TheGerman Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 What are some of your strategies brothers? Im looking for some pointers/ ideas for my force. right now my basic loadout is 40 berzerkers 2 defilers, 1 land raider, 2 rhinos, 1 daemon prince with MoT (warp time, b.o.c. and wings). And usually abbadon. Artillery from the defilers and I close in with my troops and everything else. Im also wanting to learn some cheesy lists to use against players I dislike thanks all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeller Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Cheesy as a pure berzerker build? Not sure. Is the landraider for Abaddon alone or some number of berserkers? Maybe you could run 3 land raiders. PA lord with khorne demon weapon and 9 berzerkers in one raider and the same setup in a second raider. The third raider could be a squad of 5 khornate terminators with pairs of lightning claws. For your other two elites you could try plasma cannon dreadnoughts seeing as they can't hurt the AV14. Just wrote this though I doubt it would be very exciting or effective given the massive triple point sinks. TDA lord: MoK, DW TDA lord: MoK, DW TDA Squad (4): MoK, 4x PoLC TDA Squad (4): MoK, 4x PoLC TDA Squad (5): MoK, 5x PoLC Berserkers (10): Nothing Berserkers (10): Nothing Land Raider Land Raider Land Raider --- The idea is simple. Both lord join a 4 man squad and go inside the LR. Five man squad in the third LR. Zerkers hoof it behind the tanks or to objectives. Roll out, drive deep, disgorge, and pray they have nothing with a high AV that can lock you in CC. Just a brainstorm. :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Bleak Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 You want a cheesy CSM Build? Demon Prince, Slaanesh, Lash, Wings Demon Prince, Slaanesh, Lash, Wings 10 Zerks w/ fist champ, rhino extra armour 10 Zerks w/ fist champ, rhino extra armour 10 Zerks w/ fist champ, rhino extra armour 3 Oblits 3 Oblits 3 Oblits That's 1735, so good for a 1750 tourney. Add melta-bombs to each zerk squad if you feel like using up the 15 points. I personally rhino rush my troops of basic CSM, supported by 1 Prince, some zerks in a Land Raider, and 2 vindi's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGerman Posted January 18, 2011 Author Share Posted January 18, 2011 LOL thanks guys keep em coming I'm loving this cheese I literally laughed when reading these lists Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 I dont think that a list that gets carried by 9 oblits and fails hard if lash doesnt go off should be named cheezy . I either play [or rather played] a NM water warrior with 2 rhinos 2 8 man SB squads 1 camper 4 oblits and 2 DPs , but lately am just playing with an anti skimer AC/plas set up on csm [and oblits and DPs] , since NM became totaly unplayable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGerman Posted January 18, 2011 Author Share Posted January 18, 2011 I think noise marines would be cool if you had a lot of them (only for apoc) id drop them with drop pods next to all the enemy space marines and mulch em down but unfortunately in normal 40k we get screwed out of drop pods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukov Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 You want a cheesy CSM Build? Demon Prince, Slaanesh, Lash, Wings Demon Prince, Slaanesh, Lash, Wings 10 Zerks w/ fist champ, rhino extra armour 10 Zerks w/ fist champ, rhino extra armour 10 Zerks w/ fist champ, rhino extra armour 3 Oblits 3 Oblits 3 Oblits That's 1735, so good for a 1750 tourney. Add melta-bombs to each zerk squad if you feel like using up the 15 points. I personally rhino rush my troops of basic CSM, supported by 1 Prince, some zerks in a Land Raider, and 2 vindi's. This is not cheese. Maybe it was, but not anymore; no matter how hard you try. This build completely fails against any good list nowadays. It's only good for beating lists which already did not work. (ie bad foot lists, battleforce armies, fluffy monstrosities etc) To the OP: Is it not a better idea not to play against people you don't like playing? What on earth does it bring you or your oppenent to take a 'cheesy' army just to beat the crap out of him? Great mentality there buddy. We can't field cheesy armies; so maybe you need to look further. We can't even field a real competative build anymore. I don't believe cheesy lists exist at all, but that aside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Bleak Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 We can definitely field competitive....we just have to know what we're doing, and we don't have alot of variety to make it competitive. Basic CSM squads with fist and double specials and icon of chaos glory in rhinos, Demon Princes for HQ no matter what, Oblits, Vindi's (only use them in pairs!!!), and maybe Defilers. That's it more or less. I think that the CSM Heavy Support and Troops sections are two of the best in the game. Elite is somewhat lacking, Fast Attack is non-existant in a competitive sense. 3 Oblits can go bananas whether you get off lash or not. Since you use lash first, you can choose what you want to use depending on the result. So if you don't get lash off on those infantry in cover, you can still fire 3 Lascannons per unit at vehicles, or maybe Multi-Melta's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukov Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 We can definitely field competitive....we just have to know what we're doing, and we don't have alot of variety to make it competitive. Basic CSM squads with fist and double specials and icon of chaos glory in rhinos, Demon Princes for HQ no matter what, Oblits, Vindi's (only use them in pairs!!!), and maybe Defilers. That's it more or less. I think that the CSM Heavy Support and Troops sections are two of the best in the game. I'm sorry but if you mention Vindies and Defilers as options for competative lists then we don't have the same definition or understanding of the word 'competative'. Elite is somewhat lacking, Fast Attack is non-existant in a competitive sense. Yes and this is what makes us not-so competative anymore. Oblits got to do everything in our army; both providing long range anti tank and Multimeltas. We lack cheap suicide melta units. You might not really notice this against most armies; but when you play against some optimised tournament armies which field butloads of vehicles then you will notice this hurts. 