Drop Pod armies

[Tai'shar]

I've been thinking of converting my Salamander army into a drop pod force but have no experience playing with or against them. I am just wondering what peoples opinion on the impact a drop pod force can make? They been around for a while and there should be some people who have experince playing with and against.

 

I've heard that while they can make a great alpha strike force they are easily counterable due to being a smaller foot army?

Is Rhino based warfare the better option?

Are Dreads neccessary, I would think taking a Sternguard squad would be better to minimise your opponents AT to your now useless drop pods.

[Algesan]

I'd check out the Black Templar forum. My understanding is that except for the Black Templars (who are using a late 4th Ed codex), full pod armies aren't worth it.

[nurglez]

I've been using 3 drop pods in my logan wing army, having between half and 2 thirds of my army in 3 drop pods is interesting, sometimes it works, sometimes I feel I really shouldn't have dropped them where I did, but the only other transport I can take is Landraider, and thats as much as one of my squads, so its either drop pod or foot slog...

 

I think they work best along side other vehicles, dropping down drop pods on the first turn to distract/engage/destroy a particular target while the rest of your things get into position can be very useful, sometimes even worth putting your opponent on the defensive by sacrificing an expensive target (I use logan with 3 termies, he drops in gives friendlies +1 attack, then gets charged by something meaty and goes down with it, or sometimes wins).

[spartan249]

Drop Pod armies are fickle beasts. By the very nature of the army, you're putting a lot more stock in lady luck then you normally would. However, when you do pull off what you want to do, the army can be devastatingly powerful.

 

Some ground rules I try to go with:

 

Equal parts mid range/long range troops to short range killing squads. You don't want more Ironclads/Sternguard squads then you have Tacticals or Thunderfire cannons in pods, as you need options on what you drop, when. You also need units that can provide heavy fire support so you're not completely dead in the water when you face armies that reserve against your pods.

 

Keep those squads cheap. Tactical Squads with a melta gun, missile launcher, and power sword only cost you 225 points and cover all your bases. 2 or 3 of these squads should suffice for your troops section. Ironclads only need their storm bolter replaced by a heavy flamer. That'll make it able to effectively engage any target and keep the price as low as possible, so you can fit as many as possible.

 

Remember how your opponent will react to your pod army and drop accordingly. This is why you'll want equal mid-range/long-range to short range: so you have the option to drop defensively should your opponent decide to reserve. That way, you keep your killing units in reserve, ready to drop on the incoming reserves, thus negating that plan.

 

As for the most debilitating defense against drop pods (which is castling), this is where Thunderfire cannons and long range weapons come in handy. You set up the TFC far away from the castle and lay down suppressing fire, while your long range units set up and do the same. This will most likely force the enemy's castle to disperse to engage your forces, which is when your reserved killers drop in and make their bid.

 

Just about the only real army that will give you huge problem will be IG. Screwing with reserves will complicate your game plan quite a bit.

[waaanial00]

Ok seeing as I have used pods before and the fact that I am currently playing Daemons (who pasically deploy as a Drop Pod army) I feel I might have some content to add.

 

Basically an all pod army isnt going to work especially well. The only things you can deploy via pod are Power Armoured Infantry and Dreadnoughts (which should be armed for close support or assault). However a mainly drop pod force with other deepstriking units has a decent chance.

 

The main thing to remember when planning a deep striking force is making the enemy react to you and trying to control it. Basically you want to draw the enemy to you forcing him into a particular location or draw the enemy away from you forcing them away from a particular location. Either way you should really be trying to stop the enemy from staying still or going exactly where they want to.

 

For this to work you need to think carefully about your first drop, as a Daemon player I can tell you that your initial drop should be:

 

- Resilliant enough to cope with the majority of your enemy shooting at it.

- Agressive enough to make the enemy respond to you

- Mixed up enough to make your enemy have to make some choices (for example they should have to decide whether to move units in to head off your dreadnought or leave them to take down your Sternguard unit).

