IA: Foe Eaters - WIP

[Malthe]

Hello ladies and gentlemen of the Liber!

 

After having completely re-drafted and re-posted my chapter a couple times I have now chosen a new modus operandi for this round of the Foe Eaters!

Instead of typing out a full IA and then submitting it for review, this time I will post parts of the final text and work with your feedback one section at a time.

As of March 9th this post contains the Homeworld and Beliefs section of IA: Foe Eaters, along with a brief outline of the chapter and some of my work-notes.

I hope you will take the time to comment upon what I've got this far!

 

As of March 20th I have updated this post, mostly with minor editing and the addition of a 'Recruitment' section

 

_______________________________

 

Outline and Notes

The Foe Eaters are a 7th founding chapter of Sanguinius' lineage.

Historically they have earned a reputation for themselves by fighting the Orks of Charadon and other enemies of the Imperium in the soutwest of Segmentum Ultima.

They fight with a fereocity and brutality almost akin to that of their main foe; the Orks.

The Foe Eaters consider themselves Pilgrims of the Lord Emperor and are obsessed with the concept of martyrdom.

Lately they have been invovled in some kind of incident which have devastated their previously good relationship with the Forge World of Accatran and caused them to completely re-exaimen their philosophy and combate doctrine.

Recently they have taken a home world, for the first time in chapter history and are determined not to be undone by any adversary.

I also envision a disagreement between the young chapter master and the 1st company captain, each of whom is lobbying for support within the chapter.

 

Main concept:

 

The Foe Eaters are a chapter cursed with an unstable gene-seed which prevents them from living up to their own ideals of purity and duty to the Imperium.

More so than this the chapter have recently angered the Adeptus Mechanicus and are thus permanently short on supplies.

In order to deal with these problems the chapter have recently taken a home world for the first time in their existence and have reformed their combat doctrines.

The chapter refuse to be undone and have taken unorthodox measures in order to uptake supplies and experience for their neophytes.

 

 

 

_____________________________

 

His Red Right Hand

 

The Foe Eaters

7th Founding Blood Angels successors

 

Origins

At the end of the 32th millennium, before the Curse of Sanguinius became fully manifest in his children and his holy gene-seed fell out of use, the Foe Eaters were created as part of the seventh founding of Space Marines. Destined to be victims of blood-thirst and terrible fury, like every other successor of the Blood Angels, the Foe Eaters fights the Flaw within their souls to this very day.

 

Jakonov VI

Edited March 20, 2011 by Malthe

[Ferrata]

Some interesting concepts. I know most BA successors are going to be relatively old, but I am not sure if it needs to be as old as you have them. Most of the chapter's history seems to be focused on the last millenia at the longest, so too much time before hand is just going to seem wasted.

 

A few points jump out:

Typical BA succesor but no death company, since only veterans are permitted to die. See Beliefs section for details.

The Death Company isn't an option, it isn't something the other chapters decide to do. Basically, it is choice between putting a bullet in the marines head or sending him into battle. Scouts will sometimes fall to the curse, as do veterans.

[Malthe]

You are quite right on both accounts and I thank you for taking the time to comment :lol:

 

With regards to the founding:

I am considering 3th to 7th, as they should all be old enough for the knowlegde of the Curse of Sanguinius to be largely unknown and thus not a reason for the AdMech to avoid the Blood Angel gene-seed when growing a new chapter.

Deciding on 3th or 4th and keeping the parent chapter unknown is mostly a darling of mine, indicating that they are either decendants of the Flesh Teares or the Flesh Eaters. Both the chapter name and eventually their colours will be somewhat related to these two chapters.

However when thinking it over I realize that the Foe Eaters could easily be decendent from either, without being of a subsequent founding, as long as the founding number is indeed early enough that those two chapters havn't had time to get as infamous a reputation as they have in 999.M41...

It'll probably settle around the sixth or seventh founding, then.

