What is the best dreadnought combination?

[Cyprus]

I agree, if you can afford it, always go for Venerable. It will save you many, many times over. Of course, there was the one time where a Dark Eldar player shot my dreadnought, penetrated, and rolled a six. I said, "That's okay, it's venerable." So he re-rolls it, and what does he get? A six.

 

Bad luck bro :lol:

[DarkGuard]

I think as far as melta Dreads in drop pods are concerned, there is a certain 'safe factor' with normal Dreads with Vulkan and Ven Dreads. Both use a multi-melta, meaning that they can scatter more than an Ironclad with its meltagun and still be in melta range. Furthermore, if your not using Vulkan then the BS5 on the Ven Dread comes in handy. However, I feel the Ironclad is probably better at disruption, with his better armour, grenades, and more attacks making him good in CC. But the Ven Dread can also take much more firepower if you get lucky with those re-rolls, so it comes down to what you want.

[Blitzkrieg861]

I haven't used Dreds much since I started playing Space Wolves but I used them pretty much every game when I played C:SM. I think the same principles of what they are used to achieve in an army will stay relatively the same. You need the right variant for the right job in your army. First thing to really ask yourself is what does your army need? Why are you taking a Drednaught? What role does it play in your army? Choose the best one to fit that role. Here are a few that I used with the reasons for it.

 

Drednaught w/ Multi-Melta, Drednaught Close Combat Weapon, Storm Bolter or Heavy Flamer and Drop Pod

Role: Anti-Armor and select infantry types.

Basic Tactics: This is best for when you are facing high armor value tanks that would be otherwise hard to pop from a distance. You can get in nice and close to get that 2D6 damage roll with the Multi-Melta. Depending on what's around you can also turn your attention to infantry with the Heavy Flamer as with most types it will ignore their armor and cover of course being a template and lastly to even assault lighter vehicles as 3 S10 + 1D6 when assaulting (hitting on rear armor) is nothing to scoff at either. I would also like to mention that I would suggest at least 2 of these and perhaps another squad of Marines of some sort to back the Drednaught up. One by itself will probably get focus fired and wrecked fast.

 

Drednaught w/ 2 Twin-Linked Autocannons (Rifleman Spec)

Role: Anti-Infantry and Light Vehicles

Basic Tactics: Move 6" and dump 4 S7 shots on transports and lighter vehicles like Hellhounds, Land Speeders and Ravagers. Also a great potential to reliably take chunks out of infantry but perhaps not an entire horde before they get to your Drednaught. It should be noted though that even if infantry gets to you, it's not over by a long shot. Most infantry won't pack more than 1 Power Fist or Thunderhammer type weapon, and even then, keep in mind they need to roll 4 to glance and 5 or 6 to penetrate your armor and a further 5 or 6 to destroy you. In most instances you should be able to hold out a turn or two until help arrives.

 

Dreadnaught w/ Twin-Linked Lascannon and Missile Launcher

Role: Anti-Tank and Light Vehicles

Basic Tactics: Similar to the Rifleman, you'll keep moving and finding clear lines of sight to blast into armor of any kind. Unlike the Rifleman, the Twin-Linked Lascannon will give you a chance to even pop a Raider or Leman Russ front armor, although not reliably enough, the threat can be a strong psychological tool nonetheless. This variant can also more reliably become a threat to Monsterous Creatures with a S9 AP2 and S8 AP3 shot. Because of the higher cost for this Dred it doesn't servce the purpose, in my opinion, as a speed bump like the Rifleman can as it's a higher risk of lost points should they wreck it before help arrives. Best to keep a baby sitting unit fairly close by to help out.

 

I hope that helps. Try some combinations out but keep in mind what role you're wanting to accomplish and you'll always choose the best one no matter what you choose.

[Shadowstalker Grim]

One thing i've wanted to ask for a while now without opening a new topic:

 

A 3 Missile Launcher, 1 Lascannon devastator squad. In direct comparison to a rifleman, how do they compare at taking out light vehicles?