- A building block for future deployments. Its no good placing a unit down and then not supporting it in future turns (unless it dies horribly and was only there to divert attention).

 

Being in a drop pod means you can be very agressive in your deployment and not suffer mishaps from scattering onto the enemy. This is nice but dont forget that putting your units on their door step is not exactly making them change their battle plan.

 

The rest of the army should be designed to support your initial drop. This means that it should have a counter assault component as well as containing your scoring units. Holding objectives turn 1 is a waste, it locks you down to a very small zone of control and just makes you start thinking defensively from the off. With your drop pods you can easily land your subsequent waves in objective positions later in the game. This is a general rule of thumb however you can probably break up a castle by putting a strong defence around a nearby objective that is close enough to enemy counter assault, they might move some of their forces away to deal with yours.

 

Dont be afraid to take non deep striking units for greater flexibility. Most of the army can be deployed via Deep Strike in some form however things like Predators and Tactical Terminators are decent support units which have a greater impact when deployed normally, also dont discount a unit of inflitrating scouts as they can provide some decent counter assault options to your first drop.

 

Still thats fairly rambling and could do with tidying up, use or discard as necessary.

[Yotakka]

drop pod armies when geared right can work wonders.

 

when it comes to gearing your tac squads you want to double up on special weapons.

take the combi bolter on your sarge to match your flamer/melta/plas.

 

my personal favourite is a dual flamer and no heavy weapon tac squad.

deploy in i perfect circle arround the pod and as close as possible 2 your opponent.

you can dual flame and rapid fire all 10 guys and inflict the same wounds on meq than dual plas

but still be really effective against hoard.

 

in my list i run 20 devs and 30 drop pod tacs and 2 drop pod dreads (mm/hf).

this puts a ton of bodies on the table, long range fire power, and short range melta,

and tons of rapid fire.

 

the biggest weakness a drop pod army has is an all bike or outflanking list.

anything that you cant imobilize or black its movement the turn you drop is going

to be an up hill battle

[waaanial00]

my personal favourite is a dual flamer and no heavy weapon tac squad.

 

Unless you are talking about combi flamer thats not possible in the Codex Space Marine. I think its only an option in Space Wolves

[Br.Pat]

Drop pods are rather bad and a whole army that is centred around these is even worse. First of all drop pods are flimsy transports that can count as an easy killpoint. Considering that it'll drop right near your opponents army, and not have any obscured saves etc is not a very good proposition. Secondly you can't get back in the drop pod. Also you better hope that your troops landed where you wanted them to. 90% of the time the thing dropped will be dead next turn, so you better hope that that MM Dread you dropped managed to kill it's points worth (but space marines are rather expensive in general so this is hard to achieve) because it's going to go pop next turn. The drop pod itself can have that missilelauncher thing... but a 12" large blast template is not very good considering your own troops would be very close also.

 

Also if I had to face a pod army I'd just put my whole force in reserve so that you'd have nothing to shoot at.

[Decoy]

Also if I had to face a pod army I'd just put my whole force in reserve so that you'd have nothing to shoot at.

 

Just be careful with that, mate. You tread a dangerous line when you let your opponent dictate where and how you come on; giving a Pod army complete run of the board, deep striking wherever they want to get the good cover on YOUR side of the board... That's either very ballsy, or you're hoping for some horrible scatter rolls on their part.

[spartan249]

Drop pods are rather bad and a whole army that is centred around these is even worse. First of all drop pods are flimsy transports that can count as an easy killpoint. Considering that it'll drop right near your opponents army, and not have any obscured saves etc is not a very good proposition. Secondly you can't get back in the drop pod. Also you better hope that your troops landed where you wanted them to. 90% of the time the thing dropped will be dead next turn, so you better hope that that MM Dread you dropped managed to kill it's points worth (but space marines are rather expensive in general so this is hard to achieve) because it's going to go pop next turn. The drop pod itself can have that missilelauncher thing... but a 12" large blast template is not very good considering your own troops would be very close also.

