Magnus Thane Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 So it looks pretty cool IMO but it begs the question, has GW relinquished all codex and fluff writing to Matt ward because the general public is gonna blame him anyways? While I enjoy new units and the model looks cool this one seems kinda out there considering Grey Knight terminators are supposed to be your greater demon killers as far as I know. And the option to use it as heavy support is nice because I heard GK needed better heavies but why not just give them the option to use normal marine heavy weapons? If I'm entirely honest I never thought Grey Knights should ever have had their own Codex book. In my not so humble opinion GW missed an opportunity to create an Army of the Imperium list like 2nd edition had, with Grey Knights being part of it. Oh well it can't be helped now. Personally I don't like the Dreadknight as a concept in an army which has Dreadnoughts. It just seems to contradict their role in the back ground. Personally I'm glad as I have a pure GK army so to me it suits just fine. The last thing I want is to end up with an invalidated army. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684237 Share on other sites More sharing options...
waaanial00 Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 still haven't properly supported the Space Wolves. Where are our Thunderwolves?! Hopefully its a nod that they wont be in the next codex. Still GW feels that they need to invent something big and "different" in order to sell their latest power armoured divergent. It pains me that they havent grasped the concept that GK are NOT just another divergent, they are almost entirely different to every marine given that they are all latent psychics who are built to combat the daemon. Still theres no fighting change, that way madness lies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684266 Share on other sites More sharing options...
momosgarage Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Personally I don't like the Dreadknight as a concept in an army which has Dreadnoughts. Seriously. I think it looks kinda stupid. Its is stupid. So now we have another dreadnought like unit, which is a halfway house between a Penitent Engine and a dreadnought, yet smaller than a Warhound Scout Titan, but bigger than a dreadnought. Man the staff at GW don't read ANY of the old stuff for inspiration. You know they could have just brought back Imperial Robots to fill the role of the Dreadknight. Plenty of new ideas could have been infused in the Imperial Robot fluff and rules, while at the same time not being outright stupid. But what do we get instead? A kit bash looking unit that anyone on this board could have made in a day. The GW sculpting is great, but thier execution of concept is amteur and very rushed in nature. This is a clear waste of design team money an time that will be fixed through expendatures in the marketing department. But then again, the Dreadknight concept and test model likely took no more than a day to flesh out. I seriously think GW just needs to start freelancing some if the work the design group does. GW's in-house designed ideas are uninspired and just plain dumb. Maybe if they put thier projects out on the market rather than doing it in-house, they actually might end up with something that is actually interesting and unique. But I suppose they are also not targeting me as a customer anymore, so whats dumb looking to me is cool to a 5 year old. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684305 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KJB Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 See, I'm one of those that saw the pictures of the Storm Raven and hated it, yet when I held one in store I loved it. I'm getting the same feeling from the DreadKnight, so I have a sneaky feeling when I go into the store later (and they've hopefully built theirs) I'll love it and then spend the next day desperately resisting the urge to dig out and update my old GK army and stick with my new Salamanders force!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684314 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 So it looks pretty cool IMO but it begs the question, has GW relinquished all codex and fluff writing to Matt ward because the general public is gonna blame him anyways? While I enjoy new units and the model looks cool this one seems kinda out there considering Grey Knight terminators are supposed to be your greater demon killers as far as I know. And the option to use it as heavy support is nice because I heard GK needed better heavies but why not just give them the option to use normal marine heavy weapons? If I'm entirely honest I never thought Grey Knights should ever have had their own Codex book. In my not so humble opinion GW missed an opportunity to create an Army of the Imperium list like 2nd edition had, with Grey Knights being part of it. Oh well it can't be helped now. Personally I don't like the Dreadknight as a concept in an army which has Dreadnoughts. It just seems to contradict their role in the back ground. Personally I'm glad as I have a pure GK army so to me it suits just fine. The last thing I want is to end up with an invalidated army. Oh that's one of the last things I want for the hobby. I hate army invalidation. What I meant wasn't that GK should cease to be as an entity, rather they should have been included as parts of a larger, wider army of the Imperium. I'm talking about a susbtantial project here and that probably means it would never had been implemented. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684400 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus Thane Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 I know what you mean Idaho but I merely meant I would probably not be able to field a decent pure GK force in such a thing, new purchases would be needed. Probably anyway. And though such a massive tome would be cool it would bring loads of problems. The amount of fluff needed to put in there, the amount of options, new kits and other stuff would make it a mess longterm. Still from what I read it seems with a bit of flexibility you can play a pure Inquisition force and/or use those rules for some of the more exotic types of Empire sub-armies. Come to think of it... who knows what they'll do with the SoB's. And given the popularity of the Deathwatch, I would not be surprised in seeing a codex pop up that caters to a few 'subfactions'. But even then it would remain limited. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684410 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 I know what you mean Idaho but I merely meant I would probably not be able to field a decent pure GK force in such a thing, new purchases would be needed. dont tell me you plan to use nemesis halabards for your GK ? no matter how you look at it , if you want a working army you will have to buy a new one. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684412 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Fisting Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Man the staff at GW don't read ANY of the old stuff for inspiration. You know they could have just brought back Imperial Robots to fill the role of the Dreadknight. That would've been pretty stupid as artificially intelligent robotics are considered heresy as far as the Imperium is concerned. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684423 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus Thane Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 I know what you mean Idaho but I merely meant I would probably not be able to field a decent pure GK force in such a thing, new purchases would be needed. dont tell me you plan to use nemesis halabards for your GK ? no matter how you look at it , if you want a working army you will have to buy a new one. Haven't seen the codex yet. But I can just as well use them as other melee weapons. I don't do tournaments. Though if some of the units are cool i'll end up picking up a box or 2 of Grey Knights. I'll see. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684432 Share on other sites More sharing options...