 

 

Regarding your point about the Death Company, you have hit the nail on the head! The Foe Eaters do infact 'put a bullet in the head' of those who fall to the Black Rage before achieving veteran status (after the Sanguinary Priesthood are finished experimenting with them of course!).

Forfeiting your life without permission is about as great a sin a Foe Eater can commit, and violators of this tradition are executed (posthumously if needed be) and their names removed from chapter records.

 

All of this is not clearly stated yet, as I havn't actually gotten around to writing that part of the IA yet, but it will be expanded upon, and will be one of the major concepts of the chapter.

 

 

Once again, thank you for commenting!

Kind regards

- Malthe

 

 

p.s. Love your Wings of Death by the way, a great original concept and a very good read!

Edited March 9, 2011 by Malthe

[Ferrata]

Planing on keeping exact founding chapter unknown, but it will definately be a 2nd or 3th succesors of Blood Angels. Should I decide on a specific one, or is it okay to have this lost to the ravage of time?

There are three ways you can go with this:

1. Tell us the founding chapter. Nice piece of information, but unless it plays a role in the chapter - what's the point?
   
2. Tell us it is unknown. This reeks of I can't be bothered even if you can. Again, unless it plays a role in the chapter.
   
3. Don't tell us anything. We won't go "But who were they founded from?" Because most of the time it is useless information. This is better then saying it is unknown.
   

 

In simple turns, don't tell us you don't know something if we don't need to know that you don't know it. You don't tell a stranger on the street that you don't like pie unless they are offering you pie :D

 

p.s. Love your Wings of Death by the way, a great original concept and a very good read!

Why thankyou, they were a lot of hard work but I am very pleased with the end result :D

[Darkchild130]

So do they actually eat their foes?

 

Darkchild

[Malthe]

Well, yeah, I suppose... For energy or information.

But so do the Imperial Fists.

The name is mostly metaphorical.

I wanted something that would sound scary to their opponents.

 

And once again, thank you for your pointers Ferretta, it's a plesuere drawing on your experience!

Edited March 10, 2011 by Malthe

[Darkchild130]

Thanks, thats what I wanted to know. didnt know if it was for intimidation or, like the Flesh Tearers who eat people.

 

Darkchild

[NightrawenII]

Overall, I like this, mainly because I love duality and hopeless struggle. :lol:

 

Just few notes:

- How could someone, who values duty above all, embark on vainglorious crusade?

- Your Marines believe strongly in purity, duty and discipline. Yet, their recruting stock are criminals and gangers...?

- This, "Roughly stated the creed of Astydamas insists that the life of each and every Astarte belongs to their Father the Emperor and must be earned by the Astarte through arduous travail." contradicts this, "Combat Doctrine - Traditionally vainglorious"

 

Your Marines should be humble not flamboyant.

Edited March 10, 2011 by NightrawenII

[Malthe]

I'm glad you're satisfied with my answer Darkchild.

Truth is, I think the picture of Astartes eating thier foes is a very cool one. But I don't see any philosophical reason for Astartes to do this, only strategical reasons.

So yeah, the name of the Foe Eaters is mostly for intimidation.

 

And thanks for your interest, by the way, I'm happy you took your time to read this!

Do you perhaps, as a Flesh Tearer propper, have any advice for my DYI chapter?

I'm especially looking for feedback on the beliefs section, and I'd really apreciate some know-how, from a Son of Sanguinius ^_^

________________________

 

Hey Nightrawen, thanks for your feedback :devil:

I'll go over it in quotes, as you have made a number of points, that I will try to address:

 

- How could someone, who values duty above all, embark on vainglorious crusade?

It's a very good question and one I am seriously considering myself!

The idea behind the 'vainglorious crusade' is that the previous chapter master (and really most of the chapter) was of a different philosophy than the current.

The rough story is that the chapter's beliefs historically have centered about the notion of martyrdom as the ultimate (and only propper) end of a warrior.