 

Also if I had to face a pod army I'd just put my whole force in reserve so that you'd have nothing to shoot at.

 

Not true. Drop Pods are a potent method of warfare. It depends on how much foresight the Drop Pod player has. Combining Drop Pod tactics with Vulkan makes this method VERY effective and deadly, and is probably the only really competitive way to run pods.

 

Also, any pod player worth his salt knows about the reserve defense. There are ways around this, and I've defeated quite a few players who tried this tactic on me.

 

One thing to consider about the reserve defense. What happens when the pod army is sporting long range firepower in those pods? What if, upon seeing you reserve your army, he decides to drop his long range guys into ideal positions on the board and set up with no reprisal from you? Then what happens when you roll for your army and get it piecemeal, letting your small bite-size pieces be devoured by those super close range units of doom that waited in reserve for your guys to come? Then, it's a reverse situation, as the opponent has a solid firebase to cover his dropping troops, while you are relying on the luck of the dice to bring in your units on time.

 

Proper design of a pod army can mitigate the effects of the reserve defense, and usually turns the tables on those reserving armies pretty quickly.

[Br.Pat]

Well if you drop your firepower at different areas of the board, you still can't fire on the turn they come down, being heavy weapons. Besides, space marines don't have any fearsome long range firepower. Most weapons have a maximum range of 24". Besides, why would you include 'long-range' weapons in units in pods anyway?

 

Go ask any Grand Tournament/ETC player when the last time he used pods in a competitive build. It's funny. ;)

[Lord Ragnarok]

Also if I had to face a pod army I'd just put my whole force in reserve so that you'd have nothing to shoot at.

 

Just be careful with that, mate. You tread a dangerous line when you let your opponent dictate where and how you come on; giving a Pod army complete run of the board, deep striking wherever they want to get the good cover on YOUR side of the board... That's either very ballsy, or you're hoping for some horrible scatter rolls on their part.

 

Agreed, I wish I had listened to myself when i first heard the all reserve tactic when the new SW dex was released(I always DP'd my wolves in 4th). i just wouldn't want to rely on coming in off reserve with tons of WG cyclone launchers waiting on me. The one force I'd be leary if they went all reserve would be BA's, and DE's.

 

Another trick is to drop empty pods. My current SW list I'm dropping three GH pods on first turn, will have LF's setup, and two empty pods coming in on turns 2+, to block loS or movement.

[Br.Pat]

If it's a kill point mission you've gifted your opponent two free killpoints. If it isn't a killpoint mission, you've just foregone the ability to have rhinos or razorbacks and thus will find it difficult to be mobile and thus capture objectives.

 

I sincerely doubt that something that scatters can effectively be used to block LoS or movement. At most you'll get a 4+ cover save, and I wouldn't be willing to spend 35 points each on those two pods, especially since in 5th edition you almost always have a cover save anyway.

 

I'd rather spend those 35 points on a bare razorback and get a free TL HB, the ability to move 12" and contest and objective or block your opponent moving when he reaches your lines (which is where you want to be blocking him).

 

Just be careful with that, mate. You tread a dangerous line when you let your opponent dictate where and how you come on; giving a Pod army complete run of the board, deep striking wherever they want to get the good cover on YOUR side of the board... That's either very ballsy, or you're hoping for some horrible scatter rolls on their part.

 

By keeping my forces in reserve I am dictating exactly where they come out from my table edge as long as I get a 4+ reserve roll. Therefore, the pod player will be on the back foot.

 

You might not know this but this is why templars got their 'drop pod assault' upgraded to take place during the second turn. Unfortunately. this was downgraded in all more modern books, for reasons still unknown to this day...

[spartan249]

Well if you drop your firepower at different areas of the board, you still can't fire on the turn they come down, being heavy weapons. Besides, space marines don't have any fearsome long range firepower. Most weapons have a maximum range of 24". Besides, why would you include 'long-range' weapons in units in pods anyway?

