Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 There's a reason we don't do shield walls any more (though we still do charges, amusingly). Bunching up gets you killed by explodies. They don't necessarily have to be literal chains, remember. :devil: Imagery man, imagery! In the mind it's a cool image and that's what counts, dammit :lol: Now my brain has thought of all the ways that chains can be used ceremonially in their time as Astartes.. As Scouts they sever a chain to mark the end of an old life, the same when they become full Battle-Brothers. Each Brother forges his own life chain, upon his death this is severed and placed in a great hall to honour the fallen. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2644628 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 Nice. You can have lots of crap about forging links and stuff. Also, sneaking in a reference to 'kyton' or 'hyter' would be good. :D Does the chain bind them to the Imperium or somesuch? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2644695 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 Nice. You can have lots of crap about forging links and stuff. Does the chain bind them to the Imperium or somesuch? Now you're forcing me to think.. Dammit, this wasn't supposed to happen so soon. Two schools of thought.. That it is what the chain represents that counts, not the chain. Or that it is the links in the chain.. Each link means something; one for service to the Emperor, or even one for every decade of service, one for a notable victory or accomplishment.. The oldest in the Chapter eventually can forge pieces of armour from all their chains - kind of similar to the naming of the Custodes. Also, sneaking in a reference to 'kyton' or 'hyter' would be good. :D Say what now? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2644706 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 Kytons are D&D chain demons. Jangling Hyter is the city they live in. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2644756 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plague Angel Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 Each link means something; one for service to the Emperor, or even one for every decade of service, one for a notable victory or accomplishment. Like the beads of a rosary? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2644828 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 Or Maesters' chains in A Song of Ice and Fire. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2644847 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringlancer Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 in the middle ages, the chains of fealty worn by knights and those in office weren't so much as to show others of their status. Rather, the weight of the chain was a constant reminder of theoath of fealty the knight swore. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2644854 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 Kytons are D&D chain demons. Jangling Hyter is the city they live in. Ah, I was never a D&D nerd. Each link means something; one for service to the Emperor, or even one for every decade of service, one for a notable victory or accomplishment. Like the beads of a rosary? Or Maesters' chains in A Song of Ice and Fire. Batman is closer to the truth in this case; though it wouldn't be links of different metals. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hunter Ydalir Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Well looks like I'm a coming a bit late to the party, but I'll throw my weight around wherever I can. :lol: I'm tired of people giving C&C trying to make someone else's vision into their vision. All due respect to Ecritter, I disagree totally. You're creating a thread and asking for peoples opinions, you're asking for outside influence to your own thought process'. You can't then turn around and claim that you don't want to be unduly influenced, that's rubbish. If someone is pushing their views that you don't agree with you are more than within your rights to respectfully disagree and tell them that you're not budging. Strangely enough, it works. That is, unless, that idea is totally bananas. Like when the age old offender that I keep in the back of my mind for times like this, who insisted that his Space Marine Legion (yes Legion) had a Titan and was creating all sorts of unfeasible stuff to back it up just because he bought one/wanted to buy one for Apocalypse. That's silly and everyone told him so. And he threw a tantrum. But I digress that's not the point. Moving right along.... Similarly, I'm loath to use "Saxons" as I have no idea how far GHY will be going with his Blazing Sons in Saxonifying them 'Saxon' is an incredibly loosely defined culture, as are the 'Franks' and so on and so forth. You are quite welcome to use whatever culture inspires you the most. I used the Saxons because they did (and still do) inspire me. My Saxons are the kind that landed on the British Isles and proceeded to conquer the place. Keeping their penchant for close in, relatively small scale warrior-to-warrior engagements and much less of the seafaring raiders that they mostly were. In other words, don't feel confined by my choice of influence for my chapter. Who knows, they could be great allies! :woot: Intra-Chapter competition - Warbands vie for the right to answer a call for help; brothers duelling to demand the right to answer these calls. A "hive" concept: each entity - band/company - is seperate and autonomous until the Chapter is threatened or an action requires multiple forces. I like these ideas. I fully accept that this will be a slow process Slow and steady wins the race. What was that quote I used to know, said by someone influential here in the Liber... Paraphrased, but it went along the lines of "Creating an IA is more akin to a marathon than a mad-dash to the finish line." It might have been Octy, or Mol, or someone, I honestly can't remember. Those two are eminently quotable so I'll say someone in that vein. The dedicated Battletech wiki is, in a word, crap. Sad, but true. It is rather... not great. Oh and I actually have Mech Commander 1 and 2 on disk... somewhere. I could probably send you the games through some arcane method if you wanted.... if I can find them. The information within can be rather sporadic, but sometimes can be good. As an aside, I miss the mechwarrior and mechcommander franchises. Either way, I hope you're wrong.. 'cause theming around chains seems quite hard off-hand! I agree with Octy, I think chains are a very strong image and can be linked to many different influences that you can bring to the table. in the middle ages, the chains of fealty worn by knights and those in office weren't so much as to show others of their status. Rather, the weight of the chain was a constant reminder of theoath of fealty the knight swore. I like this quite a lot. I like it so much I want to rip it off in some manner, but common decency is preventing me from doing so. I suppose I can send that fruit basket after all! :rolleyes: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645348 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 Similarly, I'm loath to use "Saxons" as I have no idea how far GHY will be going with his Blazing Sons in Saxonifying them 'Saxon' is an incredibly loosely defined culture, as are the 'Franks' and so on and so forth. You are quite welcome to use whatever culture inspires you the most. I used the Saxons because they did (and still do) inspire me. My Saxons are the kind that landed on the British Isles and proceeded to conquer the place. Keeping their penchant for close in, relatively small scale warrior-to-warrior engagements and much less of the seafaring raiders that they mostly were. In other words, don't feel confined by my choice of influence for my chapter. Who knows, they could be