Emperors Immortals Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Since the release of the SR and the news that it wont be availabe outside of BA and GK, other roums are again full of complaints that we angels of death get far to much exclusive wargear such as Lib dreads, magns grapples, Sang priests etc. My argument that weve had DC since at least 3rd and sang priests are our intrinsic flavour are falling on deaf ears, so i ask you - what do WE miss out on? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother-Captain Lucius Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Maybe marines riding big giant bats instead of wolves? Ability to Control Death Company? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628541 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHarrower Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 I really like the Land Speeder Storm and miss that... We also don't have the Thunderfire Cannon and our Captain's are missing Artificer Armour. The hell with all of those people though. All of the options that are in the Vanilla Codex they got from our 3rd Edition Codex. We've been dealing with a crippled PDF for years. It all evens out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Gunzhard Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Well let me say this; since 2nd edition (our first codex) we've had all of the same special characters, except Sanguinor and Astorath (I suppose Seth as well), but we then had Cleutin. We had assault squads and veteran assault squads, jump-packer honour guards, all of the standard stuff like dreads and bikes etc... Dante's death mask was cool as was the Shroud of Sanguinius that gave an area affect 'frenzy'; and we also had Death Company. The Baal wasn't in the 2nd ed codex but I want to say it came out before 3rd edition anyway... Third edition also added CCW dreads (furioso) and some more special rules including the hokey 'over-charged' engine. The only major 'new' units we've got since are the Sanguinary Guard and the Storm Raven and the addition of 'fast' to our vehicles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628548 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentL Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Rune blades, artificer for our Captains (Who are uber crappy IMHO) Don't bother arguing with people about that stuff just enjoy your army :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628549 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 We've been dealing with a crippled PDF for years. I'm sorry, but I'm officially fed up with this. The PDF was fine. You got a free Codex update which gave you new things, then you got an actual Codex ahead of other Chapters because your PDF didn't count. You waited three years to get the PDF replaced - would you have preferred to still be working with C:SM, like the Space Wolves? Or would you rather have gotten a Codex that was borderline pointless, like the Dark Angels? Because those were the choices available. Was it flawed? Yes. But considering how the BT, SW and DA got treated, you have not a thing to complain about. And considering the amount of new stuff it gave you (or have you forgotten where the Veteran Assault Squads and Assault Squads as Troops were reintroduced) referring to it as if it were some dark age for the BA is just silly. The PDF was a good thing, which gave you nothing but benefits. Stop complaining about it. In regards to the topic at hand...honestly, none of the Space Marine Chapters are really that distinct from each other when you get right down to it. Even the Space Wolves don't have that much stuff that's truly unique. Most differences will really be down to names. Which makes sense, honestly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628597 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelus Mortifer Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Just try to ignore those comments mate - not worth making the effort to state your case against those that perhaps lack the understanding of what makes them unique. There are many obvious things in the SW and SM codices that are completely unique, are a lot of fun, and give those armies a real edge under certain conditions. Would they fit well in a BA list...? Not really IMHO because they wouldn't be choices we've traditionally had or that fit the fluff. Some just aren't happy with what they have. The grass isn't always greener... and on Baal it's practically non-existent :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628604 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Till Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Id like relic blades as a war gear option for models who use blades encarmine (sp). On sang guard going from a BE to fist is 10 points, so.. going from one to relic blade +10 points. Sounds ok to me anyway =/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plague Angel Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 We've been dealing with a crippled PDF for years. I'm sorry, but I'm officially fed up with this. The PDF was fine. You got a free Codex update which gave you new things, then you got an actual Codex ahead of other Chapters because your PDF didn't count. You waited three years to get the PDF replaced - would you have preferred to still be working with C:SM, like the Space Wolves? Or would you rather have gotten a Codex that was borderline pointless, like the Dark Angels? Because those were the choices available. Was it flawed? Yes. But considering how the BT, SW and DA got treated, you have not a thing to complain about. And considering the amount of new stuff it gave you (or have you forgotten where the Veteran Assault Squads and Assault Squads as Troops were reintroduced) referring to it as if it were some dark age for the BA is just silly. The PDF was a good thing, which gave you nothing but benefits. Stop