 

Go ask any Grand Tournament/ETC player when the last time he used pods in a competitive build. It's funny. :huh:

 

You're talking to a GT player, and one who brought Pods to a few tourneys.

 

Where have you been looking? Space Marines have plenty of firepower that fits in pods. Normal dreadnoughts, for one, have very versatile loadout options. Rifledreads, Lascannon/HF, Assault Cannon/HF, Multi-Melta/HF, Autocannon/Missile Launcher, and any other combination you want to use. Devastator Squads with 4 Missile Launchers can set up and lay down the law wherever they decide to land, and they can choose to deploy normally if they so wish. Sternguard Squads can serve as both close range firepower and long range support when given two missile launchers or lascannons and a goodly amount of combi-weapons.

 

As for why, it's for options. A tactically flexible list will always have an answer for an enemy's strategy, whether it be reserving, castling, or deep striking of their own. A drop pod army who's only option is to land right in front of an enemy to deal damage will flop when presented with a reserve/deep striking strategy because the element of speed will be lost. It's this sort of elementary mistake that most pod users will make, and subsequently what gives pods a bad name.

[Br.Pat]

And how successful were these pods?

 

With pods you rely heavily on luck. And even if you manage to damage the enemy, it'll die the next turn. I'd much rather deep strike a Land Speeder with a MM at 60 points, than a podded dread which is likely to die the next turn. Same thing goes for sternguard... podding them will result in their death and wasting of an elite slot, not to mention their potential. Sure you might be able to kill a tank, maybe even a land raider. But you'd have to be pretty lucky to land in the perfect place. And even so you'd trade a 200 point unit for a 250 point tank... not worth the risk. Not with Sternguard. With a speeder sure. I'd deep strike one or two, they're only 60 points afterall. And have greater range.

 

Devastators? For the price of your devastator podded unit I could field a Land Raider with much more durability. Lay the hurt with what? Some incredibly static fire, coming from second-rate long-range weapons? You wouldn't even be able to fire on the turn they come down and by the time they can the enemy will be upon you. This squad would only be good at popping transports and for it's points cost I can field 3 dakka preds that can fire at more targets, with more success...

[spartan249]

It's best to stop assuming that units have to be in your pods. I rarely have my devastators actually drop in their pods, as those pods are only there to give me options on what I can drop when.

 

There's nothing wrong with missile launchers. They're long range, they're high strength, they're versatile in being able to tackle both AT and AI. And most of all, they're cheap. Anything short of AV13 will be threatened by the presence of a devastator squad, and this percieved threat can be used to force engagement on that squad, which in turn creates opportunities for supporting pods to drop in positions on the flanks/rear.

 

As for predators, they have their merits. However, they are just as immobile as the devastator squad when trying to apply full firepower, and they can be silenced with one successful hit, unlike devastator squads. And additionally, Predators can not take drop pods, which does not lend any assistance to the rest of the podding army's options.

[Br.Pat]

So you'd spend 70 points on two transports that won't do a single thing? Apart from reduce your mobility and/or give easy killpoints.

 

No there's nothing wrong with missile-launchers... but they're just okay. Marines don't really have very effective long range AT, which is why you should never take devastators. A squad of ML devastators cost 230 points base, 265 if you have a drop pod. for this you get half the squad who can't shoot at thing at long range. For 265 points I can get a LRC, which can dish out an amazing amount of AI firepower plus have a MM which will be far better at AT than those 4 ML will ever be.

 

In regards to the predators: No they won't be very mobile... but will the devastators be so? Also, you'd need 3 successful hits from 3 different units to silence all 3. They're so much cheaper and so much cost effective. With 3 you have much greater converage of firing lanes, and you'd be able to to hit more targets because you can choose to hit 3 different targets, which is rather impossible with devastators unless you combat squad and then it's only 2 different targets. In addition they're much harder to kill in assault because they can move 12" and you'd have to hit them on 6s.

