Phosis Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Well. Can they? :) I tried to search for it, but I fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Since they are not allowed to shoot when they use HI, I would think they can't use fleet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phosis Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 Great thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Whereas I, on the other hand, would say they can. What's the difference between a unit that can't shoot (due to HI) and a unit with no ranged weapons? If you have no ranged weapons you cannot choose to shoot, ergo you cannot choose to run instead of shooting? Ah, but I look at the entry for it now, and it would've prevented this topic in the first place (read your codex!): "...the Vanguard Veteran squad cannot shoot (or run) that turn..." Since Fleet is an add-on to Run, if you can't Run, you can't Fleet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 Shrike doesnt have heroic inervention anyway, so by attaching them you would lose it IIRC.. if your including shrike in the army just go with a decent alpha strike (turn one assault) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 GC is correct; re-read the HI rule. The vanguard cannot use HI if an IC is attached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleon Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 I may be wrong, but our Raven Guard player has Shrike giving Fleet as chapter tactics, not by joinng the unit, so HI & fleet is still an option. Personally i don't think you should as its dubious wether you can or not, so play it safe. I can see why they didn't say you can't shoot or run in HI as mosy vanguard can't run and assault anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Yes, the Vanguard can use fleet without Shrike attqached, but no, they would still not be allowed to run (or fleet) after doing a heroic intervention drop, as per the 'Heroic Intervention' rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBMAKENZIE Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 GC is correct; re-read the HI rule. The vanguard cannot use HI if an IC is attached. What about if the squad Deep Struck and then Shrike hoped within 2 and joined up they could then assault so long as they didnt shoot chouldn't they? Since HI is a part of the Deep Strike process. (Ie: Its basically a special form of Deep Strike you declare before using. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 You could potentially argue that that would be within the spirit of the rule (though it hardly makes a difference whether Shrike was part of the squad or whether he merely assaulted the same unit that turn, since the enemy attacks would be split between teh squad and Shrike either way. The only instance where it would matter would be if either Shrike or teh Vanguard Veterans would not be able to make contact with the enemy otherwise.), but the 'Heroic Intervention' rule plainly states that the ability cannot be used if an Independent Character has joined the squad, without specifying that the Character would have to have deep struck with the squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBMAKENZIE Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 but the 'Heroic Intervention' rule plainly states that the ability cannot be used if an Independent Character has joined the squad, without specifying that the Character would have to have deep struck with the squad. Yes but I guess thats my point. Vanguard Deep Strikes and Activates HI because it needs to be declared at the moment of DS. After Shrike Joins the squad. After that they assault. At time of Activation The squad could legally HI. They then have simultaneously given up their shooting for the turn to do it anyway. If you choose to HI and end up out of range you still cant shoot for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Vanguard Deep Strikes and Activates HI because it needs to be declared at the moment of DS.After Shrike Joins the squad. After that they cannot assault, because an independent character has joined the Vanguard Veteran squad. That is per the letter of the rule. It does not matter that it had already been declared previously. If an independent character has joined the squad then the ability cannot be used. Declaring an action does not mean that it will be performed or it can be attempted. Assault moves are declared at the beginning of the Assault phase, but you are only allowed to measure the distance when the move is to be made, and if the enemy happens to be out of range, no assault move is done. The unit may have forgone shooting (rapid fire and heavy weapons) or running so they would be allowed to assault, but they may still not be able to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raven guard 1369 Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Just have shrike assault the same unit. Sure he's vulnerable and alone if he doesn't make it. But seriously if you have shrike just infiltrate or outflank your vets and hit them hard first turn or whenever they come in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Ah, of course...I forgot that was Shrike's Chapter tactics. That said, Legatus is on point here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.