Lord_Starscream Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 I've been reading tons of books lately, Chaos related, and been looking into my old model collection, remembering the good old days really of Chaos Space Marines. Remembering the EoT Campaign, hell, its probably what prompted me to join this site. Especially considering I play Orks now more than anything. This isn't meant to be a rant, or to start a flame war, its to ask a question to people just simply and honestly. I remember the excessively powerful builds of the 3.5 codex, I remember how you could be quite the sneak and quite tricky with it certainly. But today I really decided to take a hard look at the current Space Wolves Codex, and the current Blood Angels codex, and I really had to sit there and ask myself. Was Codex: Chaos really all that powerful in 3.5? Certainly for its era it was tough, but in all honesty when I look at the monster builds and synergies you can build in those two dexes, I can't help but just go "huh... and people thought we were overpowered". I wonder, do people think that the 3.5 Chaos Codex would still be overpowered in today's metagame? Would it still be so bad? I personally think no. I'm just curious what you guys think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khestra the Unbeheld Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Personally, I would say Chaos 3.5 was too early for its time. The editions it was played under weren't really equipped to handle some of the builds it was capable of unless you seriously brought your A game against them, which in my mind was what Chaos was there for: to provide the Top Tier challenge to any army, regardless of faction, by virtue of variable evolution matched to power that could directly challenge the best the Imperium had to offer. Unfortunately, that design paradigm was used to stellar effect and gave it the stigma of being considered overpowered, so it was dropped in the worst piece of timing possible, reconstructed by the worst possible writers, and handed out in what I will go to my grave considering the grossest treachery GW has ever produced. That being said, with the exception of certain points costs and some rules that need updating to 5th Edition, Chaos 3.5 could probably hold its own against the current crop of sickeningly overpowered Codices. :fakenopic: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 The problem was we had 9+ army books in one book, many of them highly customizable and we could literally build all types of lists. Furthermore, all our units could be configured in so many ways, so no one knew quite what to expect. Terminator-wing? check. Fast attack spam? check. Daemon bomb? check. all infiltrating marine horde? check. shooty lists? check. etc. Today we have 1 book, with a few variations of of the same list (i.e. tournaments), and tons of broken units. Back then even the inferior cultists and lowly Horrors+Flamers of Tzeentch saw use due to the way they fit in and had synergy with the rest of the army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 The editions it was played under weren't really equipped to handle some of the builds it was capable of unless you seriously which builds and which dex. nids , eldar , sm [that used a good build] worked just fine . yes WH/DH/necron sucked against chaos but those dex were weak even when they were made . IG did well against chaos too [the trait version at least]. + when saying chaos was too or over the top powerful what do we actualy mean by that . there was 9 legions some hasd 2-3 completly different builds , we may as well be saying 5th ed is broken because the enviroment wasnt ready for BA/SW/SM [and we still would probably have fewer builds then chaos had with 3.5]. chaos was normal . just like now it had tons of units that were overcosted [possessed, termis , chosen , bikes sucked just like they do now even if they were scoring back then etc] , IW were ok [and no the 4 pie plate build was neither good nor the best IW army . more pie plates playing without IW rules was better . you just took an undivided non legion lord] BL was probably the best army out of the dex , + there was tons of tier 2 stuff . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khestra the Unbeheld Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 The editions it was played under weren't really equipped to handle some of the builds it was capable of unless you seriously which builds and which dex. Wasn't referring to Codices, was referring to editions of rules. I agree fully that all the Codices of the time period were capable of fighting 3.5 and doing okay as long as the opponent wasn't fielding a subpar list. I just think that 3.5 was too powerful for the actual game rules to account for just what it could do in the hands of a skilled player; 5th edition has addressed most of the ones that could easily be abused by 3.5 (consolidation from one Assault straight into another being one of them), but of course they stripped the actual Codex of anything abusive before changing the rules so the point is moot. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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