raven guard 1369 Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 According to the GW write up they have ball joints so conversions for poses shouldn't be too necassary. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684443 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassWave Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Man the staff at GW don't read ANY of the old stuff for inspiration. You know they could have just brought back Imperial Robots to fill the role of the Dreadknight. That would've been pretty stupid as artificially intelligent robotics are considered heresy as far as the Imperium is concerned. Aren't psykers considered heretics by the Imperium too? And yet look how much the Imperium uses them. The Imperium will allow pretty much anything as long as it benefits them. The Dreadknight model might be questionable, but if we have learned anything from the Stormraven its that it contains a crap load of interesting bits that can be used to create something better. I'm looking forward to this kit to see what robotic creations come out of it :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684448 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saphos Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 I like the Knight a lot. I wish they had allowed for easier posability but I can work with what I will get. I think it fits in well enough with the rest of the army when you think about it as an upgraded Terminator instead of a Dreadnought equivalent. Which works fine for me. Btw I just read that the DK just has a save of 5+. Damn, I fail 4+ often enough already. And as he is freakin huge it will not be hard to shoot him most of the time. The storm of nerdrage that is going on (again) would be funny were it no so sad when you think about it. :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684461 Share on other sites More sharing options...
raven guard 1369 Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 Its got terminator saves base according to the getting started article Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684464 Share on other sites More sharing options...
raven guard 1369 Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 Considering that the pilots in terminator armor anything less than 2+/5++ wouldn't make sense. It also has 4 wounds so it shouldn't be too easy to kill Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684477 Share on other sites More sharing options...
momosgarage Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 That would've been pretty stupid as artificially intelligent robotics are considered heresy as far as the Imperium is concerned. Hence, why I said: "Plenty of new ideas could have been infused in the Imperial Robot fluff and rules, while at the same time not being outright stupid" Why couldn't the "new" Imperial Robots be suped-up servitors? The good base idea is already in place, the writers would just need to retcon for consistency. Besides couldn't an imperial robot be controlled by a tech priest on the battlefield. (Haven't seen those in ages either) Lets face the facts, GW designers take shortcuts and put together half-arsed ideas ALL THE TIME (either voluntary or involuntary, nobody from the inside has EVER commented on thier working conditions, so who knows). In 10 minutes I came up with two better ideas than the Dreadknight, which if you really think about it is a "super-suit" for a "super-suit". Very lame :D BTW Crimson Fisting, lets be clear about what your reference means according to fluff: "artificially intelligent robotics are considered heresy" Imperial robots are are not "Iron Men". The Adeptus Mechicus specifically forbids the manufacture of "Iron-Men", not robots. If that were the case there would be no machine spirits, servo skulls or servitors. These noted "robots" have vat grown brains to serve as hardware. Where do you draw the line and how does that relate to robots? It certainly isn't clarified in the fluff of any period. You just didn't think your comment through. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684479 Share on other sites More sharing options...
raven guard 1369 Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 Meh. I kinda like the idea of a super suit for a super suit to go and slay all your big nasties for leas points than your squad of plain old super suits. Actually looking through all that GW has written up the Grey Knights are looking like a pretty potent force. They say the squads are pretty expensive so the trick will be keeping them alive. I would like to see all the special rules and psychic powers because that seems to be there big things. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684494 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMan Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Kinda dumb how they have a giant robot and yet the pilot sits exposed on the front of it. Can't wait to see some Mechanicus conversions made out of this thing, though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684495 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Kinda dumb how they have a giant robot and yet the pilot sits exposed on the front of it. Can't wait to see some Mechanicus conversions made out of this thing, though. Although I don't like the way it looks, I don't have an issue with him being "exposed". He is after all in terminator armor. So if he's exposed in the DK he is exposed while on foot in termie armor. The DK armor gives him extra toughness so he's actually better off. I just can't buy into the look of it. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v365/hansmannstein/baby-carrier.jpg I'm thinking of using some type of ruin with 4 terminators standing at the base. Will magnetize the weapons and termies as the dread knight take wounds. (I'm thinking of doing count as relictors so they wouldn't have DK's anyway) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684511 Share on other sites More sharing options...
