Sanguinarian Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 Did I miss something? Since when can you have DC in TDA? Nope, just painting my Assault Termies in DC colors. They will play by the rules, but can you imagine the panic when they disembark!?! :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMouth Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 all i said was his where estimates and I want exact, its rather simple. I wont submit my "estimates" because I dont want estimates. He went off about it how great his estimates where, I went along. It takes two to tango, so dont even try to put this as being all on me. Here's a link showing the scale of the Storm Raven alongside a Landraider; http://www.dakkadakka.com/s/i/at/at2/2011/...d66284_1478.jpg okay...now to try and find a case to put that in! wow! If you would have said your inquiry was for "STORAGE AND TRANSPORT PURPOSES" there wouldn't have been a "TANGO". IMO, if the standard 5Ws (who, what, when, where, why and sometimes how) get asked in the 1st post then we don't have to try and decipher intentions. Soooo...with that said, if we magnetize the wings we could probably get 2 or 3 inside the Monster Case. It was never about storage. if you read my post its about the size of the hull and its actual target footprint. Since you can only target the hull of vehicles, not wings, not treads, not guns,not spot lights ect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguinarian Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 Well then, in that case, my apologies for linking your two replies together. You seemed satisfied after viewing the side by side and then you referenced storing it. :P It really boils down to: figure it out when and if you get one or 2 or 3. What does it matter if it's EXACTLY 3.75" wide by EXACTLY 10" long if you don't own one? That data seemed inconsequential to EVERYBODY but you and YOUR need to know "EXACTLY" this or that flamed the fire. When you ask someone to do something for you, I would think you'd be a little nicer and less condenscending. :huh: Kind of like needing to know exactly how an orange tastes. Inconsequential data if we describe the fruit and you mean the crayon!?! Make yourself more clear and save us the drama. :P And as far as the main wings go, they are LOS eligible, so now your "EXACTLY" becomes 3-dimensional x-y-z. Thank you, Billy Madison. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DV8 Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 It was never about storage. if you read my post its about the size of the hull and its actual target footprint. Since you can only target the hull of vehicles, not wings, not treads, not guns,not spot lights ect. To be honest I don't understand the point of your posts, other than (and I mean no offense by this) as perhaps some half-hearted attempt to troll or as some manner of validation of your tactical or strategic acumen? Point of fact, reading through this thread, Seahawk was merely trying to be helpful in offering up dimensions (exact or estimations) of the Storm Raven, and you responded with condescension and callous disregard. It's not anything new that weapons fire to a vehicle has to measure to the hull, and when determining cover you only use the hull as a means of determining how much or how little of a vehicle is obscured for cover. HOWEVER, what you fail to realize is that the Storm Raven and Valkyrie (and in actual fact if you think about it, the Wave Serpent/Falcon/Fire Prism "prows") fall into a grey area as to what qualifies as the "hull" of a vehicle and what doesn't? Less of an issue with the Eldar vehicles since they're smaller and don't mount weapons on said prows, but more of an issue because of the Storm Raven and Valkyrie. Both have the potential to mount weapons on their wings. When firing weapons, you measure and check Line of Sight from the weapon. Always. How then is it fair that a Storm Raven or Valkyrie can hide behind a building that obscures the main chassis, with just the wings jutting out mounting weapons? This would allow the vehicle to fire with near impunity as nothing can damage it (by your logic, the chassis being the only part considered for the "hull"?) DV8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguinarian Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 I was going to edit my reply and insert "Stop acting like a pup!" But then sage wisdom from DV8 stopped me in my tracks! :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMouth Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 I understand the grey issue, hence the asking for the bloody measurements. I play with guys that try and exploit things like this and I want to make sure I have all grounds covered and figure out how best to use the vehicle and the rules as written. By "mylogic" as you put it DV8, yeah if the raven had more wing mounted weapons then the missiles it most likely could fire with out any worry, but it doesnt...sooooo moving along then. I was going to edit my reply and insert "Stop