3 Oblits can go bananas whether you get off lash or not. Since you use lash first, you can choose what you want to use depending on the result. So if you don't get lash off on those infantry in cover, you can still fire 3 Lascannons per unit at vehicles, or maybe Multi-Melta's. So you bought a Prince and tried to Lash with it and now it doesn't work > sounds like wasted points to me. Mark of Nurgle is a better buy overall, it always 'works'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khurdur Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 yes unfortunately we are not competative anymore...a lack o long rang firepower and no fast suicide melta just think of playing against any of these lists at 1500p and you'll see what I mean Space wolves HQ Rune priest w/ living lightning Elite 5 wolf guard w/power fist, meltagun in rhino Troops 3 x 5 grey hunters- meltagun, mark of wulfen-rhino 5 grey hunters-meltagun-rhino fast attack Thunder wolf cav- wolf claws Thunder wolf cav- wolf claws Hvy Support 3x 5 long fangs w/ 4 ML, in razorback w/ TL plasma gun, lascannon vanilla marines @ 1500p Librarium w/ null field and power that give frienldy unit 5+ invul Elites 3 x dreadnought w/ 2 TL autocannons (thats right 4 TL S7 shots per dread!) Troops 3x 10 tac marines w/ multi-melta, flamer in rhino Hvy Support 3 x Predators w/ autocannon and lascannon sponsons It is unlikely that we will have any armour left on the board after turn 1, and our 6 obliterators are next, even if we deepstrike them it make little difference, they will be wiped out very quickly, and the whole army relies on them...we have little utility, only lash that is useless if the enemy is mechanised, and everyone is these days...only oblits for good fire support, no fast suicide melta, just a heavy reliance on oblits to kill armour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeller Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 Minor point but the dreads only have 4 shots each. Two TL-AC yields 4 shots. Also why are there two special weapons on the tactical squads? Pychotic rules aside you could try something like this? Sorceror w/ WoC (not really a competitive choice but that aside...) 3x Dreadnought w/ TLAC, ML 3x10 CSM w/ MG, Flamer, Rhino 3x Predator w/ AC, LCS 1500 points. 3 reliable AT sources all game and 3 unreliable sources of destruction all the time. Like the libby, the sorc walks but offers nothing to the army. So much for that "living in the wap so we have a good grasp of things and all that" thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellios Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 and I wouldn't even consider those 3 lists to be the mean lists of today... ahhr sad times for chaos... ahh well the majority of my chaos force is 1ksons so I'm used to sucking :< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bap2703 Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 I had good results with a list similar to this one except : - dreads with multimelta & dread CCW - no rhinos ! - MSU of CSM : 5 CSM+melta+icon - fill the rest with packs of 5 daemons - I did stick to the DP Having no powerfists you need dreads to provide close combat impact. But by having no rhino you don't really care if your dread become crazy (well a few CSM will certainly die) With this codex only crazy lists remains to be tested. Going against the metagame can provide good results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukov Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 That build of Khurdur is not the best Marine build at that points level. It should be something like this really: Libby 105 5 marines; razorback Las/plas 165 5 marines; razorback Las/plas 165 10 marines; rhino, MM/flamer 205 Dread; 2x TLAC 125 Dread; 2x TLAC 125 Dread; 2x TLAC 125 Speeder; MM/HF 70 Speeder; MM/HF 70 Speeder; MM/HF 70 Dakka Pred w/ HKM 95 Dakka Pred w/ HKM 95 Dakka Pred 85 We can't even do something close to this. This build is actually good. Those Dreads can't be compared to ML/lass Dreads, they are much cheaper and simply suppres/kill anything up to Av12 very reliably; which is the reason you take them. I probably would take Plasma Cannon/TLAC Dreads instead in this case actually (not used to 1500) ... Bit low on Ap2 so. The libby hides in a razorback; providing a Hood and Null-zone, while having a nice flamer as bonus. All in all the build has got a lot of shots and rivals Guard in pure shooting power. And I'm afraid that SW build isnt really optimised either. Frost Blades are inferior to Wolf Claws for example and you don't take TL-LC Razors but TL-plasm/LC razors... If you take CC upgrades on the GH's, you don't take a Sword; you take probably MoTW which is superior in almost all cases. The Wolfguard are a bit odd too. But overall the idea behind those lists are alright; it is the difference between okay and good though :tu: Going against the metagame can provide good results No, because there is no metagame. It doesn't really exist in 40k. If people would only run Mechanized armies; then maybe. But that's not the case; some armies can do Hybrid or Foot as well. Result is that a bad build is a bad build. Like Marine players who think they can 'metagame' by taking Foot Marines. Then they play against Fatecrusher, Jumper armies or Foot IG and they get massacred. This is not Pokémon or Magic:TG where you can just take 'yellow' because almost everybody takes 'green' and 'red' for example. This isn't a rock/paper/scissors game, vehicles are mostly good simply because the rules make them good. Not because everybody takes them... Metagaming only works if you play in a little local environment where you exactly know what everybody plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khurdur Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Yes zhukov I don't play either wolves or SM and couldn.t remember all the details of the armies...(I've edited some of the things I forgot)..but the main idea is there...that they kick our poor spiky behinds, the newer codexs just outperform us, sadly, we just suck compared to SM, Wolves, BA, IG, all the new armies ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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