 

But hey, everybody's got an opinion.

[DarkGuard]

So you'd spend 70 points on two transports that won't do a single thing? Apart from reduce your mobility and/or give easy killpoints.

 

I spend 70pts on two Rhinos, but my Rhinos can't deploy anywhere I like. And they're not armour 12 all round. You see the trick about open topped vehicles is that you need glance/pen it first before it takes effect. With Rhinos it's easy to get through their armour, not so easy with Pods. IMO, both of these are easy kill points, and if you're so worried about easy kill points, why don't we all have 10 man squads on foot, that won't surrender easy kill points now will it?

 

And as for firepower, a Drop Pod has a single storm bolter that it cannot fire when moving at cruising speed (deep striking), and so does a Rhino. I don't know about you, but I don't rely on my Rhinos to kill anything, and I won't rely on a Pod to do so either.

 

There's nothing that says using Pods are an auto-loose, especially when you get to pick where you're coming down and what the terms of the battle are. I'd use Pods more often if I could actually make the thing properly and fit it in my case, that's the real reason I don't use them.

 

 

But hey, everybody's got an opinion.

Yup we all do, perhaps you should back off a little bit and listen to people who use Pods and know how to use them. Perhaps by listening you can pick up a few tips on how to use them and how not to use them. This is a forum where we can debate about the uses of different models and tactics, not ridicule people and tell them they're wrong for taking and using certain units and tactics.

[Br.Pat]

Yup we all do, perhaps you should back off a little bit and listen to people who use Pods and know how to use them. Perhaps by listening you can pick up a few tips on how to use them and how not to use them. This is a forum where we can debate about the uses of different models and tactics, not ridicule people and tell them they're wrong for taking and using certain units and tactics.

 

First of all, who's doing the ridiculing? I'm just stating my opinion, which I have every right to do. And this is my opinion: I myself will probably never use pods unless they become more worthwhile next addition. I'm not saying they're without their uses but they're certainly not the best option out there. And I fail to see how a whole force based around them will be very effective.

 

Yes, rhinos are AV11. In regards to the AV 12, contester thing.. it really isn't too hard to pop AV12, especially considering that many competitve armies have a lot of fast, mobile melta these days.

 

And atleast with a rhino I can move 6" and fire a flamer, or melta and be impervious to most small arms fire. The most successful armiers are mobile armies, which is why biker armies and mechanised armies are quite effective.

 

I also think that empty pods are extremely unfluffy, and if one has to resort to using something completely differently to how they were conceived, then surely the rules are broken or simply inadequate?

 

Now that is my opinion, I am ridiculing noone. Just stating facts.

[TyrionTheImp]

So you'd spend 70 points on two transports that won't do a single thing? Apart from reduce your mobility and/or give easy killpoints.

Blocking paths is a VERY useful tactic, and they also provide cover/block LoS and AV 12 is annoying to kill without diverting at least some amount of firepower to them.

 

No there's nothing wrong with missile-launchers... but they're just okay. Marines don't really have very effective long range AT, which is why you should never take devastators. A squad of ML devastators cost 230 points base, 265 if you have a drop pod. for this you get half the squad who can't shoot at thing at long range. For 265 points I can get a LRC, which can dish out an amazing amount of AI firepower plus have a MM which will be far better at AT than those 4 ML will ever be.

What the heck are you on? Missile Launchers are GREAT, nobody said you had to bring a 10 man Dev squad, in fact I'd never do that. Not to mention Marines have great long range AT: rifleman dreads, typhoons, combi-preds, and ML Devs, all capable of putting out enough high Str shots to kill tanks across the board. If you're talking about the killing ability to reliably take down a Land Raider across the table the only armies capable of that are Eldar (both kinds) with Lances, probably IG (don't pay them enough to know for certain), and Tau with Railguns. Strength 8 is great for taking down lighter vehicles, which is really what you need to kill. I'd much rather take 4 ML's over a SINGLE MM on a Land Raider. Honestly, you never see more than 2 Land Raiders in a list at 2000 points anyways, and the amount of melta Space Marines can pack is ridiculous enough you shouldn't worry about it, but you DO need to worry about those transports, and Missile spam is one of the many ways to deal with it.