acting like a pup!" But then sage wisdom from DV8 stopped me in my tracks! :P but you did post it. Thats like saying, no offense before insulting someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 And to all the naysayers who doubted the awesomeness of the Storm Raven when the rumor pics were first released... y'all been served. That's all I have to say about that. DV8 Well, quoted for truth. ;) Btw, the model looks awesome from above, and the final size comparison with the Landraider makes it even more awesome than it already is! By the love(and probably hatred) of Big 'E, I'm freakin excited about this release, both Dreadnought and SR look hot as hell! :P Snorri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DV8 Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 I understand the grey issue, hence the asking for the bloody measurements. I play with guys that try and exploit things like this and I want to make sure I have all grounds covered and figure out how best to use the vehicle and the rules as written. You did nothing of the sort (I didn't bother quoting any of your other posts that had no relevance (you only had two or three) to the Storm Raven's measurements) : who cares about the wings, i want to know about the hull of the vehicle. Whats its dimensions...remember you can only target the hull...not the wings. MWHAHAHAHAHH!!!!!! ... I think you need to learn to read your own post better and mine. You gave a partial dimension , not dimensionS as I asked for....and i really dont see the hull as bing 10" long...from those pics it doesn't look it, I think you are including the tail as part of the hull. ... page 60. First paragraph...it specifically states you must be able to see its hull or turret. Ignoring, gun barrels, antennas, banner pols, ect...like it said...you must see the hull. Not the wing, not the tail, not the treads, not the smoke stack, not the spot light. ... youre going off a theorized dimensions. Until actual dimensions are provided its just a theorized dimensions, just like what I keep going off of. I keep wanting to think of it being the same dimensions of a rhino almost. If you wnat i could but out my autocad and do some proper dimensions then. LOLOL ... Great you have the lengths, but still you are going off an estimate. I am sorry you cant grasp the difference between an estimate and a hardline figure. By "mylogic" as you put it DV8, yeah if the raven had more wing mounted weapons then the missiles it most likely could fire with out any worry, but it doesnt...sooooo moving along then. At that point I have to ask, who cares what the bloody dimensions of the vehicle are? Are you THAT great at trigonometry that by knowing the precise width, height and depth of the vehicle you'll be able to determine some tactical advantage? That would also require you to know the exact width, depth and height of every one of your opponents models, and the exact measurements of the table account for changes in height, tilt for positioning on uneven terrain, etc. etc. I'm obviously arguing the need for the exact measurements of the vehicle to the point of ludicrous ridiculousness to prove just how ridiculous it is to need its exact dimensions (beyond transportation and storage). A far better question to have asked would be "do the wings qualify as part of the hull or not?". As it stands, there is no ruling as to whether they do or not, PARTICULARLY because in the Storm Raven and Valkyrie, the wings mount weapons that LoS must be drawn from for said weapons. At the end of the day it's up to you and your opponents to determine whether they do or not. And no amount of of measuring (you could use a caliper and measure it to the precise mm for all I care) will change that. Wings as part of the hull or not? Useful. Knowing the exact dimensions of the vehicle, beyond means of transportation and storage? Not so much. DV8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhukov Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 Trolling people who weren't rude or unreasonable themselves is just bad behaviour. +1 to what DV8 said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 Guys, very simple if you feel someone is trolling, click the report button, don't respond in kind. Lets keep discussions of the hull/wings/LOS out of this thread. That is an issue for the OR forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMouth Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 I am not trolling any one, I am simply asking questions that I feel are relevant. DV8 doesnt think that my wish to know exact dimensions is relevant...fine thats his bloody opinion. I think it is relevant hence the asking, and thats my bloody opinion. Its rather simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 As discussed with jamesI we're gonna close this for a bit until people calm down and/or there is anything additional and beneficial to add to this thread. Until then: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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