Grey Knight Rumors Thread

[kiwitexansfan]

I think there should be a limit on taking daemonhosts with GK. That would be common sense at its most basic.

[Marmande]

I'd say the Terminators analogy is a bad one, considering the relative points cost of the unit, and that, like Sanguinary Guard and Death Company, they tend to become very expensive, so smaller units are preferred. But, we'll just have to wait and see.

[boreas]

Katie Drake over a HO did say that doomfists granted St10 to the NDK. I wonder if the Nemesis Greatsword will grant +1 to the NDK's invul. save? Because it would keep a doomfist and we'd end up with a St10 2+/3++ MC!? Madness!

 

Phil

[Gentlemanloser]

I'd trade an extra attack (from having two doomfists) for that! :(

[jimbo1701]

Katie Drake over a HO did say that doomfists granted St10 to the NDK. I wonder if the Nemesis Greatsword will grant +1 to the NDK's invul. save? Because it would keep a doomfist and we'd end up with a St10 2+/3++ MC!? Madness!

 

Phil

 

 

That's that cleared up at least - I was the person who asked her just so we could clarify. Good point about the sword also - my earlier statement as to how on the surface the DK wasn't so overpowered seems to now be slipping away.........

[raverrn]

Simple until this book is in my hands I think Tzeentch is involved. Consorting with xenos (harlequins extreme old fluff kinda yes( what am I saying kill them!) and Daemon hosts running around with chapter 666. :rolleyes: !!!

Looking around the discusions here and just on Dakka OMG serious under pricing seems to be happening.

Fluff curruption that leads me believe Matt Ward is infact the secret love child of majority share holder in GW.

 

As the fluff (finally) moves into the 42nd Mellinium, GW keeps reviving old fluff. Just in my once-over I saw conversion beamers, rad grenades, references to most (if not all) GK wearing terminator armor, Joakero, all these things hail from 2nd ed. What's to say the Harlequin fluff isn't back, as well?

 

And that's not counting fringe stuff like Sensei, Psilencers as Kai guns, references to inquisitorial grudges and rivalries...

[raverrn]

Katie Drake over a HO did say that doomfists granted St10 to the NDK. I wonder if the Nemesis Greatsword will grant +1 to the NDK's invul. save? Because it would keep a doomfist and we'd end up with a St10 2+/3++ MC!? Madness!

 

Phil

 

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say there's no way GW would make a big, tough, spammable monster like that with a 3++. More likely it works like a Wraithsword and re-rolls hits. The question is what does the hammer do? Daemonbane and THammer rules seem a bit weak for the points.

[boreas]

Ha! It will be a St10 T7 2+/3++ MC this edition so that everyone buys 3 kits. Then, in the next codex, it's going to be St5 T5 2+/5++ for 20pts more :lol:

 

Phil

[soots]

quoting katie drake from heresy:

"The Grey Knights don't have a lot of heavy duty anti-tank equipment. Things like lascannons, multi-meltas and so on are less common here than with other armies. They make up for it by fielding a ton of weapons that are easily able to suppress enemy vehicles (mostly psycannons as well as things like assault cannons on Stormravens, Land Raiders and even Razorbacks should they wish). It's possible to field multiple units of Henchmen with meltaguns if the player takes Coteaz. Chimeras and Rhinos are as good for Grey Knights as they are for Guard and Marines, so it isn't too difficult to get units into melta range.

 

So mostly, heavy duty anti-tank will be relatively rare and expensive for Grey Knights due to the platforms that these weapons are mounted on, but Knights can field lots of the slightly less destructive weapons, so it all balances out.

 

EDIT: Thought I posted this earlier, but the stats for psycannons and incinerators are as follows:

 

Psycannon

Range 24" S7 AP4 Assault 2 Rending or Range 36" S7 AP4 Heavy 4 Rending

 

Incinerator

Range Template S6 AP4 Assault 1"

[Vindicatus]

I kind of choke at the idea that people assume that things like assault cannons, psycannons, anything a SR can equip, or the numerous options we have don't fall into line with a typical 'anti-tank' weapon. I'm thinking that we'll have a lot easier time popping vehicles (or at least keeping them busy/pinned/whatever) than someone trucking numerous lascannons. Sure, the psycannon is 2S less than a lascannon, but there are 3 additional shots for a chance to rend, same with the assault cannon at S6.