complaining about it. http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o215/Animus_Seed/lkzyz89efm_clap.gif Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeller Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Just throwing .02 cents around here but aside from lack of grenades and slightly overcosted rhinos the BT are quite capable. DA are unfortunately overcosted for units with less abilities which is a damn shame. It's also a shame the SW can no longer take the Leman Russ Exterminator. So basically here is a list of things the other codices have that the BA don't have and then a list of what the BA have that is unique to their book. C:SM: MoTF Conversion Beamer Relic Blade Astartes Grenade Launcher Artificer Armor Rites of Battle Venerable ranged Dreadnought Ironclad Land Speeder Storm Multiple FOC altering characters (Granted it's a more encompassing codex of many geneseeds) Multiple armywide traits from said characters, again see above. Thunderfire Cannon C:SW: Dreadnought HQ Wolf Guard (moreso in terms of how they can be fielded) Lone Wolf Venerable ranged Dreadnought Thunderwolf Cavalry Frost Blade Wolf Claws Talismans Blood Claws Long Fangs C:BA: HQ that increases chance of gaining ability to use armywide inherent trait Death Company Furioso Dreadnought Librarian Dreadnought Magna Grapples Dreadnought Shotgun Melta/Flamer pistol DoA Sanguinary Guard Fast Vehicles Deep Striking Land Raiders Baal Predator Assault Marines as troops Dreadnoughts as troops Storm Raven Transport discount for assault marines Every dedicated transport available C:DA: Deathwing Rites of Battle HQ on Jetbike Ravenwing (fearless and teleport homers unlike C:SM) Armory AV14 speeder for Sammael C:BT: EC Vows Rites of Battle 10-man Command Squads Veteran Skills Terminator Command Squads Crusader Squads PotMS on predators and vindicators Cheaper Predator annihilators Righteous Zeal Armory No psykers So basically the DA are the only marine codex that is absolutely shafted at the moment. Please excuse me if I forgot some things on any of the lists. The BA have the greatest number of unique items while BT, SM, and SW are fairly even. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628631 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperors Immortals Posted January 22, 2011 Author Share Posted January 22, 2011 Totally agree, i would love to see the DA get a new dex real soon, they have always been a very interesting and unique addition to the fluff IMHO. ANyone remember the black armour in space marine? (the game, not the movie). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628755 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 RELIC BLADES! Dear god, why didn't our Captains get Relic Blades.... All it would take is a nice shiny Errata line "Change page 84 Captain options '- a power fist 25pts' to '-a power fist or relic blade 25pts'..." I'd actually MAYBE use one then, if they were also given Artificer Armour for free. 160pts for a guy running round with a Relic Blade, Storm Shield and Jump Pack would be fine Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628814 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Us Wolves would like everything you guys are asking for as well, please okay thankye. It sounds like the DA forum in here, jeez. :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628819 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperors Immortals Posted January 22, 2011 Author Share Posted January 22, 2011 Us Wolves would like everything you guys are asking for as well, please okay thankye. It sounds like the DA forum in here, jeez. :lol: Lol, bloody wolves. I think weve got a good codex, and dont actually need anythign else, same goes for wolves. Im actually asking what to tell other chapter marines using the SM codex (which i also think is fine, and i run a Ultra army too). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628824 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plague Angel Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Us Wolves would like everything you guys are asking for as well, please okay thankye. It sounds like the DA forum in here, jeez. :lol: Touché. I do think it'd be nice to catalog everything that Blood Angels don't have, just to show other Codex players that they're actually quite blessed. But I don't know that it'd be possible to do so without the complaints. Still, one can dream. I'm still going to get the Thunderfire Cannon model some day though, just to have it. I can use it as terrain in Planetstrike. Mostly I just want that Techmarine. Seriously, look at him. Look at that face. http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o215/Animus_Seed/warhammer/m1860125_99110101394_40kSMThunderfire1_873x627.jpg http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o215/Animus_Seed/warhammer/m1860125_99110101394_40kSMThunderfire1_873x627-1.jpg http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o215/Animus_Seed/warhammer/m1860125_99110101394_40kSMThunderfire1_873x627-1-1.jpg He's ADORABLE. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628830 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Forcystus Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 You know I was jealous of you guys, but then I saw the Dark Angels small list and felt rather content with what the vanilla marine codex offers me Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628835 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeller Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Damit Plague Angel that was a great post. At first I was scrolling and wondering if it was what I think it was and then it was! Then I started thinking about what the Techmarine was thinking about. Then after your last line he instantly became a soft cuddly plush toy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628892 Share on other sites More sharing options...