 

Just interested in a direct comparison between these two squads, didn't want to open a new topic....

[Cyprus]

For my game tomorrow, I'll be taking 2 dreds, no matter what! These are the variants I'll be using (most likely)

 

Dreadnought

TL lascannon, Rocket Launcher

 

Dreadnought

Chainfist, Dred. Close Combat Weapon with Heavy Flamer

I don't plan on using Vulkan in this list (no model, can't do much about that)

I'll prob play IG, or something like that

[DarkGuard]

One thing i've wanted to ask for a while now without opening a new topic:

 

A 3 Missile Launcher, 1 Lascannon devastator squad. In direct comparison to a rifleman, how do they compare at taking out light vehicles?

 

Just interested in a direct comparison between these two squads, didn't want to open a new topic....

 

For using four heavy weapons I'm assuming that that the squad is at least 250pts, 10 men. If this is the case, then that is its main limiting factor. However, lets look at the positives. 10 men means that 6 guys can die and you still have the heavy weapons, or perhaps more accurately, you need to inflict 7 wounds in shooting before allocation to the heavies. This means that they have great staying power. That one lascannon shot that might kill your Dread, or stop it from shooting next turn, will only kill one guy tops, and not inhibit your ability to pour out heavy fire. This survivability becomes more pronounced when you place them in cover, allowing them to soak up more firepower.

 

Furthermore, a ten man squad can combat down to two five man squads, normally with the lascannon and sergeant in one and the missile launchers in the other. This gives the squad more flexibility, allowing them to target two vehicles in a turn, with that highly accurate lascannon shot and flurry of missiles, and again makes them harder to neutralise, as your opponent now has two targets instead of one. And of course, the obvious point, all of their shots are more powerful than a Dread's, allowing them to more reliably threaten AV12 and AV13, as well as touch AV14.

 

However, there are bad points. This squad is not relentless, so it needs to be set up in a good position, normally in cover with good views. If you pick a bad position then your opponent can outmanoeuvre you and stay out of LoS. This is further problematic in DoW missions, as they most move onto the board, potentially loosing a vantage point and 1-2 turns of shooting while they get in a decent position. If you want to give them a transport to help out, either through mobility in DoW or a lascannon Razorback for added firepower your looking at close to 300pts or more, and that is their major let down. Yes this 250pt unit can split fire through combat squads. However, a Rifleman Dread costs 125pts, allowing you to take two of them for the same price of one of these Dev squads. Furthermore, they're shots are still good against light tanks, more accurate, and they can move and fire, which helps them to stay a threat.

 

The only advantages of note I can therefore see for the Dev squad is that they are more versatile with their frag templates, and that they only take up one HS slot, rather than two Elites slots which are always highly contested. However, for their points cost, I firmly believe that Rifleman Dreads are the best anti-vehicle hunters we have at our disposal. Cheaper than the Dev squad, more mobile than them, more accurate than them, and more durable and accurate than the Typhoon, they can split open any AV11 or 10 vehicle.

[Shadowstalker Grim]

I wasnt thinking the whole 10 men, possibly even just the heavy weps and sarge! Much cheaper...not too survivable, but not too pricey..still more than a rifleman, which is why i ask the comparsion...though you make some good points on either account!

 

So 5 lads sitting at the back with lascannon razorback, i think that would give decent punch..

[Captain Idaho]

I like the Heavy Gunner Dreadnought, armed with Assault Cannon and Twin Autocannon. 6 shots a turn which wound on 2+ against most infantry and are leathal to any vehicle in the game up to AV13, and still effective against them thanks to the Assault Cannon.

 

I usually can't do without the DCCW though. So when adding in Lascannons into my list I usually put one on a Dreadnought and use it as a mobile support for my objective holders etc.

