells...each vehicle is like a moving chapel, that sort of thing. On the table top, it will mean I will get shot at a lot because my vehicles are more like rolling buildings, but hey, its all fun. Sounds good. Thanks again. I have read your guide many times over...I requently have a copy of it open while I'm working on stuff. Thank you for making the guide and taking the time to smack us around and point us in the right direction. Not a problem. Though, honestly, as long as you're happy with what you end up with, that's fine. Just don't insist that we have to like it, too. ;) Glad you like it. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2642080 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 spiffied up the IA a bit and made some corrections. Changed the colors of the tactical (no more yellow shoes!) and veteran (brighter more intense orange) and added to beliefs and combat doctrine. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2643653 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted June 22, 2011 Author Share Posted June 22, 2011 I have abandoned the blue and yellow theme. I've still kept the figures, but those will now be a vanilla chapter. I like the new scheme. thoughts? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2800430 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 I like the new scheme. thoughts? The black is too dark, IMHO. Beliefs The Fists of Vengeance believe that the only true way to worship the God Emperor is through combat. - A little odd, since the Emperor is not God of War in the Grindelor religion. While it's nice touch, it requires some kind of prologue. Battlefields are hallowed ground, and after the successful culmination of a military campaign, the Fists of Vengeance will order the construction of monuments, shrines and cathedrals to be built, honoring the dead and glorifying the Emperor of Man. - I would be wary of this. Indeed, there is another god, whose worship lies within battle. Combat Doctrine As the Imperial Fists are adept at siege warfare, so too are the Fists of Vengeance. The original Grindelorians were well versed in medieval style siege techniques and the primary philosophy of the Imperial Fists married well to indigenous practices. The first Fists of Vengeance were quick studies to modern siege techniques and siege warfare, heavy weapons and ordinance feature prominantly in Fists of Vengeance formations. - That was during Great Crusade, the Imperial Fists now are "normal" Codex Chapter. Space Marines don't have equipment, manpower and resources to perform a proper siege. +++++ What about IF's tendency to sacrifice and their strong belief in "Will Overcomes Everything", including the weakness of body? Cheers, NightrawenII. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/218779-ia-fists-of-vengeance/page/2/#findComment-2800918 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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