At some point around 700.M41 the chapter faces some sort of defeat (due to their own failiure) which leads the prideful chapter to embark upon a penitient crusade to hide their shame and to prove their dedication to the Emperor. Then after some 200 years the chapter have taken many blows and is on the verge of extinction when the chapter master falls in battle and a new one is chosen.

The new chapter master has a different philosophy than the former (which is why he is chosen by the Resclusium and the Sang. Priesthood) and reforms the chapter in line with the beliefs section in this article.

All of this is of course not written yet, and thus does not yet figure in the original post. Hence the confusion.

 

Problem is I'm not completly sure this is the way I want to do this. Perhaps it would be cooler for the chapter to have always been like they are today, forever enduring and, as you said, humble...

But I really do want to focus on the recent changes that has happend with the chapter and how they deal with it.

Decissions, decissions... Do you have a suggestion?

 

- Your Marines believe strongly in purity, duty and discipline. Yet, their recruting stock are criminals and gangers...?

I have considered that the Foe Eaters might ritually execute their recruits and then have them reborn as children of Sanguinius. They are offered to drink of his blood after all, could be nice and symbolic.

Then they are no longer criminals, but holy warriors and sons of their true father.

Does this satisfy as an explanation?

 

- This, "Roughly stated the creed of Astydamas insists that the life of each and every Astarte belongs to their Father the Emperor and must be earned by the Astarte through arduous travail." contradicts this, "Combat Doctrine - Traditionally vainglorious"

 

The keyword is 'traditionally' as in; 'no longer'. Of course you had no way of knowing ^_^

Otherwise I think this point ties in with the one I answered above.

 

 

Again thank you for taking your time, it really does mean a lot!

Especially to the finished result ;)

 

____________________________

 

@ Ferrata

 

That is a very good piece of advice!

I think I will take it to heart and not mention the founding chaper of the Foe Eaters, as per your #3

Either that or I will have to cook something up with one of either the Flesh Tearers or Flesh Eaters...

We'll see :)

 

___________________

 

 

As a final note:

I a very happy you have all taken your time to read and reply, your feedback is invaluable!

But, I was wondering if you had any comments specifically to the Home World or Beliefs section?

I'd like to really work those two through before continuing on the next sections, and I would very much like some feedback on the subject matter!

 

Cheers all!

- Malthe

[Malthe]

I've thought about painting them these colours, by the way:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm.php?b62c=@hIAEG_hk8Yt.hozqS_______i8y3o_hyvFn@@hLL9JhYbiB@@@@@@@@@@@haLvy_haLvy_@@@@@@@@@@..@@@___@@_____.iakk7&grid=TRUE

 

What do you think?

[NightrawenII]

Problem is I'm not completly sure this is the way I want to do this. Perhaps it would be cooler for the chapter to have always been like they are today, forever enduring and, as you said, humble...

But I really do want to focus on the recent changes that has happend with the chapter and how they deal with it.

Decissions, decissions... Do you have a suggestion?

No, sorry. ;)

This decision is only yours. ;)

 

I have considered that the Foe Eaters might ritually execute their recruits and then have them reborn as children of Sanguinius. They are offered to drink of his blood after all, could be nice and symbolic.

Then they are no longer criminals, but holy warriors and sons of their true father.

Does this satisfy as an explanation?

Not exactly...

Why do they deserve such an honor? I don't think the Foe Eaters were/are impressed by their behaviour. "Purity in Deed!" and all the rock'n'roll. This "messiah" complex is mystery to me.

 

The colour scheme looks "suspiciously" similar to the Flesh Tearers one.

Edited March 12, 2011 by NightrawenII

[Darkchild130]

I think they look like Flesh Tearers.

 

For Sons of Sanguinius, I would emphasise blood rituals as part of their beliefs, as being vampirical, blood is everything. (though some have attributed these rituals to the onset of the black rage, so this could be counter productive).