great allies! :cuss I like the concept of the shield wall - however impractical, this is 40k remember - the emphasis on spears and axes as main weapons and the whole ethos of belief and religion behind it. These concepts are found in alot of cultures, but Vikings and the "Saxons" seem to be at the forefront of my mind. I look at the Dacian peoples, as I stated above, and various other Germanic tribes.. But the Saxons seem to be the better choice to me, so I'm using elements without going totally overboard. Intra-Chapter competition - Warbands vie for the right to answer a call for help; brothers duelling to demand the right to answer these calls. A "hive" concept: each entity - band/company - is seperate and autonomous until the Chapter is threatened or an action requires multiple forces. I like these ideas. Woo, go me! "Fruit" sounds too healthy.. I have a nice round figure to keep up.. ;) I think I can develop the chains into a very central part of the Chapter; ritual and ceremony, iconography and symbolism and even combat.. But is "chains" enough of a theme? I don't want the "Saxons in space" thing going on, as I'll pick some other characteristics from other historical factions and periods to use too.. So are chains enough to unify them? pardon the pun. I have this picture of this archaic longhall in the middle of nowhere with sections of broken chains fastened to the walls in rememberance of brothers lost.. Maybe acting as some sort of spiritual pilgramage? As well, I have an idea that the warband of the Chief who becomes High Chief is is full of the largest Astartes, all blonde for example, similar to the Varangian Guard of Byzantine Emperors. EDIT: Couple extra parts under the potential revisions section. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645381 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 First I'd just like to say that I find it amuzing that a quote I made in another thread is dragged in here with no real reason behind it. Also it was taken completely out of context even in the original thread. CJJ, since you're not a D&D nerd as you say, here is a Kyton (or Chain Devil). http://images.wikia.com/forgottenrealms/images/f/f2/Chaindevil.jpg Not sure if that's the imagery you want for your chapter, but you can modify the concept to fit as you desire. As to the overall concept, I'm getting a Biker Gang vibe (someone else mentioned it as well). Not a bad vibe, very original. I don't really see anything I can add at the moment, but I'll keep an eye on these guys. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645474 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 That is awesome.. I must delve into D&D! I don't see alot of the biker vibe, to be honest.. Except the each disperate element that makes the whole. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645494 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 That is awesome.. I must delve into D&D! I don't see alot of the biker vibe, to be honest.. Except the each disperate element that makes the whole. Well after playing for 30 years, I can tell you D&D is well worth it ... but stay away from 4.0. As for the bikers, I guess its the chains and just overall feel I got. I'm not suggesting you go that way of course, just a thought. I also got a Mad Max feel from it too, but not as much. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645508 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 The struggle at the moment, given the nature of the ideas is the lack of a single unifying concept. The chain is central to the natives, which in turn is absorbed into the Chapter but they turn it on it's head; because they are more than just Men, they end up forging their chains for each piece of service and they are only broken when they die. Alot of this will come from the culture of the as yet to be named planet, such as the beliefs and the way they operate and are organised, but the question is how to make it believeable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645512 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Thoughts for Chapter Symbol/Badge. http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c162/ecritter/3901698113614040_1.jpg http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c162/ecritter/Chains-Skull.png Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645531 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 The first is very Ghostrider.. the Marvel cartoon version, not the Nic Cage one. The second.. I like, but I'm not sure how I'd fit it in. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645532 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 The first is very Ghostrider.. the Marvel cartoon version, not the Nic Cage one. The second.. I like, but I'm not sure how I'd fit it in. I can most likely do better when they develop some more. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645534 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 The first is very Ghostrider.. the Marvel cartoon version, not the Nic Cage one. The second.. I like, but I'm not sure how I'd fit it in. I can most likely do better when they develop some more. I knew there was a reason I keep you around... :P That said, I actually rather pressingly need a paint scheme for them.. A Termie I commisioned is going to represent these dudes. Is it me, or is that rubbish? Stupid question :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645543 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Guess I was working on one at the same time. Yours looks good, but not complete. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645564 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heru Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Aww so you aren't going to re-use the scheme from the IRs? :( EDIT: Next person who doesn't use the painter background grid is getting flailed! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645568 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 Aww so you aren't going to re-use the scheme from the IRs? :( I considered it, but thought it might be a bit too dull for these dudes. Considered a splash of colour but apparently my all over orange wasn't met with approval :( Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645573 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecritter Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Aww so you aren't going to re-use the scheme from the IRs? :( I considered it, but thought it might be a bit too dull for these dudes. Considered a splash of colour but apparently my all over orange wasn't met with approval :( I came on an posted before yours even started loading ... I did edit once I saw yours. You should have left them up, they looked good too. I did my scheme based loosely on your IR design. Next person who doesn't use the painter background grid is getting flailed! I never use the grid ... seems like a waste to me. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645577 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heru Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Aww so you aren't going to re-use the scheme from the IRs? :( I considered it, but thought it might be a bit too dull for these dudes. Considered a splash of colour but apparently my all over orange wasn't met with approval :( OR (Eagle is bronze) OR Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645579 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Juan Juarez Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645587 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heru Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Good enough, now onwards vile heathen! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/221373-a-final-stand/page/2/#findComment-2645589 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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