razorramon31 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Just a few questions: Can an IC ride in vehicles with unit if they are not attached to that unit? Example: Terminator squad inside a LRC. squad has an IC attached to squad, and another IC there is enough room to fit two more characters. can another IC be allowed to join and ride in the vehicle without having to join the unit inside? Ive heard about EC being able to be inside a drop pod even though at he cannot join squads............... a bit of a bizarre question. where do you measure for the assault on a LR. Does the assault ramp increase the distance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Can an IC ride in vehicles with unit if they are not attached to that unit? Example: Terminator squad inside a LRC. squad has an IC attached to squad, and another IC there is enough room to fit two more characters. can another IC be allowed to join and ride in the vehicle without having to join the unit inside? No; if he's not attached to a unit then an IC is his own separate unit, and you can not have more than one unit in a transport. a bit of a bizarre question. where do you measure for the assault on a LR. Does the assault ramp increase the distance? Not entirely sure what you're asking here, but I'll do my best to answer. If you're assaulting out of a Land Raider, the unit still has to disembark in the movement phase, and then they assault following the normal rules. If another unit is assaulting the Lad Raider, then it just has to get into contact with the hull. In either case, the assault ramp does not change the assault distance in any way, it merely allows the unit within the Land Raider to ignore the normal restrictions on assaulting out of transports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shatter Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 *snip* Can an IC ride in vehicles with unit if they are not attached to that unit? Example: Terminator squad inside a LRC. squad has an IC attached to squad, and another IC there is enough room to fit two more characters. can another IC be allowed to join and ride in the vehicle without having to join the unit inside? *snip* You can have as many IC rule bearing models as you like in a transport as space permits. You may only have one unit in a transport. Some units, that can only ever be a unit of one, may never have ICs attached; for example, Mephiston and the Sanguinor. (Special characters without the IC rule.) Here's a ridiculous and excessive example from C:BA LRCrusader 3 death company models (unit) 1 TDA librarian (IC) priest (IC) Chaplain (IC) 2nd priest (IC) Captain TDA (IC) Corbulo (IC) 3rd Priest (IC) 4th Priest TDA (IC) 5th priest TDA (IC) As you can see, the ICs seriously outnumber the models in the unit. Things you can do. The DC can disembark alone. The DC can disembark with an IC attached. The DC can disembark with any and all ICs attached. The DC can stay inside and some or all the ICs can disembark in or out of coherency with one another to form any number of target-able units. The DC can disembark with IC(s) attached and another group of just ICs can also disembark outside of coherency with the DC thereby forming a separate unit... space permitting around the LRaider. In short, ICs are only considered attached by being in coherency with a squad when exiting the vehicle, and ICs without a squad effectively form a unit of their own whether it be a unit of one or as much as 11 ICs (C:BA). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Just a few questions: Can an IC ride in vehicles with unit if they are not attached to that unit? Example: Terminator squad inside a LRC. squad has an IC attached to squad, and another IC there is enough room to fit two more characters. can another IC be allowed to join and ride in the vehicle without having to join the unit inside? Ive heard about EC being able to be inside a drop pod even though at he cannot join squads............... a bit of a bizarre question. where do you measure for the assault on a LR. Does the assault ramp increase the distance? An IC must join a squad to enter a transport with them. The EC can join squads, just not command squads if I recall correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 This is weird and semantic and I think you're confusing yourself on a few points. - You can attach more than one IC to a unit. So, for instance, a unit of terminators with a Captain and a Chaplain is a single unit if they're all in coherency; this includes being in a transport together. - ICs and units in a transport can disembark separately or piecemeal if they choose (refer to the transport section of the brb); in short, not everybody has to get out when the Terminators disembark, so that Sanguine Priest can hide in the Land Raider while the Termies come out to pound on some faces with their trusted Chaplain. Do these two facts answer your first query? =) As for the assault ramp increasing assault range, it does in a way: the models disembark up to 2" from the ramp, then get a 6" assault move. This comes up more often if the LR hasn't moved this