Inquisitor Lord Sean Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 So I want to paint up a pseudo ordo xeno army and I was wondering what codex would be the best to do this with I'm only going to use it until April then I'm back to the grey knights. Ok now enough babble so I was thinking about using my space marine codex but I don't really know maybe my blood angel one what do you guys think would be the best to use of the 2. Thanks oh and if someone has asked this before I'm sorry for asking again. ~Inquisitor Lord Sean =][= Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Standard Space Marines is probably the better choice, since if you wanted to represent a Deathwatch army with Blood Angels you would have to leave out most of the BA-specific stuff anyway. Since you would want to go Sternguard-heavy to keep on-theme for Deathwatch, the SM Codex also has the advantage of including Pedro Kanto so you can make your Sternguard scoring. On the other hand, BA does have some nice things going for it, like fast vehicles and reasonably-priced Devastators, even if you will have to ignore some of the units like Sanguinary Guard and Death Company, You might also want to consider allying in an Inquisitor and perhaps one or two other bits of Inquisition stuff, assuming you have a printed version of the Witchhunter or Daemonhunter codex. If you don't, then it's not a huge deal; you can always run a Librarian and some scouts masquerading and an Inquisitor and Stormtroopers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2676852 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyalist Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I built up an Ordo Xenos force in a couple of ways. One, already suggested, was to use a regular Codex SM army and have it represent Deathwatch with an allied Inquisitor or Lord + Retinue. The Deathwatch force has an HQ of a Captain (2 options with different weapons), Command Squad (also with alternative figures for CC or mid-range shooting) and a Razorback. Other HQ choices include a Chaplain Cassius equivalent, Terminator Chaplain and a Librarian. Two Troops, each plasma weapon heavy (pistol, gun, cannon), have Rhinos. There are 2 x 10 man Sternguard squads with heavy flamers and multiple combi-weapons, plus Drop Pods or Rhinos for transport. For other Elite options there are 2 Terminator squads (5 and 6 man; the Terminator Chaplain fights in the 5 man squad). There aren't any Dreadnoughts because I don't think there'd be many in the Deathwatch, though there's been at least one mentioned in novels. Fast attack consists of 2 Landspeeder Tornados. A Tempest might be added. Heavy support consists of a Stormraven (a second will be added) and a Devastator Squad. A standard Landraider will carry the allied Inquisitor and retinue. In an Apocalypse game the force will deploy as multiple "kill teams" (as in one of the Inquisitor Eisenhorn novels) in drop pods, Stormravens, and by teleportation. The other approach was to base the force around the Witch Hunter Codex, with an allied Deathwatch Kill Team delivered by drop pod or Stormraven. (At the local GW store no one makes a fuss about chapters other than Grey Knights and Blood Angels using Stormravens.) The HQ is an Inquisitor Lord and Retinue in a Landraider. Two Inquisitors and Retinues in Rhinos are Elite options, which also include all varieties of Assassins. There are 4 Troops of Stormtroopers in Chimeras (I use either shotgun armed Adeptus Arbites figures or Kasrkin depending on the opponent). For heavy support there's a pair of Exorcists. The fluff is that they're seconded from the Sisters of Battle. There aren't any fast attack units yet. When I field a Witch Hunter based Ordo Xenos force in Apocalypse games most of it will be airborne: Stormtrooper squads in 2 Valkyries and 2 Arvuses, HQ in a Vendetta, and 2 Vultures for ground support. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677018 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DinoDoc Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Pseudo-Deathwatch HQ: Chapter Master Pedro Kantor (1#, 175 pts) 1 Chapter Master Pedro Kantor, 175 pts Elite: Sternguard Veteran Squad (11#, 370 pts) 9 Sternguard Veteran Squad, 370 pts (Combi-Meltagun x4; Lascannon x2) 1 Sergeant (Combi-Flamer x1) 1 Razorback (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer) Elite: Sternguard Veteran Squad (11#, 370 pts) 9 Sternguard Veteran Squad, 370 pts (Combi-Meltagun x4; Lascannon x2) 1 Sergeant (Combi-Flamer x1) 1 Razorback (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer) Elite: Sternguard Veteran Squad (11#, 370 pts) 9 Sternguard Veteran Squad, 370 pts (Combi-Meltagun x4; Lascannon x2) 1 Sergeant (Combi-Flamer x1) 1 Razorback (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer) Troops: Tactical Squad (11#, 235 pts) 9 Tactical Squad, 235 pts (Flamer; Missile Launcher) 1 Sergeant 1 Razorback (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer) Troops: Tactical Squad (11#, 235 pts) 9 Tactical Squad, 235 pts (Flamer; Missile Launcher) 1 Sergeant 1 Razorback (Twin Linked Heavy Flamer) : Inquisitorial Stormtroopers (6#, 120 pts) 5 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers [WH], 120 pts (Meltagun x2) 1 Rhino [WH] : Inquisitorial Stormtroopers (6#, 120 pts) 5 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers [WH], 120 pts (Meltagun x2) 1 Rhino [WH] Total Roster Cost: 1995 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677035 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I've never liked the T-L Heavy Flamer Razorbacks in the standard Marine Codex, mostly because they're ridiculously overpriced. If you want to mass-field that pattern of Razorback, you're better off playing Blood Angels, since theirs are Fast (incredibly useful when your only weapon is a Template) and cost ten points less than the ones in the standard Marine codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677405 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Orlock Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Nah, I'd do Deathwatch out of Space Wolves. Grey Hunters with or without attached WorfGuard could stand in for kill teams. You could find some large Fantasy Monster to stand in as Mounts for TunderWorf Cav. Maybe Giant Spiders, or Scorpions, or some such and claim them as special tactics and use of xenos. Has access to pick an' mix termies while still maintaining much of the old stand by hardware. I just wouldn't take any broodcraw derived options. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677424 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Not having the special ammo that has always been one of the defining traits of the Deathwatch is a bit of a problem with Wolf Guard Deathwatch. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677447 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Validar Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Eddie, I think you may have mistaken the fluff a bit. Ordo Xenos (mostly) hates Xenos, even above the usual hate normally found in the Imperium. The use of xenos technology (not ever mentioning actual xenos) would not only be stricly forbidden, it would be enough to get you shot on the spot. Conversing with Xenos (even intellegent xenos like the elder) would be considered highly radical (even heretical) within elements of the ordo. I really doubt the Ordo Millitant would be allowed to ride xenos into battle Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Validar Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Eddie, I think you may have mistaken the fluff a bit. Ordo Xenos (mostly) hates Xenos, even above the usual hate normally found in the Imperium. The use of xenos technology (not ever mentioning actual xenos) would not only be stricly forbidden, it would be enough to get you shot on the spot. Conversing with Xenos (even intellegent xenos like the elder) would be considered highly radical (even heretical) within elements of the ordo. I really doubt the Ordo Millitant would be allowed to ride xenos into battle Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677548 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DinoDoc Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 you're better off playing Blood Angels,What this list provides over BA: 7 vehicles full of scoring units, and 3 scoring units on foot. You can increase this to 12 if need be. Also Sisters seem to make Immo spam work without access to fast vehicles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677577 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 you're better off playing Blood Angels,What this list provides over BA: 7 vehicles full of scoring units, and 3 scoring units on foot. You can increase this to 12 if need be. Also Sisters seem to make Immo spam work without access to fast vehicles. Except that Immolators can still move 12" and shoot their heavy flamers, exactly like a fast vehicle. Razorbacks can't. Another 6" of movement before firing off a template weapon tends to make a huge difference in how effectively you can place your templates, not to mention putting more stuff in range. Then there's the fact that 7 scoring units is more than you really need at 2000 points. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677616 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Orlock Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Eddie, I think you may have mistaken the fluff a bit. Ordo Xenos (mostly) hates Xenos, even above the usual hate normally found in the Imperium. The use of xenos technology (not ever mentioning actual xenos) would not only be stricly forbidden, it would be enough to get you shot on the spot. Conversing with Xenos (even intellegent xenos like the elder) would be considered highly radical (even heretical) within elements of the ordo. I really doubt the Ordo Millitant would be allowed to ride xenos into battle :) So adamant you posted it twice? ;) At this juncture I'll submit reference to a Chapter Approved White Dwarf article that if I recall corrently was by the authored by the esteemed Pete Hains and contained additional docterines for the then current Imperial Guard Codex. Among these additional options was one specifically to mount the Rough Riders on Xenos Mounts. Surely a standard practice of the Guard can't be heresy, for if it is you've got a lot of purgin' to do. I'd also submit that as non-natives to Holy Terra, fenrisian wolves also qualify as Xeno mounts and thus the act is not without precident. Next I'll cite the 'DeathWatch' RPG in which certain peices of xeno derived tech are explicitly called out as being sanctified for use. It's not so much a proscription against mundane xeno fauna and flora, indeed, on some worlds humanity depends on them for its survival and tasty Grox burgers, as it is a guard against xeno species that have the intelligence to rival mans rightous, inevitable, dominance of the galaxy. Now excuse me while I saddle up my Cockatrice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677637 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chengar Qordath Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 I'll have to second Eddie on the point of Xenos beasts; as long as they're just normal animals, whether they're xeno or not usually isn't an issue. Obviously, using something like Flesh Hounds or Carnifexes would be out, but not simple, ordinary xeno beasts. However, a Deathwatch force using xeno beasts would be a bit odd, even if there's no reason they couldn't do so. For that matter I do think that the xenophobia of the Inquisition gets a bit overplayed, mostly because a lot of players seem to think the Monodominant position is the Puritan party line, rather than being a fairly extreme fringe group. The Imperium does actually have trade and diplomatic relations with some xenos after all, and even the Puritan bits of the Inquisition Inquisition will work alongside some Xenos if that is the best/only way to effectively advance Imperial interests. The Imperium and the Eldar even had an outright military alliance during the Gothic War (granted, said alliance lasted about five seconds longer than the war). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2677659 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Lord Sean Posted March 8, 2011 Author Share Posted March 8, 2011 Sorry for not replying sooner. thanks guys for your responses I chose the space marine codex for the army. I'm gonna post pics once I finish painting them and figure out how to post pictures. I might also do some reports on how there doing :) So thanks once again on helping me pick a codex for my deathwatch. Oh and I was thinking about using space wolves codex but the only thing that kept me from going out and buying was the sternguard I like the fact that you can choose what type of ammo they use. Thanks for all the help ~Inquisitor Lord Sean =][= Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2681268 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellios Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 I'll have to second Eddie on the point of Xenos beasts; as long as they're just normal animals, whether they're xeno or not usually isn't an issue. Obviously, using something like Flesh Hounds or Carnifexes would be out, but not simple, ordinary xeno beasts. However, a Deathwatch force using xeno beasts would be a bit odd, even if there's no reason they couldn't do so. Are you suggesting my Ordo Xenos Inquisitor with lobotomised, remote control genestealers (Acro-flagellants) Is heretical!?!?! However what has been said is correct... hell the standard meat of the Imperium as far as I can tell is Grox... and I assume this is some kind of Alien creature ;), more puritan Inqs won't use Xeno tech or work with Xenos unless they have to, however more radical ones like mine enjoy the use of Alien mercs... Get the aliens to kill each other and then kill the survivors ^^ Bolter hasn't got enough kick? Use Tau Railrifle! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2681550 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamrodMC Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 IG xeno riders is one (pretty awesome) thing. Saw an amazing army one time that included Catachan Rough Riders mounted on WFB Cold Ones. Deathwatch "bikers" riding xenos is another, much worse, thing. Space Marines riding anything other than bikes (or a jetbike if you're Sammael) tends to be hit-or-miss (resolved at BS2) anyway, in my opinion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2681572 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordsloth Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 Deathwatch "bikers" riding xenos is another, much worse, thing. Space Marines riding anything other than bikes (or a jetbike if you're Sammael) tends to be hit-or-miss (resolved at BS2) anyway, in my opinion. Now I'm sure you couldnt possibly be trying to intimate that giant mutated space vikings on cybernetic dire wolves are anything less than totally awesome? :) If we want to go truly madly deeply fluff-heretical with this concept, we need to hold out for codex grey knights so we can have deathwatch marines riding cybernatically enhanced trigons for counts as dreadknights. Bonus points if the marines are ultras. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2681585 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamrodMC Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 They would be awesome if GW made a plastic kit for them! :P As it stands GW gets a C for Canis Wolfborn, but an A+ regarding his effectiveness as a huge metal paperweight. As for a counts-as-Dreadknight... maximum heresy mode: a Grey Knight riding a tamed Greater Daemon. Yes, I went there. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2681609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavement Artist Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 In regards to the xenos indoctrinated beast types- A: Yes you can use them. Of course it will come across as a bit dodgy to your Ordo peers and they're probably going to brand you Radical. B: Deathwatch being the Ordo militant means that they wouldnt have any truck with an inquisitor who employs radical means. In the same way that Grey knights dont roll with daemonhosts. If you want to go for a Deathwatch themed force, id try to keep things on the puritan side Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2683552 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Orlock Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 In regards to the xenos indoctrinated beast types- A: Yes you can use them. Of course it will come across as a bit dodgy to your Ordo peers and they're probably going to brand you Radical. B: Deathwatch being the Ordo militant means that they wouldnt have any truck with an inquisitor who employs radical means. In the same way that Grey knights dont roll with daemonhosts. If you want to go for a Deathwatch themed force, id try to keep things on the puritan side The Imperium is redolent with splendiferous examples of non-terran flora and fauna harnesed for the common good of man. Indeed, I'd go so far as to say that outside of the common horse, most of our current domesticated species are unlikely to have travelled with man to the stars and to have remained untouched for so many millenia. I'm certain we can rest assured that the worlds of the imperium that use non-equestrian draught animals are myriad and diverse, and that were I a fellow inquisitor from an in character perspective I'd so declare anyone launching such a progrom against honest Imperial citizenery Heriticus Nincompoopus* for their squandering of His resources and resolve to hunt them down and hold them accountable for their crimes. Show the average imperial citizen a chicken and they'd have no idea it'd taste good fried. It is only natural that once we understand the use of non-terran draft animals they might be saddle broke and pressed into combative service and it is far from inconceivable that an astartes chapter might find itself based on such an orb and might, as they're wont to do, adopt local methods and customs some what in the ideom of the vaunted inheritors of Russ. The breaking of non-sentient xenos to the will of the Emperors servents is no heresy, mearly the expression of mans manifest destiny in the universe. Death Watch so using these tools would mearly be the Emperors migthiest servents so expressing this divine mandate. *I think that if I were to be so empowered that would quickly become one of my favourite denouncements. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2683580 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talon Darkshade Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Wouldn't the new up and coming GK dex make a good Ordo Xenos book as well? Special ammo (+1 Str shots = Psybolts, 2 shots a turn SBolter profile, rending special weapons) seems to be enough rules to justifiy special ammos Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/223850-want-to-make-a-pseudo-ordo-xenos-army/#findComment-2684567 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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