momosgarage Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Also has anyone considered why a Nemesis Dreadknight would be needed or used instead of a dreadnought? Why have both? Whats the point? Seems entirely redundant. Meh. I kinda like the idea of a super suit for a super suit to go and slay all your big nasties for leas points than your squad of plain old super suits. Then you must be the 5 year old I was talking about earlier. Its not a knock on you specifically, the idea is plain uninspired and doesn't cater to a customer like me. No biggie I suppose, GW already fired customers like me, a long time ago. The first, "super-suit" for a "super-suit": http://dwtoyspot.blogspot.com/2009/07/cms-...30-gordian.html http://www.collectiondx.com/node/211 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordian_Warrior per wikipedia: "The pilot Daigo Otaki controls a small almost human-sized robot suit named Protteser. Each time Protteser is in trouble, he jumps into the next biggest robot container named Delinger. Then finally the largest suit is Garbin" I know because I had this toy, I'm sure the youngsters have never heard of or seen Gordian. LAME <_< Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684513 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Also has anyone considered why a Nemesis Dreadknight would be needed or used instead of a dreadnought? Why have both? Whats the point? Seems entirely redundant. Meh. I kinda like the idea of a super suit for a super suit to go and slay all your big nasties for leas points than your squad of plain old super suits. Then you must be the 5 year old I was talking about earlier. Its not a knock on you specifically, the idea is plain uninspired and doesn't cater to a customer like me. No biggie I suppose, GW already fired customers like me, a long time ago. The first, "super-suit" for a "super-suit": http://dwtoyspot.blogspot.com/2009/07/cms-...30-gordian.html http://www.collectiondx.com/node/211 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordian_Warrior per wikipedia: "The pilot Daigo Otaki controls a small almost human-sized robot suit named Protteser. Each time Protteser is in trouble, he jumps into the next biggest robot container named Delinger. Then finally the largest suit is Garbin" I know because I had this toy, I'm sure the youngsters have never heard of or seen Gordian. LAME <_< I think the concept is fine, but they didn't pull it off model wise. Dreadknight does not remind me of any of the cartoon stuff you posted. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684542 Share on other sites More sharing options...
momosgarage Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Dreadknight does not remind me of any of the cartoon stuff you posted. The concept is pretty clear, I assume you have never seen the show or toy. Guy uses "super-suit", if the enemy is too tough he puts on a tougher "super-suit" on top, and if he still can handle the job he puts on the final "superist-suit" on top of the other two. I don't know of any other show that had the "Matryoshka doll super-suit" concept besides Gordian. Would you prefer I call the "Nemesis Dreadknight", the "Matryoshka-doll-super-suit". It really is all the same, no stretch needed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684558 Share on other sites More sharing options...
raven guard 1369 Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 Dreadknight over dreadnought is kinda simple I think. 4 wounds t7 from what I heard so it's gonna take more than 1 good shot with lascannon or melta. In a way it's more survivable. It's purpose is to slay greater demons and demon princes. Did you want GW to give the GK a version of the furioso? I started this thread thinking it would be crap but from what I've read it will serve it's purpose. Hopefully for more than 130 pts but yea Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684581 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Dreadknight does not remind me of any of the cartoon stuff you posted. The concept is pretty clear, I assume you have never seen the show or toy. Guy uses "super-suit", if the enemy is too tough he puts on a tougher "super-suit" on top, and if he still can handle the job he puts on the final "superist-suit" on top of the other two. I don't know of any other show that had the "Matryoshka doll super-suit" concept besides Gordian. Would you prefer I call the "Nemesis Dreadknight", the "Matryoshka-doll-super-suit". It really is all the same, no stretch needed. I've seen other shows like it. Concept similar=yes The actual look and feel=no but just my humble opinion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684608 Share on other sites More sharing options...
raven guard 1369 Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 So of the new GK stuff what else is new? I'm assuming the personal teleporters that can move the squad once per game and the paladins who basically look like termie command squad. And the psilencer because in all my reading I never heard of it. And in all this dreadknight talk has anybody started hoping that their new SC's rules aren't broken? s5 normal S10 against demons and can make dreadknights score or he can make dreadnoughts scout? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684634 Share on other sites More sharing options...
calgar101 Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 At least coming up names for them wont be so hard, will name my first 3 Optimus Prime, Bumble Bee and Iron Hide. All painted in their respective colours and with the Autobot symbol :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/224377-nemesis-dreadknight/page/2/#findComment-2684646 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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