Inquisition:Bypassing limitations using Allies/Inducted Unit

[Gentlemanloser]

I love the Grey Knights, but over the years have become frustrated by the limitations imposed by our old Codex, in 'power' was well as versatility.

 

I have, over time, dipped my hand heavily into 'counts-as' in oder to both bring some refreshing change to units I can pay, and offer an increased bite to my armies prowess. I've even tested the waters with potential future grey knights builds using existing codex rules (Sanguinary Guard and Storm Raven heavy lists for example).

 

But I always come back to my Grey Knights. I just don't get the same feel from any other Codex, and can't quite put them down.

 

And while I will be posting a sample list below, this isn't really an Army List post (and hopefully won't get derailed as such! B)) but more a discussion about what little tips and tricks we can bring in to revitalise our lists, that the incredible Inducted and Ally rules allow us. (Apologies if this rambles, I'm just typing as it comes to me! :P And this is all probably stuff everyone knows and does anyway, but I just thought it would be interesting to start a discussion on it! ;))

 

Obviously, the best way to use these rules would be to start with a Marine or IG Parent list, and 'Ally' in a few Inquisitorial Units of choice. But that's never really appealed to me as a Grey Knight player (and my posts will be biased towards GK heavy play). Why use 'nilla Marines when I've got acess to Grey Knights? And I never really had any appeal for the bog standard Army men.

 

So the Inducted Units and Ally rules were mostly glossed over.

 

But recently, I've been toying with looking at the from another direction, and seeing how the Inducted and Ally rules could be best utilised by me as a Grey Knight player. And starting with a WH parent list seems to be very promising.

 

Why do this? Why start with a Parent list for an army I don't really want to play?

 

Well, it allows me to combine both the Inducted unit and Ally rules, to allow me access to the Grey Knight units I most want, and to help flesh out the glaring weaknesses and lack of choice the list suffers from.

 

In what way?

 

At the very base, I need to take 1HQ and 2 Troops from the WH list, as compulsary choices must be taken from the Parent codex. For me, the aim would be (with one exception) to minimise expenditure here, to allow more freedom for the unit I actually want, rather than the ones I must take (I'll go into mroe detail on the exception later!). So that's two bare IST squads and an IL.

 

This unlocks the usual Ally matrix, and allows me to fill up on GK units. A GK Hero and Retinue from HQ, a Grey Kight BC and Squad form Elite and two PAGK squads. And really you wouldn't be looking at taking much more than those in a DH parent list anyway!

 

So what about unit variety and filling gaps in the weaknesses the GK list has?

 

Using a WH Parent list allows me to Induct Space Marine units alongside my Allied Grey Knights! ;) But why, when you're just using Marines with Marines?#

 

While there are SM units you can induct that I wouldn't alongside Grey Knights (Tac Squads and Assault Squads) as they are too similar to the Knights in function and role, there are a few units available that the GK can't replicate.

 

Scouts for one. Infiltrating, Scout moving, Marines, that you can give Sniper Rifles to! I've always struggled to employ home objective holding units with my Knights, usually relying on an expensive 'mini purgation' squad to do the job. But SM Scouts are far cheaper, score, have long ranged weaponry (and can pin!) and just seem a much better fit.

 

And taking two of these unlocks a lot of other units.

 

From actual Fast choices in SM Bikes and Land Speeders, to some interesting Heavy options. There is the choice of picking up Dev Squads, and Taking SM Land Raiders or Dreadnoughts in place of the GK Raiders and Dreadnoughts you can't ally over.

 

While these last two options are generally inferior to the GK choice (lesser stats on the Dread, and more limited LR choice - As I'd go by the letter of the Inducted Units rules, and only allow the Land Raider or Dreadnought entry, no Crusader, Reedemer, Venerable or Ironclad), there are a couple of benefits you can choose.

 

The first is having access to Brother-Sergeant Chronus for a Land Raider (and the ability to purchase a Multi Melta for it!), and secondly having acess to the updated weaponry for a Dreadnought, and Drop Pods!