[LardO'Blood]

I like venerables with ML/AC, it can kill MCs, almost any infantry and light tanks. (I am a Dark Angel player though, my venerable is a cheap upgrade) I ran them in pairs the other day against tyranids and orks, they cut through everything like butter. It synergizes pretty well with my Deathwing. The assault cannon is great for backing up a LRC or a DW squad with storm bolters/assault cannon. The 48" missile makes it a threat off of turn one and can reliably knock a wound off of a MC.

[Cyprus]

Does GW let you direct order dred arm bitz?

[Cyprus]

So I played a mini megabattle today. I had 1,000 pts, chaos ally had 1,000 pts vs. 1,000 pts of krieg guardsmen and 1,000 pts of blood Angels.

The blood Angels had a weird list, but hilarious. He took the Sanguinor, Mephiston, and Lemartes plus death company and a five man scout team.

The ironclads i used were 135 pts a piece, and served as great distractions for mephiston, lemartes, the death Company, Leman Russ demolisher, and a normal leman russ battle tank. By the end of the match, one of the dred got wrecked because of strength 10 mephiston and the other was only immoblised. I'll run the list a few more times to see if the dreds fit

[trefenwyd]

So, I ran multiple stand-off/shooty (note, no DCCWs) builds through excel mathammer, and other than the "what fits best with your playstyle/army" answer (which is, of course, the correct one), it really all boils down to what you want to kill.

 

Effectiveness (most glance/pen per turn):

AV 10 - TLAC/Assault cannon, followed by 2 TLAC, and then TLLC/TLAC

AV 11 - tie between 2 TLAC and TLAC/Assault Cannon, followed by TLLC/TLAC

AV 12 - tie between 2 TLAC and TLLC/TLAC (advantage to TLLC/TLAC for more pens), followed by TLAC/Assault Cannon

AV 13 - tie between TLLC/TLAC, and TLAC/Assault Cannon, followed by TLLC/ML, and Assault Cannon/ML

AV 14 - tie between TLLC/ML and Assault Cannon/ML, followd by TLLC/TLAC

 

Cost (most bang for the buck):

AV 10 - TLAC/Assault Cannon, 2 TLAC

AV 11 - TLAC/Assault Cannon, 2 TLAC

AV 12 - 2 TLAC, TLAC/Assault Cannon

AV 13 - TLAC/Assaut Cannon, ML/Assault Cannon

AV 14 - ML/Assault Cannon, TLLC/ML

 

So, are you filling a need, or going for most cost-effectiveness? The Heavy Gunner (TLAC/Assault Cannon) is far and away the "best" dread option for AV 13 and below. But, that all depends on your playstyle. This works if you forward deploy the dread, then either advance/retreat to keep the enemy within 24". The 2 TLAC Rifleman build is almost as effective against AV 10-12, and is a true standoff build with its nice range. If you have the dread to make up for anti-AV14 deficiencies in your army, first off, rethink your army, and secondly, the TLLC/ML build becomes viable (for the one turn it survives).

 

I've been playtesting both the 2 TLAC and TLAC/Assault Cannon dreads in my army and so far, neither of them have been worth their points. Sample size is still small, so I'll keep at it for awhile befoe I give up on dread altogether.

[DarkGuard]

Thanks for taking the time to do that trefenwyd, that is most informative. I am very happy to see the Rifleman being the points effective king of anti-transport combat, it's why I keep on championing them :(. Not surprising to see them tail off against AV13, as they can only get glance, and I find they struggle against AV12

 

I fully agree that if you're looking for your long-ranged Dread to do anti-AV14 you need to stop and take a good long look at yourself and your list. Of course, we know that Dreads can be a threat to AV14, they just tend to be loaded up with heavy flamer, multi-melta (or meltagun), and fired at the enemy lines through the means of a huge metal bullet!

 

Also, one thing, you have two AV13s on the first list, I'm guessing the second one should be AV14.

[Machine God]

Hello People.

 

The only bad build Dreadnought is Bjorn The Fell Handed not having Extra Armour!