 

In regards to the predators: No they won't be very mobile... but will the devastators be so? Also, you'd need 3 successful hits from 3 different units to silence all 3. They're so much cheaper and so much cost effective. With 3 you have much greater converage of firing lanes, and you'd be able to to hit more targets because you can choose to hit 3 different targets, which is rather impossible with devastators unless you combat squad and then it's only 2 different targets. In addition they're much harder to kill in assault because they can move 12" and you'd have to hit them on 6s.

I do agree that predators are a better choice over Dev's in a normal list, but we're looking at a DROP POD list, Predators can't take drop pods, and the reason you want more drop pods is you can MAXIMIZE the amount of units that come in while MINIMIZING the amount that don't. If you have 9 pods, 5 are full, 4 are empty, You can slam 5 pods into the ground first turn, the 4 empties are merely there for place holding so you can get the most of your army on the field via Drop Pod Assault thus reducing the luck factor. This is why you take Dev's over the Pred's in a Drop pod army, because in this kind of list the Dev's are better. Personally, I wouldn't take 10 though, 5 with 4 ML's is good enough if you've got 3 squads of them.

 

A drop pod army overall isn't going to be very mobile once it hits the ground, but it doesn't need to be if you A. Pack enough melta units to be able to blow up THEIR transports when you hit the ground and B. Have a decent enough fire base to reach out and touch people across the board, both of which are completely possible, if you build your list right. Will it be a tournament winning list? Probably not, but doesn't mean it can't put up a good fight and maybe win a few games.

[Br.Pat]

It would be a useful tactics if there was a 100% guarantee that they'd come down where you want them to and weren't very flimsy. AV 12 is nothing when you consider the amount of melta an army can have. I myself have Around 10 melta weapons in my 1500 point list.

 

Rhino's while flimsy, can actually move about and block the enemy, which is what I use them for. ML are good at destroying transports but devastators are extremely expensive for this, and you're better off just getting more melta, which has shorter range but can be equipped on fast platforms like attack bikes.

 

A drop pod army overall isn't going to be very mobile once it hits the ground, but it doesn't need to be if you A. Pack enough melta units to be able to blow up THEIR transports when you hit the ground and B. Have a decent enough fire base to reach out and touch people across the board, both of which are completely possible, if you build your list right. Will it be a tournament winning list? Probably not, but doesn't mean it can't put up a good fight and maybe win a few games.

 

In addition the problem with drop pods is they really quite heavily on luck and this is why they won't be extremely competitive. And also as I said, you better hope you kill what you need to kill on the turn they come down because next turn they are most likely dead. Even if you did manage to achieve your aim.

 

Oh and your opponent being able to keep his whole force in reserve kind of ruins your day.

[Algesan]

Okay, remember that this is coming mostly from a Black Templar perspective, which uses the full reserve pod rules still and some different point costs. For example, I can buy 3 Pods for the price of a Lazorback instead of the 2 for 1 in C:SM. Also, we can quibble forever over "well, if I have X, Y & Z, then I'll kill you"; "well, even if you have X,Y & Z, as long as I set up A and move B with my unit C, not only won't you kill me, I'll kill you", but let that pass for now. Too much negativity and highlighting of the disadvantages going on here.

 

Yes, Pods can be considered an easy kill, but they aren't that easy, like say a Land Speeder. If you get an 11 to glance a Rhino, you have missed a Pod and if you get a 12 with a 1/3 chance of killing a Rhino, you have just glanced a Pod with a 1/6 chance of killing a Pod. Think about it, what are you comparing them to for "easy KP", Land Raiders or Predator front armor? AV 12 is right in the middle, so if we want to split armor into "heavy" and "light", the fact that a Pod is open topped, it defaults into the very top of the "light" category. Any unmodified Rhino body, like a Razorback, is an easier kill from the front.

