Razorback Weapon Option

[Brother Mayhem]

Hey all,

 

I have my 3 Razorbacks/Rhinos to make, but I don't know which weapon mount I should go for for the Razorback. Its either going to be the Las/Plas or Dual Lascannons because I don't really like the look of the Heavy Bolters...

 

Also, if I choose Las/Plas, how would I model them? Lascannon mount, with one cannon cut off with 2 plasma in its place?

 

Cheers,

[MeatGrinder]

Lascannons are always good, It all depends on what you'e using it for.

If its for rush, go cheap and get the Hbs.

If its for your Long fangs then definately get the las.

Assault cannons are spectacular. I adore them, I'v been converting up my preds to all have them. They are a seignificant burst of mid range firepower when you need it.

[WG Vrox]

I would go 1 twin las and 2 las/plas.

[Freman Bloodglaive]

Lasplas all the way. You have two weapons for removal on damage, one high strength AP2 shot at 48", two at 24" and three at 12" making it a nastier weapon as you get closer.

 

Converting them is pretty easy. Leave off one lascannon, stick two plasma guns side by side, stick them where the lascannon goes. It's not like you need plasma guns for your Grey Hunters.

[Demonslayer]

I like the Las/Pas, with more shots more weapons <_< Unless your shooter is blind then the re-roll comes in hand :D

[Sturm Moonwolf]

I like twin-linked lascannons personally, been using them a long time and I just like to hit with it when I need to and it's especially useful when trying to shoot flyers down, the re-roll helps but I'm an apocalypse player more than standard game player. I would convert up las/plas for smaller games though if you plan on staying in that field, it's overall a better combo.

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

DO BOTH. I am not great at conversions but I still cut and magnetized a lascannon barrel in each razorback so that I could stick on either twin-linked plasma guns or the lascannon. Here's the link:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...t&p=2549000

[ORKILL]

It's not like you need plasma guns for your Grey Hunters.

 

 

:cuss!!!??? If you're not using Plasma then you are missing out. Plasma is the key ingredient to the pain train!

[Grey Mage]

It's not like you need plasma guns for your Grey Hunters.

 

 

:cuss!!!??? If you're not using Plasma then you are missing out. Plasma is the key ingredient to the pain train!

Agreed. Plasma is king. Melta is a close second though.

 

I like the TLPG and LC for my Razorbacks, or the TLHB for some nice cheap supporting fire.

 

Once in a while, or if Im playing cityfight, Ill switch out for the TLACs- they do great in street fights.

[Orphus]

It's not like you need plasma guns for your Grey Hunters.

 

 

:cuss!!!??? If you're not using Plasma then you are missing out. Plasma is the key ingredient to the pain train!

Agreed. Plasma is king. Melta is a close second though.

 

I like the TLPG and LC for my Razorbacks, or the TLHB for some nice cheap supporting fire.

 

Once in a while, or if Im playing cityfight, Ill switch out for the TLACs- they do great in street fights.

I agree.

 

Don't forget about HBs though, works wonders against Orks ;)

[Godhead]

Las Plas all the way for me. It takes longer for weapon destroyed/immobilized results to wreck my vehicle, and it's a wonderful way to pop 3 ap2 shots off on tough units. I run a 5 man GH and pack leader in mine. Plasma gun and combi plas. It pumps out some pain on stuff like termies, nobz, MC's etc. And it's super versatile for an all comers list.

s

[Sarapham]

HB for me, though I have built the other options. Because the only thing better than a Razorback is two :lol:

[Schertenleib]

Las Plas all the way for me. It takes longer for weapon destroyed/immobilized results to wreck my vehicle, and it's a wonderful way to pop 3 ap2 shots off on tough units. I run a 5 man GH and pack leader in mine. Plasma gun and combi plas. It pumps out some pain on stuff like termies, nobz, MC's etc. And it's super versatile for an all comers list.

s

 

 

Actually I think they addressed this in the new 40K FAQ. Hybrid weapons count as one for weapon destroyed result.

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

Actually I think they addressed this in the new 40K FAQ. Hybrid weapons count as one for weapon destroyed result.