turn and the guys inside disembark and move their 6": I've seen people measure 8" from the ramp to disembark/place their guys. This is kosher as it really just saves a step, and the marines aren't really going to get anywhere they couldn't had they done the two step disembark and then move thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acebaur Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I'll confirm, the EC is only restricted against joining Command squads. He may join any other squad in the codex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I'll confirm, the EC is only restricted against joining Command squads. He may join any other squad in the codex. Sorry, what does "EC" stand for? I'm drawing a blank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acebaur Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 No worries, it stand for Emperor's Champion. Our required character of awesomeness ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Ooooooohh yea. Sorry about that. Embarassing for me, really; my former club has two devoted BT players *and* my army's current color scheme (first army I ever painted, before I knew anything about the lore) gets mistaken for them all the time. The red trim isn't enough to distinguish them. Doesn't help that I inadvertently painted an EC model as a vanguard sergeant with Relic Blade. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venemox Posted March 27, 2011 Share Posted March 27, 2011 Can an IC ride in vehicles with unit if they are not attached to that unit? Example: Terminator squad inside a LRC. squad has an IC attached to squad, and another IC there is enough room to fit two more characters. can another IC be allowed to join and ride in the vehicle without having to join the unit inside? Well, as I interpret the BBB (page 66)... "A transport may carry a single infantry unit and/or and number of independent characters 9as long as they count as infantry), up to a total of models equal to the vehicle's transport capacity." I don't see anywhere where it says those IC's have to be attached to the single unit of infantry, and it does specify 'and/or'. So, I think shatter's example of 'ridiculosity' involving ICs is correct. If your EC ends up in a transport with a Command Squad, he must simply be more than 2" from them upon disembarking, as per the BBB FAQ (page 3). " Q: If an Independent Character is unable to end his move over 2” away from a friendly unit that he cannot join, for example he has exited a vehicle after it has moved, can he be placed? (p48) A: Yes, simply place him as far away from the unit(s) that he cannot join as he is allowed to go. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted March 27, 2011 Share Posted March 27, 2011 A single unit. An IC, by itself, is a unit. So if an IC was in there, and a unit of infantry was in there, youd have two units. Thus, you cannot have him in their unattached. You can have him in their solo. He doesnt have to get out, or get in, with the unit- but while hes in there it is one unit because there isnt another option. *Disclaimer- unless its apocalypse. Then super-heavy vehicles have different rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattleDV8 Posted March 27, 2011 Share Posted March 27, 2011 I don't see anywhere where it says those IC's have to be attached to the single unit of infantry, and it does specify 'and/or'. So, I think shatter's example of 'ridiculosity' involving ICs is correct. If your EC ends up in a transport with a Command Squad, he must simply be more than 2" from them upon disembarking, as per the BBB FAQ (page 3). BRB pg. 67 Independent Characters Embarking and Disembarking "If an independent character (or even more than one) and a unit are both embarked in the same vehicle, they are automatically joined,.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venemox Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 See, if SeattleDV8's post had been second, or if someone else would have quoted the rule book (chapter and verse always preferred), this would be a much shorter thread. @Grey Mage - MyI disagree with your semantic evaluation of 'single infantry unit and/or and number of independent characters' meaning they have to be joined. But that goes back to 'meaning what you write as compared to writing what you mean' for GW. The quote from page 67 is far more clearly written than the one from 66. Since I missed the page 67 item, I revise my stance as follows: The EC may not embark a transport with the CC, since they would automatically join, and are prohibited from joining by the C:BT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Valerius Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 Also, the FAQ entry you mentioned isn't talking about the scenario of an EC and a squad being in a transport. I'm pretty sure (99%) that it means disembarking near a squad which the vehicle moved towards. Can't move to not join the unit, since the transport moved, so place the IC as far away as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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