 

Lastly, a sample list of what I'll probably try at the weekend utilising the most I can wring out of the Inducted/Ally rules. As for my exception above, I've got probably close to a fetish for using IL Karamazov, I just love Montrous Creatures, and he's (currently! go go Dreadknight!) the only Imprial MC to boot! Plus as an added bonus, you *have* to be using a WH parent list to even use him. Can't ally him over into a DH parent list! So instead of try to save points on a base IL (and mystics), I'm going to splash out on ILK with glee. :P And while I could keep the manditory two IST choices bare, why not utilise them fully with the standard Rhino/2xMeltagun loadout. So for 2K;

 

HQ:

ILK

GKBC, Psycannon

 

Elite;

GKBC, 5 x GKT (to ride the LR)

 

Troop;

5 x IST, 2 x MG, Rhino

5 x IST, 2 x MG, Rhino

 

Justicar, 8 x PAGK

Justicar, 8 x PAGK

 

SM Scout Squad, Sniper Rifles x 5, Camo Cloaks x 5

SM Scout Squad, Sniper Rifles x 5, Camo Cloaks x 5

 

Heavy;

SM LR, MM, Chronus

 

SM Dread, TL Autocannon, A Cannon, Drop Pod

 

This gives me a nice spread of Close Combat (ILK, 6 GKT in a LR), Midrange (2 PAGK Squads) and Long Range (2 x SM Scouts), with some Anti Tank and Mech based troops. he Dread is just for giggles and using a Dread in a DP. But I could quite easily have switched things round for Land Speeders or Bikes if I wanted more speed, or Devs for more Long Range.

 

Phew! Sorry for the size of this post! ;)

 

Has anyone else used the Inducted/Ally rules to any amount or success? Any more so than just allying in an Inuisitor with two Mystics for your parent army in any case? Anyone have any other thoughts (maybe from an IG point of view?) about getting the most out of the rules to help keep our armies fresh? Could you do the same (and would it be worth it) to reverse this and use a DH parent list with a SoB based army, to maybe get some MArine units laongside the sisters (granted not a great choice! nor are the SoB in quite so much need for this as the GK!)?

[Hellios]

Has anyone else used the Inducted/Ally rules to any amount or success? Any more so than just allying in an Inuisitor with two Mystics for your parent army in any case? Anyone have any other thoughts (maybe from an IG point of view?) about getting the most out of the rules to help keep our armies fresh? Could you do the same (and would it be worth it) to reverse this and use a DH parent list with a SoB based army, to maybe get some MArine units laongside the sisters (granted not a great choice! nor are the SoB in quite so much need for this as the GK!)?

 

Not sure want you want but I find that IG can really help (can't remember what the new guard FAQ allows so take with a pinch of salt)... but the dakka a Leman Russ can add to a grey knight or sister list is pretty nice (although exorcists are great)... Infantry Platoons can help give you cheap bulk in what may otherwise be a small army (in the case of grey knights) and sentinels do have their uses depending on how your list is constructed. I've seen grey knights in Valkyries (IG being the parent list in this case)which I guess makes them faster although I have done it myself.

 

Personally I think that the IG have more to offer than space marines.

[Inquisitor Fox]

I've used a Grey Knight Terminator squad as allies to my Witch Hunters before, to great success. BC with Thunder Hammer/Psycannon, 3 GKT, 1 GKT w/ Psycannon. It filled a much needed counter-charge and fire support element. While expensive, it's also what got me slowly into the Daemon Hunters fold as well with awesome models. That being said, I've made fun lists of a combination of ISTs, Sisters of Battle, Grey Knights and Inquisitors and had an absolute blast playing them. Not always the most power gamey of things, they're a joy to field.

[SirDuck13]

Gentleman,

 

I've had mixed luck running allies of all sorts with both WH and DH lists. Overlapping the two armies can really help bolster the weaknesses in both, and helps patch up the monotony of running just one or the other. I tend to go more towards running WHs with SoB squads and a Canoness at the lead, but with at least one squad of PAGKs tucked into an Immolator at the 1500 points range. It helps alleviate a few of my issues with both armies. The GKs in the SoB heavy list gives the needed CC strength some heavier punch, while the SoBs are cheaper and still fairly durable and put more boots in the mud so to speak. Also, the heavy support choice of an Immolator gives a small squad of PAGKs something to hitch a ride in across the field. That's just my two cents though.

[ValourousHeart]

I doesn't look like you will have to wait that much longer really....

 

Just up today on GW

Hmm... What will you be spending your tax return on?

[Gentlemanloser]

You sir, have made my day! :lol:

 

And I thought the news from my wife that her and my little girl were going to look at some rescue cats tomorrow to replace the two we lost last year would be the highlight of my day today! :)