 

Ok, I had a bit of time, so I searched the FAQ, this is probably what you are referring to:

 

Q: When a Damaged – Weapon Destroyed result is rolled

and a weapon is destroyed are any built-in, combi or coaxial

weapons attached to it also destroyed? (p61)

A: Yes.

 

Considering the weapon entry is Lascannon AND a Twin Linked Plasma Gun, that signifies two separate weapons. Clearly the two weapons are not one combi-weapon. Does "built-in" imply anything more than the weapons being attached together, a la a combi-weapon? Not from where I look, so that doesn't apply either. I am not sure "coaxial" is defined anywhere in the game, but a quick wikipedia search tells me that a las and TLPG on a razorback could potentially be considered 'coaxial' to the razorback. But every example of 'coaxial' I have come across is a something like a tiny machine gun directly attached to a large turret, which is not really the same as having two weapons of roughly equal size, side by side. Of course, let's also remember that there is no official way to model a Las and TLPG on a razorback. It would be perfectly legal in game to NOT have the TLPG on the rear turret where the lascannons usually go. Therefore, if this rule were to apply, it would penalize one way of modeling Las/TLPG but not the others. Which is very, very stupid. That's the main reason I think this FAQ answer does not apply here. And of course, the FAQ, is akin to 'House Rules' anyway so it can be ignored in your gaming group, even if for some reason you thought it did apply.

[Whitefireinferno]

Me and My group have always gone with if one goes they Both Go deal since The are Bought at the Same time And on a Basic Razor It takes up one place,Plus the Old Model had them as Coaxial so in all Honesty those who have Modelled them as Seprate weapons to Nerf Weapon Destroyed results taking them Both out I say BOO. Also AssCanz Rule all!

[WG Vrox]

since The are Bought at the Same time And on a Basic Razor It takes up one place

So with that logic, I can fire both weapon as one weapon not two?

[Whitefireinferno]

So by your Logic are they Twin-linked together? No also Look at the Baneblade it has a coaxial auto cannon I think does that make it fire as one weapon? they Take up the Same Hardpoint But when that hardpoint goes Boom they both go see Russ.

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

Me and My group have always gone with if one goes they Both Go deal

 

As is you right, but you have no right to make dubious arguments without challenge from others.

 

since The are Bought at the Same time And on a Basic Razor It takes up one place,

 

Bought at the same time? Irrelevant to the issue at hand. (Also, everything on a model is "bought at the same time").

 

Takes up the same place? Uh no. There is no official las/plas configuration. It can be modeled legally any number of ways. Which I already said.

[Wildfire]

I would say it depends on what you're using them for. Overall, for non-BA players, I would suggest tllc over las/plas. To get full effect from your las/plas, you have to be sitting still. With tllc you can move about a bit, dodging behind cover or moving to get a clear shot.

 

Plasma is the key ingredient to the pain train!

 

For some reason this made me laugh. You're mixing metaphors, since when do trains have ingredients?

[Ven.Dread Greatclaw]

Don't you just love the rule benders and modellers trying to get advantages! ;)

 

Of coarse both weapons are destroyed if a razorback gets a weapon destroyed. :)

 

The rule bending can go on in infinitum otherwise. There's no place in the book that says that a twin linked weapon must be mounted in pairs...

They just fire at the same time at the same target. Does that mean that I can model my lascannons wherever I want on my razorback? Probably but they still gets destroyed at the same time.

 

You probably dont remember the old Razorback that had Las/Plas turrets.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Z472mqw2unY/S8VXtS8jvUI/AAAAAAAAAIs/kfAnCFQIBiY/s1600/Ultramarine_Razorback.gif

 

That means that the correct razorback model should be something along that line

http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee132/Thorvald-1066/Picture487.jpg

 

You can still make the twin linked plasmas as pintle mounted or whatever you like but the fact remains.

GW intended them to be mounted as coaxial weapons in the same turret. And Weapon destroyed = Turret destroyed and both guns gone.

I bet 95% of the gaming community agrees with me on this one. The rest of the 5% is probably rule bending and want their advantages.