 

Considering the options we have, the mobility of the Stormraven, and the fact that we can dropkick a dreadknight just about the length of the playing field and well into striking range of hidden artillery, covered tanks, etc, I'm not worried in the slightest.

[boreas]

A 180pts 5 GK w/4 psycannons should rend about twice. So, at 36", you can effectively suppress or even destroy a LR. Otherwise, it can still offer very nice anti-infantry. Add in the mix a DK and a LR with assault cannon and multi-melta and you already have a better amount of AT than we have right now!

 

Phil

[Vindicatus]

Exactly my point. I'm not buying this 'GK have no definitive AT weapons' BS that people keep slinging.

 

I said it once, and I'll say it again for good measure : the Grey Knights were designed in such a way to where you have to think outside of the box, at least in this case, they're keeping true to that. No, you don't have a clear-cut anti-vehicle unit out there, but the GK were designed with mobility and versatility in mind; that means that, given the weapons at hand, even LR's and monoliths will be given a run for their money, making our opponent think twice as to which unit to shoot at, where to move, or to stay at arm's reach. I love the fact that we have a tactically sound alternative to the lack of meltas/missile launchers/lascannon spam so many other lists see (*coughSpaceWolvescough*).

[Gentlemanloser]

Assault Cannons were better at Lascannons for popping most armour values, if not all.

 

I'd trade 1 attack for +1S.

 

And as I've mentioned before, we can take many more Psycannons than Marines could ever hope to get Assault Cannons.

 

As for lack of Lascannons, maybe the Rending Lascannons of the Weaponsmiths are being forgotten. :) Potentially 12 per group. That's a lot of 'heavy duty anti tank' if Psycannons don't float your boat. ;)

 

I've been umm-ing and ahh-ing over what I'd use for a home objective holder. Base Purgation Squad with 4 Psycannons? Or Combat Squaded Purifier Squad with 4 Psycanons. I tihnk in the end, the Purgation Squad wins out, as I can plop the objective out of LoS behind something, and still have the Purgation Squad sling shots at anything in 36" range.

[jimbo1701]

I've asked this question to KD over on Heresy, does anyone here have any input or thoughts as to what the case may be?

 

Thanks again for your replies KD. Think I'm starting to get a feel for how the DK operates now, but there's still one point that confuses me. It starts with 2 nemesis doomfists, but can upgrade one to a nemesis daemonhammer, for XX pts, or to a nemesis greatsword for XX pts.

 

1. Now, if the greatsword works like a nemesis force sword, then presumably it ups the IV save by 1, at the sacrifice of using the base strength of the unit rather than the s10 of the nemesis doomfist. Fair trade, BUT, what then is the point of a nemesis daemonhammer on this unit, as it can't exceed s10 by adding +1 to the S of the unit.

 

2. Has everything with the word 'nemesis' in it got the force weapon rule, so for example does this allow a dreadnought/knight with a 'nemesis' doomfist to instant kill anything T6 and above using it's one psychic power? (in the case of the knight)

 

3. Following on from that, how do nemesis weapons work in a normal squad? something like, they all use their force weapons as normal PWs, but if the squad leader hasn't used a psychic power (i.e. hammerhand) then they can elect to make their weapon ONLY a force weapon, as befitting the brotherhood of psykers rule?

[Valerian]

EDIT: Thought I posted this earlier, but the stats for psycannons and incinerators are as follows:

 

Psycannon

Range 24" S7 AP4 Assault 2 Rending or Range 36" S7 AP4 Heavy 4 Rending

 

Incinerator

Range Template S6 AP4 Assault 1"

 

I'm loving the new weapon stats; here's to Relentless GKT with Psycannons again, too! I made the recommendation to make them Rending years ago to solve Grey Knight anti-tank shortcomings; thanks for listening! Now if only Katie, or someone else, would tell us what the hell a Psilencer is/does.

 

I also noticed in the leak that Dreadnoughts couldn't upgrade their Storm Bolters to Incinerators, so I hope that got fixed.