 

Deep striking randomness is a problem, but with Inertial Guidance and proper placement a lot of that can be overcome. You want to drop a squad with a melta right next to a Land Raider? 1/3 of the time you will hit where you want, almost 1/3 of the rest will only scatter you towards the target with low rolls putting you back where you started and bigger rolls simply putting you on the other side. Then over half the remaining results moving you away will still leave you in melta range of the Raider, requiring a roll of 8+ in a direction directly away from the Raider.

 

Now that the Pod is down, it's doors flop down (since I'm using mostly hand made stand ins, I haven't used this much and neither have most people I've seen proxying one, but I'm thinking I need to) and provide a wide area coverage. So what, right? Well, IMO, it does provide a 4+ cover save hiding behind the pod and doors (although IMO they are "walls" requiring you to be adjacent), but also until it is destroyed, no enemy unit can come within 1" of the Pod. Without the doors, it is still ~6" diameter of dead space. Including its doors... Oh, wait a minute. I just made a 10"+ diameter no movement zone in the board (assuming you can get all the doors down) until that Pod is killed. They provide cover for anything behind them too. Does your opponent need to move and shoot in that direction?

 

So it is possible to not only have a not-so-easy "easy KP" for the enemy, it can possibly be deployed in a way to force the enemy to kill it to move and shoot as they desire. How is this an advantage? Shots (or assaults) taken to clear the Pods allow whatever they delivered to gain another turn of life to kill at a minimum. Instant 30 (35 for C:SM) bubble wrap. In the meantime, a Pod with a storm bolter isn't real high on anyone's threat level meter. Drop that Pod on an objective and then bail out around it and hold.

 

True, like Airborne, once you've made your drop (jump), you are now nothing more than a nasty leg infantry, but you should be within a movement of your target and at worst, a run of it. I'm hoping your Pod contents plus the other components of your list provide mobility and long range firepower. Terminators with Cyclones, Land Speeder Typhoons, Assault Marines, etc.

 

Of course, always remember you can always drop Pods empty and deploy on the board as you see fit. This is the major strength of a Drop Pod army. The initiative belongs to the one with the Pods. Outflankers? They come in on the sides, you know where they are. Regular Reserves? You know where they come in. Deep Strikes? You have to be ready for where they hit 100% of the time and they can come down anywhere. It is also one of the hardest tactics to master in the game. A whole lot easier to deal with fire and movement using infantry and vehicles where the dictates of LOS, limited movement, not having to worry about what support is coming and the ability to load up and move after a screw-up simplify things.

 

The biggest reason Pod armies are weak: You have to drop half of them on Turn 1. Which means you don't want to go first, but you may end up with an enemy in reserve also since you need that first shot to even the odds somewhat. Otherwise most of the enemies army gets to unload on half of yours and you'll never catch up. Which isn't a whole lot different than an Outflank attack or units in Reserve.

 

I'd have to think about that one more given the differences between C:SM and the Templars in terms of equipment and cost, but it might not be as big a problem as normally thought. As long as the list has elements that can drop out and shoot (RF, Assault weapons) as well as drop out and dig in for the next turn with heavy weapons (like a Sternguard squad that fits in one Pod but can split into a pair of combat squads with a heavy weapon each), it might still be workable since you get to choose which half of the Pods drop. Especially since you can always just combat squad that Sternguard and deploy it on the table with firing lanes while other units (or even empty Pods) hammer down closer. Either way, there is the potential to have your heavy weapons on the ground, set up and ready to kill at optimal ranges no matter what the enemy does.

 

Marshall Laeroth has a tactica aimed at Black Templars, but as long as you can go second, most of it should apply to a C:SM force in general.

[Ming]

I'm with Algesan on this.