 

So please stop rule bending. We don't need it. We have a great selection of armaments and we are better then most armies on more then one point. Many players are already calling us cheesy so please don’t add more wood to their fire.

[Orphus]

Don't you just love the rule benders and modellers trying to get advantages! ;)

 

Of coarse both weapons are destroyed if a razorback gets a weapon destroyed. :RTBBB:

 

The rule bending can go on in infinitum otherwise. There's no place in the book that says that a twin linked weapon must be mounted in pairs...

They just fire at the same time at the same target. Does that mean that I can model my lascannons wherever I want on my razorback? Probably but they still gets destroyed at the same time.

 

You probably dont remember the old Razorback that had Las/Plas turrets.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Z472mqw2unY/S8VXtS8jvUI/AAAAAAAAAIs/kfAnCFQIBiY/s1600/Ultramarine_Razorback.gif

 

That means that the correct razorback model should be something along that line

http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee132/Thorvald-1066/Picture487.jpg

 

You can still make the twin linked plasmas as pintle mounted or whatever you like but the fact remains.

GW intended them to be mounted as coaxial weapons in the same turret. And Weapon destroyed = Turret destroyed and both guns gone.

I bet 95% of the gaming community agrees with me on this one. The rest of the 5% is probably rule bending and want their advantages.

 

So please stop rule bending. We don't need it. We have a great selection of armaments and we are better then most armies on more then one point. Many players are already calling us cheesy so please don’t add more wood to their fire.

Aahhhh my eyes! *covers them with paws at the sight of the Smurf paint job* so bright!

Rule bending makes me ill :( serves no point whatsoever in the game apart from making jerks out of people.

(not saying people bending this are jerks necessarily just other rules that everyone else puts up with some feel inclined to have an unnecessary advantage.)

[Grey Mage]

Don't you just love the rule benders and modellers trying to get advantages! :RTBBB:

......

 

You can still make the twin linked plasmas as pintle mounted or whatever you like but the fact remains.

GW intended them to be mounted as coaxial weapons in the same turret. And Weapon destroyed = Turret destroyed and both guns gone.

I bet 95% of the gaming community agrees with me on this one. The rest of the 5% is probably rule bending and want their advantages.

 

So please stop rule bending. We don't need it. We have a great selection of armaments and we are better then most armies on more then one point. Many players are already calling us cheesy so please don’t add more wood to their fire.

BS.

 

Complete, and total, conjecture. Are you a rules developer? For GW? Did you talk to them about this? in person?

 

I dont think so.

 

You know what I do think? I think that instead of insulting people you should read the rules as stated in the codex. "Lascannon and twin linked plasma gun". Two things there, as shown by the 'and'. Nothing is mentioned of co-axial. Indeed, outside of apocalypse and the recent FAQ theres not one mention of co-axial in all the rules of 40k. Certainly not a single mention in all of C:SW.

 

So please, dont tell me to stop bending the rules when Im playing them properly.

[Orphus]

Are you a rules developer? For GW? Did you talk to them about this? in person?

I dont think so.

Are you? Are you? Have you? Really-have you? I don't think so, either. And jeesh, let people have their opinions for crying out loud. If you are going to attack someone like that have some proof that you're the one 'playing it properly' :D

 

Nothing is mentioned of co-axial. Indeed, outside of apocalypse and the recent FAQ theres not one mention of co-axial in all the rules of 40k. Certainly not a single mention in all of C:SW.

That's funny, any mentions in any of those examples you gave supporting what you think? Quotes...at all? :P

[narf]

really, all this whining

 

has no-one looked at the space marine faq?

 

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_Custom...nes_Nov2009.pdf

 

last question, answered, and i would say that according to several posts above that 95% of certain peoples gaming communities are incorrect.

 

of course it is just a faq, but hey you put so much emphasis on the other faq you have to treat this one the same.

 

Also how does the 95% of the gaming community work with sponson weapons that are bought at the same time>? both destroyed, or more logically one destroyed????

 

cheers

[barek]

Thank you Narf!