biglou666 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 haha, plauge angel, your post had me on the floor laughing! in other news, yes, the uniqueness of most armies is balanced. and dont go saying that that DA have nothing, cause theyve just had an FAQ & errata buff, and they can take up to 30 TERMINATORS in one army, all of them being scoring troops?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! hell, come to think of it, im tempted to start a DA terminator list build right now! seriously! i might just blow all my money on some terminators and the codex! :tu: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628898 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plague Angel Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Then I started thinking about what the Techmarine was thinking about. I've been wondering about this non-stop ever since the model was released. "Did I leave the oven on?" "How many Tech-priests does it take to change a light bulb?" "What is the meaning of life?" "Do you ever ask yourself, if giant gods are orchestrating all our battles, feeling joy and anger and despair when we wound our opponents or miss our attacks, or stooping low to see things through our eyes?" "I wonder, if I shoot an ork with a gun painted red, will the ork die faster?" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628901 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 The DA can actually take up to 47 Terminators. More, if you start allying in Grey Knights. Though by that logic the Imperial Guard can have 30 Terminators, too. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628902 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo1701 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 There's a good reason for no relic blades - the fact that we can easily upgrade our units to have furious charge. How evil would that be on S6 weapons?!?! So OK, GEs cost the same as a PW, so to upgrade sanguard (who are basically SM honour guard but with JPs and smaller astartes grenade launchers) to have relic blades (going by the C:SM pricing) would cost 75pts for a squad. But, for the same price we can add in a sanguinary priest with JP to the unit, granting them FC and FnP. Sure the FC is only on the charge, but how many units will still be standing after 1 round? This way you strike first (Vs meq), get a reroll to hit plus the priests extra attacks. Think it balances out. I am a bit miffed as to why our captains don't have AA or GEs though - it's almost as if they thought, 'OK, what would be the most popular 2 wargear items people would want to give a captain, let's remove them from the dex'. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628908 Share on other sites More sharing options...
biglou666 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 The DA can actually take up to 47 Terminators. More, if you start allying in Grey Knights. Though by that logic the Imperial Guard can have 30 Terminators, too. :P :P i meant as scoring troops. obviously you can have termies as elites aswell. but why would you? xD Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2628909 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin2008 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Dont forget the DA have jinx on their bikes too, thats something that has been forgotton. Also everyone complains that that hapter has that and we dont, the end of the day if we all followed suit wih wargear etc, then gw would just make 1 hefty bible book which has a basic army list, then wih chapter specific pages to add a few differences. The fact is we hae assault abilities and some decent vehicles, da have lots of bikes n termies, bt have got the ability to add neophyts in squads to soak up wounds, Plus theirs biws to move closer when suffer wounds etc, sw have giant cavalry and sc such as ragnar who kick ass and sm have their army changing characters, can make bikes trops and have all their annoying smurf characters. Wihou hese dfferences people complain about, its simPly the same army. Enjoy what you got and have fun wth it :cry: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2629029 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin2008 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Not to mention bt can have squads of 20 too :cry: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2629031 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 There's a good reason for no relic blades - the fact that we can easily upgrade our units to have furious charge. How evil would that be on S6 weapons?!?! Relic Blades and Furious Charge would be irrelevant. The weapon hits at S6 either way. Honestly, a lightning claw is probably better for us than a relic blade because of furious charge. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/220226-so-what-dont-we-have/#findComment-2629048 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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