Ladislao Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Hello fellow brothers... this is a very sad moment.. new faq for da and bt went out and... our terminator, already not cheap and not as resilient as the vanilla's ( not speaking about the blood angels' ) but with some more customization, all in a sudden became sub par Especialy the loganwing list, wich i was playng lately... now has NO sense.... i m looking at one of my squads, the little one that usualy do little... a simple squad of 5 termy, 1 ciclone, 2 combi melta, 1 fist and 1 storm shield... i pay 265 poit for it ( with the drop pod), well, the da can have a MUCH better one ( 5 assault termy + the ciclone) at merely 235 points!!! This is... is... is.... not right 8|. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranwulf Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Wait, but doesn't DA SS sucks? I mean, it's the OLD SS, 4++, and only in CC. Ran Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617310 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartali Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Not since the FAQ update *cackles*. DA get the proper 3++ Storm Shield now Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617312 Share on other sites More sharing options...
horrain Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Arjac can thunder hammer people from range now, which gives him a slight edge vs big beasties with a high initiative. But I do agree that the DW just got a major bump. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617315 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarapham Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 So you are sad that the DA Deathwing, which has pretty much always been the premier Terminator Force is actually worth while now... and that our Termies have not gotten bad... just not as good as before compared to them? I think this is a very good thing from GW in that they try to keep older Codex up to date instead of letting the people who stay with them having to wait so very long for their codex to be updated. The Loganwing will still be a fun and the ruling will make no difference unless you face those two updated armies, so if you only care about having the best rules for your Termies I can understand it is sad in a way, but otherwise I´m glad for our dress-wearing brothers. (Not trying to sound condecending or rude, I apologise if it comes off like that and I am just spelling out my thoughts about it.) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617335 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Danvers Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Wait. What's changed? The DA and BT now have 3+ inv to their storm shields so they work like everyone else's? That makes sense, seeing as it was the same peice of gear. So is it just that their terminator's are cheaper than ours that's setting people off? EDIT: a 5-man DW TDA squad with TH/SS is 100pts cheaper than ours. Yeah ok, its a bit lame, but I'd rather have them with CA than Fearless. More attacks and you get a chance to leg it if you somehow lose combat rather than just taking extra hits. I felt a bit sorry for them when they got told they couldnt use the new rules for SS anyways, it makes so much more sense now. Now GW, just give the wolf scouts shotguns again, I had so much fun with them in our last codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617336 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 As a Deathwing player, I'm absolutely estatic for DA players and their new FAQ! It's been a long time coming for them. That being said, I'm still gonna continue building and playing my new Loganwing army. My standard DW build was: 5 termies, 1 with twin lightning claws, 2 with pf, 1 cf, assault cannon - 250 pts Loganwing equilalent: 5 wolf guard termies, 1 with twin lightning claws, 2 with pf, 1 cf, assault cannon - 245 pts Seems to me that there's not much difference in the standard build. It's when you start adding all the "bling" that we wolves become more expensive.... the way it should be IMHO. All in all, a great day for the DA and no worries from this Loganwing player. :lol: ~fearlessgod~ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 In terms of DA's being better at all Termie. I have no problem with this(if true). They should be the best at it. The DA dex has taken a severe beating.. let them have their fun :lol: I think our logan lists would be better with a good mix of termie and pa and utilizing the other things that make us great. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617358 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostwolf Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Man, this is awesome! I don't play DA at all and never intend to but they got molested so hard by their last codex that this can even be considered to be a thin layer of soothing balm to ease the burn. Does this mean the end of the loganwing? Hardly. This is just Jonson's boys getting back at doing best what they are supposed to be best at. Rejoice, Dark Angels! Here's to hoping you get even more candy! *raises ale stein* Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617426 Share on other sites More sharing options...