 

A drop pod army is very viable and worthy. Pods become cover, pods block movement, pods can control enemy deployment, pods can contest objectives, pods can themselves be great distractions, pods can deploy their own weapons.

 

Couple some pods with fluffy introduction of scouts with beacons, and devs or other support units and you have a great thing going.

 

You can center a pod over an enemy unit, then scatter it to the edge of the unit, deploy the contents, and flame/game on!

 

If the opponent reserves, then deploy the pods where he has to come towards them. If pods might become important kill points, deply the pods in or behind cover to make them more resilient. If the opponent is outflanking, you can bait him into a kill zone, just like if he comes in from any edge.

 

Overall, the units deployed by pod must be well constructed to create options in laanding order. If half your podded units were short range killy, and half were medium to long range shooty, that would be about right. Then if the opponent reserves, the shooty pods come first. Killy pods come later. and vice versa.

 

Always important for pod armies are having combat boosters provided by characters - such as Vulkan, or Kantor. Vulkan makes your alpha strike pods more deadly. Kantor makes your pod army more dangerous if assaulted the turn after they drop.

 

The bigger issue for pod lists is that you do have to dedicate yourself to the strategic deployment issues and to the tactics best applied to each game and opposing army. Pod armies are not for the inexperienced or unpracticed.

 

This topic comes up maybe monthly in some form. I've seen some partially-podded lists do well in tournaments. I have not seen all-pod or all-deep-strike lists come into play. I've done lists with three pods and the rest of the army deep striking for non-torunament games, sometimes things went very well, and sometimes it just did not matter. You can look up some of my battle reports or in my blog for drop pod successes or dismal failures.

 

On Ripped Dragon's 40K blog outside B&C he had a short movie clip where my Ultras podded in and were wiped out by his BAs. My fault in that one. I just plopped a small force into the center and he reserved everything, my shooting was dismal vs his FNP and cover saves. BA deep-strike and flyer-deployed lists will have similar challenges to pod lists using other codexi. Jump packs will help them be more mobile, and they have their own force multipliers giving them FNP and cover saves on the bounce. Ripped was planning to do an all-pod Vulkan list for last years ard boyz tournament but lost his nerve, deciding to go mech instead.

 

Starting to ramble...Good luck and happy gaming!

[Vincent Black Shadow]

Ah, the drop pod doors debate. :)

 

There are many of the opinion that the drop pod doors don't count as part of the model, for purposes of disembarking and blocking enemy movement, and also there is significant controversy about whether the DP body blocks LOS or merely provides cover.

 

Much of the same debate has been made of the land raider front assault ramp. If a door constitutes part of a hull, does that door count as part of the model for disembarking when opened? The world may never know.

 

(Personally I think that drop pods, in order to justify their cost and since it seems sensible to me, should be WYSIWYG; i.e. if the doors are closed the vehicle is LOS-blocking, and if opened the doors count as part of the vehicle hull for disembarking, and the player has to make the up/down choice when deploying, but this isn't a majority opinion. In fact, I seem to recall GW making a call on the subject that says the drop pod doors aren't part of the vehicle, but can't find the source)

 

But yes, the drop pod list is definitely a "fire" style, alpha strike force. Mainly because in order to accomplish anything against the mobile armies that are so prevalent, you absolutely have to kill stuff the turn you land. Otherwise they just dance away from your now-footslogging force and rip you up piecemeal.

 

Interesting to note that blood angel DoA armies are viable, despite many of the same limitations of drop pod armies. Perhaps there's an answer there... any of our Sanguine brothers care to weigh in? Are there tactical approaches that could be applicable here, or is it only scoring jump infantry, stormchickens and furioso blender-noughts that make DoA doable?

[captaincandle]

A drop pod army is very viable and worthy. Pods become cover, pods block movement, pods can control enemy deployment, pods can contest objectives, pods can themselves be great distractions, pods can deploy their own weapons.

 

Drop pods can't contest can they?! They count as immobalised when they come down and immobalised vehicles can't contest objectives. Or did I miss something here?