shatter Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 So i made some objective markers. They're manholes essentially. Flat. Are objective markers terrain by default? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 So i made some objective markers. They're manholes essentially. Flat. Are objective markers terrain by default? id say no, there are no rules to cover objectives and since they are 'markers' i.e something pretty to establish a point of interest then its logical to assume they play no part in the battle.. they technically dont exist.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron-Daemon Forge Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Object are just marker & have no in effect to the game. Other than mark where the Object is for reason of the mission, they do not block line of sight, do not give cover save or count as terrain. IP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 That's not to say that they can't be terrain if you've chosen a piece of terrain, or part of some terrain, as an objective. If I were you, I'd be tempted to count your manhole covers as dangerous terrain to represent the possility of falling in if a model stands on it :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBMAKENZIE Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Related question. Do you measure Objectives top down? Only per level? In a 3D bubble? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShinyRhino Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Related question. Do you measure Objectives top down? Only per level? In a 3D bubble? 3D bubble. Keeps buttheads from placing an objective behind a 8" tall building, and then claiming it with a skimmer on the roof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 That's not to say that they can't be terrain if you've chosen a piece of terrain, or part of some terrain, as an objective. If I were you, I'd be tempted to count your manhole covers as dangerous terrain to represent the possility of falling in if a model stands on it :P actually i dont think this is right, the battlefield and terrain set up is handled before you roll for mission.. you couldnt put another peice of terrain down outside of the appropriate 'phase'. im sure you could houe rule it, but id call foul if someone tried it. after all with my t-fires and snipers i could make a objective out of an old ruin, and set it up where i wished, and then bolster it.. the above would lead the whole process open to abuse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I've always played objectives as basically invisible. Just easier that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShinyRhino Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 That's not to say that they can't be terrain if you've chosen a piece of terrain, or part of some terrain, as an objective. If I were you, I'd be tempted to count your manhole covers as dangerous terrain to represent the possility of falling in if a model stands on it :P actually i dont think this is right, the battlefield and terrain set up is handled before you roll for mission.. you couldnt put another peice of terrain down outside of the appropriate 'phase'. im sure you could houe rule it, but id call foul if someone tried it. after all with my t-fires and snipers i could make a objective out of an old ruin, and set it up where i wished, and then bolster it.. the above would lead the whole process open to abuse I think the intent was more to use a piece of existing terrain as an objective, not placing new terrain to be one. For example, if you have an ammo crate buried int he rubble of a scenic ruin, it would be acceptabel to select the ammo crate as an objective, instead of placing an actual based objective marker on top of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 That's not to say that they can't be terrain if you've chosen a piece of terrain, or part of some terrain, as an objective. If I were you, I'd be tempted to count your manhole covers as dangerous terrain to represent the possility of falling in if a model stands on it :P actually i dont think this is right, the battlefield and terrain set up is handled before you roll for mission.. you couldnt put another peice of terrain down outside of the appropriate 'phase'. im sure you could houe rule it, but id call foul if someone tried it. after all with my t-fires and snipers i could make a objective out of an old ruin, and set it up where i wished, and then bolster it.. the above would lead the whole process open to abuse I think the intent was more to use a piece of existing terrain as an objective, not placing new terrain to be one. For example, if you have an ammo crate buried int he rubble of a scenic ruin, it would be acceptabel to select the ammo crate as an objective, instead of placing an actual based objective marker on top of it. Exactly as ShinyRhino said. To quote the rulebook you choose a point to be an objective ... by placing a counter on it, choosing a detail of a terrain feature, or any other method that is equally clear Objectives also "may not be in impassable terrain". So as long as you have a point on the table that models can reach, it's a legal objective. The rulebook does state an objective is a "point" on the table, which is quite a loose definition (deliberately so I should imagine), but I would venture that they intended objectives not to be too large. As with all things, so long as your opponent agrees, a small terrain piece could easily be used as an objective. I know it's not strictly in the rules, but in a friendly setting who gives a rat's gluteus maximus? Personally, I prefer objectives to be actual things on the battlefield rather than some abstract point in space. Adds to the narrative being played out I reckon. In fact, my mate and I tend to decide what terrain peices would make cool objectives to fight over before we do any terrain placement, then create a logically-structured battlefield that looks like it would be a place that actually exists. This is obviously not strictly within the rules. Well, apart from the most important rule, but you know what I mean... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 ah i see, sorry thought you were advocating the 'markers' be terrain.. no the other is perfectly fine, the point of interest can be anywhere or anything not impassible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 ah i see, sorry thought you were advocating the 'markers' be terrain.. no the other is perfectly fine, the point of interest can be anywhere or anything not impassible Well, I kind of was speculating that the OP's manhole covers could be called dangerous dangerous terrain as the thought of a model in his moment of triumph falling down to his doom amused me :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shatter Posted February 23, 2011 Author Share Posted February 23, 2011 Okee, so I'm free to have models DS directly on them. Thank you very muchly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanhausen Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Its quite odd to find objectives out in the open... at least in my area. We tend to prefer placing them in cover so we can hug them comfortably :( But usually markers are either small bits or bases with some ornament... very seldomly do they have actual scenary on them. And no, they do not count as terrain, as GC08 and Shiny have pointed out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twisted100 Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 it doesn't matter how you treat objectives as long as you and your opponent agree before the game. i once played a game where they were impassable.(made it kind of hard to run stuff over with a deff rolla) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djhg Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Its quite odd to find objectives out in the open... at least in my area. We tend to prefer placing them in cover so we can hug them comfortably B) You lack a strong Tau presence then... When I use my Tau I put markers in the open on my opponents side of the table forcing him to place his away from the 'good' terrain bits :devil: Then I shoot them to bits with no cover saves. The default objective markers are little transparent green flags, so not terrain. Lots of people use things up to a 40mm base as markers too. It's really up to you and your mates as to what the marker is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellios Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Its quite odd to find objectives out in the open... at least in my area. We tend to prefer placing them in cover so we can hug them comfortably ;) You lack a strong Tau presence then... When I use my Tau I put markers in the open on my opponents side of the table forcing him to place his away from the 'good' terrain bits :mellow: Then I shoot them to bits with no cover saves. The default objective markers are little transparent green flags, so not terrain. Lots of people use things up to a 40mm base as markers too. It's really up to you and your mates as to what the marker is. Or you sit vindicator in ruins and then put objective in front of vindicator in the open... Alsoi when using eldar lists like the Tau it is nice to have people in the open and I prefer not to ram my grav tanks into trees for objective grabs. Hell even my space wolves have been known to put markers in the open so enemy troops will get shot up by my dakka while my assault troops don't care if the enemy is hiding their objective in a bush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shatter Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 Getting a bit tactical... Anyway. Perhaps this is important.. well, for me to mention it. The BRB mentions in an arguably unrelated section that one cannot bring one's own cover to the table (outside of the board's terrain/scenery). I was wondering if someone that had something that was at first glance very much like a model as it had height and a base and one cannot place models on top of models... and if this was for many a reason why a unit may not DS directly upon it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djhg Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 and if this was for many a reason why a unit may not DS directly upon it. One model/unit is allowed to attempt to Deep Strike onto another model/unit. it's just a really bad idea as you'll end up rolling on the mishap table if you roll 'hit' Codex Tyranids FAQ cleared that up in the amendment for the Mawloc's Terror from the deep rule. So if an objective marker is a model (and agreed before the game that it is) then deep striking onto it is not a good idea. Otherwise the marker is just an indicator of where to measure the 3" bubble from and otherwise counts as the same type of terrain as the marker sits on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 the objective marker has no rules stating its a model or piece of terrain.. In dictionary terms a marker is something used as a mark or indication, in game terms is merely a way of 'marking' a point of interest (objectives).. the marker itself has no other rules.. if it isnt a model and isnt terrain that you can freely DS onto it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 However, the objective can be a point within terrain rather than terrain in and of itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 However, the objective can be a point within terrain rather than terrain in and of itself. absolutely, which given the discussion on DSing, would be the wisest choice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shatter Posted February 26, 2011 Author Share Posted February 26, 2011 So, in essence, one needs to discuss before game if an opponent uses objective markers that are models or model-like if they're considered impassable, like any model is generally. Seems to me this means objective markers do have terrain rules by default, although there's no rules at all that can be used to back this up. I suspect it's the default player assumption and in any and all cases people wont drive vehicles straight through them and so forth because it wont occur to them to treat them as a point when they look like a model. Damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted February 26, 2011 Share Posted February 26, 2011 Seems to me this means objective markers do have terrain rules by default, although there's no rules at all that can be used to back this up. No, objectives are defined in the rulebook as a 'point', which could be a counter, terrain feature, or something else that is clear. They have no terrain rules. They can be a point on some terrain (or indeed a piece of terrain if players so wish), but an objective is not intrinsically treated as terrain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shatter Posted February 27, 2011 Author Share Posted February 27, 2011 My last comment was a bit of an aside as I was kinda 'thinking' 'via text' that the people I meet may think that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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