asmodai650 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 it will only be the end of loganwing for people who jump from codex to codex Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617446 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I think our logan lists would be better with a good mix of termie and pa and utilizing the other things that make us great. Absolutely agree with this assesment. I love playing a pure terminator army, but there is so much more to playing wolves than just terminators. I regularly take scouts, pa armoured WG, dreadnaughts and vehicles (speeders, vindicators, whirlwinds, etc...). In my mind, The Great Wolf would use everything in his great company to secure victory. Even Blood Claws....... :D ~fearlessgod~ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617456 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaitoc Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I still love my loganwing! The fact that you can mix PA and TDA armour and different weapons is just awesome, fluffwise! Sure, my 6 man TH/SS squad is A LOT mote expensive than a DW squad of TH/SS, but who cares? I can still have Longfangs with logan....a relentless devastatorsquad with 5 heavy weapons and one special weapon who can shoot at more than one target! I can still have all the coolness of being a spacewolf, while having some of the benefits that Deathwing have! This is good for deathwing! The greater they are, the harder they fall! I love my old farts! No extra bling in the world on the white indians will change that! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617582 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmk17 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 As a Deathwing player, I'm absolutely estatic for DA players and their new FAQ! It's been a long time coming for them. That being said, I'm still gonna continue building and playing my new Loganwing army. My standard DW build was: 5 termies, 1 with twin lightning claws, 2 with pf, 1 cf, assault cannon - 250 pts Loganwing equilalent: 5 wolf guard termies, 1 with twin lightning claws, 2 with pf, 1 cf, assault cannon - 245 pts Seems to me that there's not much difference in the standard build. It's when you start adding all the "bling" that we wolves become more expensive.... the way it should be IMHO. All in all, a great day for the DA and no worries from this Loganwing player. :) ~fearlessgod~ Don't forget, those are Wolf Claws which are better than just Lightning Claws. So even more value and savings. DA did Terminator Armies first, let them have a nice errata. Errata like that makes it look like they won't be seeing a Codex anytime soon. Besides, some Wolves v. Angels terminator battles would be fun. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617604 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Bleh. Something else getting better does not mean our stuff got any worse. If it was viable before its still viable now. So no complaints, just happiness for our secretive and slightly emo brethren :). .... and the templars. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormbrow II Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I think our logan lists would be better with a good mix of termie and pa and utilizing the other things that make us great. You sir, are speaking too much sense at the moment so you'll have to leave and return later. We've got the worst TDA squads but arguably the best Veteran squads of all Marines in the Wolf Guard. They're incredibly flexible but shockingly expensive if you to try to take advantage of that. I'm not too miffed at the changes as I was hardly going to be throwing my Grey Hunters at TH/SS squads without shooting them up first anyways. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617638 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kassill Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Bleh. Something else getting better does not mean our stuff got any worse. If it was viable before its still viable now. So no complaints, just happiness for our secretive and slightly emo brethren :mellow:. .... and the templars. +1. Nothing of ours got downgraded, so be happy for your fellow astartes! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617644 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki-LaughingDeath Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Sooo how do you tell our emo brothers from our goth brothers, I am confused on that point. There are so many factions that have taken to wearing dresses it's hard to tell. Back on to topic, this is a good thing. There was a player in our store who had gotten into 40k to play the Dark Angels only to find out that his codex was not quite as competitive. Hopefully this will have his Angels on the table again. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617722 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marmande Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 The real strength of Logan's Heroes has been the ability to mix PA and TDA together for their respective bonuses (cheaper special equipment for PA, better save/stormbolter/power weapon for cheap with TDA), whereas I feel Deathwing was always the better Terminator-only army. This just makes it more obvious. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkseer Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 Time to be overrun by a horde of 25 Thunder Hammer / Storm Shield Deathwing Terminators. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617837 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 "Time to be overrun by a horde of 25 Thunderhammer/Storm Shield Deathwing Terminators" My 10 Plasma Cannons, 16 Plasmaguns and 50 PA marines will be waiting from behind a cozy 5+ cover, with Njal keeping diff/dang tests in place on those no-frag-grenade Terminators. I'll be just fine. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617850 Share on other sites More sharing options...
breng77 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 and TH/SS termies need frag grenades why exactly? An if that is you list how are you dealing with other armies such as IG or other mech armies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617870 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 and TH/SS termies need frag grenades why exactly? An if that is you list how are you dealing with other armies such as IG or other mech armies. It's nowhere near the entirety of my list, but I do like to pack me some Plasma. In regards to IG/Mech, the... Erm... (math) Eight-ish lascannons, seven Meltas, et cetera, tend to take care of 'em. Although in my local meta, NO ONE plays IG, so those shots kind of get wasted. When it comes to antitank, my solution tends to be "OH GOD USE THE THUNDERHAMMERS/CHAINFISTS!" My point was, no matter -what- army you're playing against, if you force enough saves (60-120 Bolter shots), they'll drop. In this case, it's even more effective, since it's only 25 models to fire at. Either way, let's not convolute this. Why don't you swing on past the DA forum and offer congrats, if you haven't already? I just did. :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617880 Share on other sites More sharing options...
breng77 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I play DAs and have been there plenty, as for having all that at what point value those 25 termies with cyclones and Belial are less than 1200 points. BTW 120 bolter shots kills on average 5 termies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617886 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I play DAs and have been there plenty, as for having all that at what point value those 25 termies with cyclones and Belial are less than 1200 points. BTW 120 bolter shots kills on average 5 termies. Then it's a good thing I always roll above average. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617898 Share on other sites More sharing options...
breng77 Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 It would also rely that your opponent does not roll above average :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/219454-new-da-faq-the-end-of-the-loganwing/#findComment-2617902 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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