 

 

V

[Slind]

I was reading through the fluff on how Terminators (troops) are armed from the "leaked codex". IF this thing is close to real, then this line does not bode well for the idea that a Storm Bolter can be used as a pistol

 

Some prefer the cruching force of a Nemesis Deamonhammer, other the flurry of attack, grranted by a matching pair of Nemesis Falchions

 

Falchions seem redundant if a Storm Bolter is considered a pistol

[boreas]

I think falchions were rumored to be "count as lighning claws" no?

 

Phil

[The Paladin]

One would assume that the +1 "counts as pistol" is probably not going to hold true for GKT's. This goes against the whole "termies can't have pistols" thing w/ the other codices.

 

But, then again, the "leaked" codex also mentions having grenades along w/ TDA.

[Marmande]

Exactly my point. I'm not buying this 'GK have no definitive AT weapons' BS that people keep slinging.

 

I said it once, and I'll say it again for good measure : the Grey Knights were designed in such a way to where you have to think outside of the box, at least in this case, they're keeping true to that. No, you don't have a clear-cut anti-vehicle unit out there, but the GK were designed with mobility and versatility in mind; that means that, given the weapons at hand, even LR's and monoliths will be given a run for their money, making our opponent think twice as to which unit to shoot at, where to move, or to stay at arm's reach. I love the fact that we have a tactically sound alternative to the lack of meltas/missile launchers/lascannon spam so many other lists see (*coughSpaceWolvescough*).

 

But but but where are the big numbers? :P

 

;)

[boreas]

Anyhow, Katie Drake at HO (which seems to have have better access to a recent list) say that SB don't count as pistol, so that point might be moot ;)

 

Phil

[Slind]

Anyhow, Katie Drake at HO (which seems to have have better access to a recent list) say that SB don't count as pistol, so that point might be moot :(

 

I just knew it was too god to be true. But before i go drown my sorrow in a keg of beer, could you point us to where she states that SB's are not pistols? (I cannot seem to find it over at HO)

[Justcar]

Anyhow, Katie Drake at HO (which seems to have have better access to a recent list) say that SB don't count as pistol, so that point might be moot :(

 

Phil

 

LIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Well, I guess that just makes purifiers even better ;)

 

Say hello to 30 power weapon attacks!!

 

But, I hope SSGKs get SB pistols! They only have one attack to begin with! The only real advantage they have in comparison to termies is their extra mobility. I really love the idea of SSGKs and hope they don't get nerf'd. As it stands, if teleporters make them Fast Attacks AND they have only 2 attacks on the charge, then I see their use being more limited. If they're fast attack, they're competing against a Storm Raven! If they only have 2 attacks on the charge, then they are less effective and less viable!

 

C'mon GW! Really?

[Oiad]

I just knew it was too god to be true. But before i go drown my sorrow in a keg of beer, could you point us to where she states that SB's are not pistols? (I cannot seem to find it over at HO)

She states it at the bottom of this page. Also disappointed to hear that normal NFWs only give +1 save to those with Invulnerable saves already - so just PWs on PAGKs? The state of this rule regresses each day it seems...

[Gentlemanloser]

Heh, I had a suspicion that's how it would turn out...

 

But I bet the new plastic PAGK mini's come with Swords by default. :tu:

 

I also noticed in the leak that Dreadnoughts couldn't upgrade their Storm Bolters to Incinerators, so I hope that got fixed.

 

Vehicles can purchase Psyflame ammunition. Which I'm assuming will make Flamers ignore Invulnerable Saves (much like I assume Psybolt's will make Bolt guns and Psycannons ignore Invulnerable saves), so that's probably wht the don't get Incinerators. And why the LRR has normal 'Flamestorm' cannons, and not the FW super Incinerator Flamestorms.

[Justcar]

You know... I have my doubts about the lack of pistol SBs...

 

Think about it. Normal termies cost the same as GK termies, but they come equipped with S8 power weapons and storm bolters. The storm bolters cancel each other out, but there is a large gap in killing potential between them. Even factoring in a nemesis daemon hammer and Hammer Hand, there is still a gap. The extra attack provided by this could potentially make up for the Strength gap and the lack of storm shields. An extra attack for the termies makes sense.

 

Of course i am speaking as someone who wanted my GKSSs to wipe out ten man marine units in a single bound! :tu: (and they should based on fluff!)