chaplainmeliadus Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Does the Skies of Blood rule mean that passengers in a Stormraven survive if it's blown up when moving flat out? On the page for Fast vehicles it says they may not disembark if has has/will move flat out, and on the separate page for vehicle damage effects it says that any passengers which cannot disembark are destroyed. Stormraven passengers can, of course, make a special disembarkation due the the SoB rule. I'm hoping that the infamous FAQ is a result of the fact that this is printed on two separate, non-adjacent pages, and so the Stormraven is actually well worth the points. Your opinions, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Kezef Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Skies of blood is no help in this case. If you have not deployed before the bird gets blown to hell, you don't get to jump out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Erm - as long as you arent daft enough to shoot the dratted thing down yourself, you're fine. If you move flat out in your player turn, and your StormRaven survives into the start of the enemies turn then you didnt move flat out in the turn in which you are destroyed (assuming he then promptly shoots you down). Rulebook definitions - 'turn' means 'player turn' unless otherwise specified, and fast vehicles moving flat out/passengers auto killed only says 'turn' not 'game turn' (IE: 2 player turns). Hope that helps... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysteriousmaskedmystery Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 if you tried that argument on me i'd laugh at you. you could then argue that all vehicles are auto hit in close combat which is daft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chapter Master Ignis Domus Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Nevertheless, it is the correct argument. Q: What is meant when the term ʻturnʼ is used? (p9)A: Whenever the word turn is used it means player turn. Otherwise it will clearly state game turn. In a complete game turn both players get a player turn. Hence one game turn will comprise two player turns. Q: If a transport vehicle is destroyed in the same turn as it moved flat out what happens to any embarked models? (p70) A: They are removed as casualties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguinarian Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Nevertheless, it is the correct argument. Q: What is meant when the term ʻturnʼ is used? (p9)A: Whenever the word turn is used it means player turn. Otherwise it will clearly state game turn. In a complete game turn both players get a player turn. Hence one game turn will comprise two player turns. Q: If a transport vehicle is destroyed in the same turn as it moved flat out what happens to any embarked models? (p70) A: They are removed as casualties. Devil's Advocate: How then might a vehicle be destroyed in its own turn? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vharing Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I bet there is an errata on this, and if there isnt there will be one soon. I would have to say that Sanguinarian is right though. It would make no sense otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igotsmeakabob!! Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Nevertheless, it is the correct argument. Q: What is meant when the term ʻturnʼ is used? (p9)A: Whenever the word turn is used it means player turn. Otherwise it will clearly state game turn. In a complete game turn both players get a player turn. Hence one game turn will comprise two player turns. Q: If a transport vehicle is destroyed in the same turn as it moved flat out what happens to any embarked models? (p70) A: They are removed as casualties. Devil's Advocate: How then might a vehicle be destroyed in its own turn? Flat out movement + rolling a 1 on terrain = destroyed. Or just scattering onto your own vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Or Death or Glory succeeding on a Tank Shock. On Edit: Wow. Time for me to turn in and lay off the booze; "Thank Shot" indeed. Further Edit: Quick question. What does this mean for Skimmers and their 4+ Cover? I don't have the BRB on me; is it worded to allow the Skimmer save thanks to something like "If it moved flat-out on it's previous turn"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 mysteriousmasked... Go have another look at the rules for attacking vehicles in cc. In this case, the devil is very much in the detail. Actual wording is more important than misremembered 'thats how it works'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother-Captain Devlonir Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Further Edit: Quick question. What does this mean for Skimmers and their 4+ Cover? I don't have the BRB on me; is it worded to allow the Skimmer save thanks to something like "If it moved flat-out on it's previous turn"? Indeed, the wording for the 4+ skimmer cover and moving vehicles 6+ melee to hit are "moved in it's previous movement phase/turn" The whole thing with Flat Out and people inside being destroyed is only if you take risks in your own turn, so you tank shock or shoot a scattering weapon close to the Flat Out vehicle or Tank shock going Flat Out. As this was a FAQ and not an errata it was merely an explaination of the rules that already existed concerning disembarking from a vehicle that moved flat out that turn and the possible endings of those risks (forced disembarking) If you go down the road that a vehicle that moved Flat Out the turn before also gets all it's passengers killed you completely destroy every fast moving transport army (like Dark Eldar, Eldar and Blood Angels) over a wrong and shortsighted reading of the rules. PS. There already was a huge discussion over this on the Official Rules forum directly after the FAQ. Let's not redo it here. PPS. I tried looking for the thread, been too long ago already it seems.. Maybe a Mod can help with linking it here to please stop this discussion before it becomes a horror thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Hmm... One more quick question, BC. I think it's on-topic-ish. At what speed are Drop Pods considered when they enter play? Cruising, I'd wager? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother-Captain Devlonir Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Not sure on that, but I think no speed is involved in them as their rules describe exactly what models embarked are and aren't allowed to do when disembarking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igotsmeakabob!! Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Hmm... One more quick question, BC. I think it's on-topic-ish. At what speed are Drop Pods considered when they enter play? Cruising, I'd wager? 12" Can't fire. They're immobilized when they land though, so it's auto-hits on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaplainmeliadus Posted February 22, 2011 Author Share Posted February 22, 2011 Deep Striking vehicles count as moving at Cruising Speed, so unless a drop-pod is fast (which I don't remember it being) then surely it cannot fire? Unless being immobilised counteracts this as immobile is technicaly stationary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Deep Striking vehicles count as moving at Cruising Speed, so unless a drop-pod is fast (which I don't remember it being) then surely it cannot fire? Unless being immobilised counteracts this as immobile is technicaly stationary. Drop pods are not fast and can not fire when they deep strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaplainmeliadus Posted February 24, 2011 Author Share Posted February 24, 2011 Also, if a squad disembarks using Skies of Blood, may they assault? It says they disemabark as though they Deep Striked. Is this just to explain the mechanics of it, or cVn they only assault if they're vanguard, despite the Assault Vehicle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Also, if a squad disembarks using Skies of Blood, may they assault? It says they disemabark as though they Deep Striked. Is this just to explain the mechanics of it, or cVn they only assault if they're vanguard, despite the Assault Vehicle? Even Vanguard can't assault on a skies of blood. Vanguard rules state when the deep strike from reserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaplainmeliadus Posted February 24, 2011 Author Share Posted February 24, 2011 Ah? Didn't spot that. Much apreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguinarian Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Also, if a squad disembarks using Skies of Blood, may they assault? It says they disemabark as though they Deep Striked. Is this just to explain the mechanics of it, or cVn they only assault if they're vanguard, despite the Assault Vehicle? Even Vanguard can't assault on a skies of blood. Vanguard rules state when the deep strike from reserve. Gotta read the entire Skies of Blood paragraph on, pg. 38. The last sentence states, "Note that models that disembark in this manner cannot assault on the turn they do so." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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