 

I also think you are barking up the wrong tree with martyrdom. Sanguinius attacked Horus KNOWING he would die, in order to make an opening for the Emperor.

 

That is an epic example of martyrdom, and as sons of Sanguinius they should worship that act, as it literally defines them.

 

You must also decide what 'kind' of successor they are.

Are they arty farty, Blood Angel types, or ragged, battered looking Flesh Tearer types? Or maybe something in between (which I would advise against as the middle ground will make you look like an Ultramarine successor)

I'm thinking the latter in your case, as they rely on "dogged efficiency".

 

I Think so far they seem like Flesh Tearers with more self control. I feel you need to really emphasise the martyrdom aspect to make them stand out.

 

Darkchild

[Malthe]

First of, thanks for the replies guys!

I have cooked up an alternativ paint scheme, but it is still rather close to the Flesh Tearer's.

It is, in part intentional, both because I like the suggested familiarity and because I quite like the Flesh Tearer's paint scheme :)

 

Right, here goes:

 

For Sons of Sanguinius, I would emphasise blood rituals as part of their beliefs, as being vampirical, blood is everything. (though some have attributed these rituals to the onset of the black rage, so this could be counter productive).

 

If think I'll make a mention (perhaps in a sidebar?) of something akin to the Eucharist/Communion as part of the Foe Eaters' rituals.

It's already part of Blood Angel fluff, and I feel it could be explored.

 

I also think you are barking up the wrong tree with martyrdom. Sanguinius attacked Horus KNOWING he would die, in order to make an opening for the Emperor.

 

That is an epic example of martyrdom, and as sons of Sanguinius they should worship that act, as it literally defines them.

 

Well, the point is they do! They just happen to believe that it is something to be earned through a lifetime of service, rather than done recklessly.

 

You must also decide what 'kind' of successor they are.

Are they arty farty, Blood Angel types, or ragged, battered looking Flesh Tearer types? Or maybe something in between (which I would advise against as the middle ground will make you look like an Ultramarine successor)

I'm thinking the latter in your case, as they rely on "dogged efficiency".

 

Actually I am definitely going for the in between option ;)

The Blood Angles are great artificers to be sure, but they are also a bloodthirsty bounch forever strugling with a curse that threatens to eat up their mind everytime they go to war...

Honestly I think this complexity is what makes them so interesting.

Also the chapter will have a history for craftmanship, stemming from the 'religious' art of the chapter. But they are brutal as :cuss: hates non-believers with a passion and have serious temper problems ;)

 

I Think so far they seem like Flesh Tearers with more self control. I feel you need to really emphasise the martyrdom aspect to make them stand out.

 

I will, never fear! But thanks for pointing it out to me :)

 

_______________

 

@ Nightrawen

 

Fair point, of course the desicion is mine to make! I was just wondering if you (or anyone else) had any experience with either of the two options that could be of value.

 

With regards to recruitment:

I'm not sure I agree with you. The Imperial Fists recruite from gangs on Necromunda, the Blood Angels themselves recruite from mutant scavengers and there are plenty more examples in official cannon.

Most chapters, as far as I recall, disregards the past of a recruite from the moment of initiation.

Also they ganger-children of Bedrock prove themselves by surviving life on Bedrock, and then only the finest examples are taken as potential recruits.

And there does actually exist somekind of honour and loyalty among thieves, you know :P

 

Anyhow; I'll stick with the youth-gangs, but I haven't really decided on what kind of trials the potential recruite has to go through before initiation.

I think there will be room for some explanation in that area :)

 

 

Cheers all and thanks for the replies!

[NightrawenII]

With regards to recruitment:

I'm not sure I agree with you. The Imperial Fists recruite from gangs on Necromunda, the Blood Angels themselves recruite from mutant scavengers and there are plenty more examples in official cannon.

Most chapters, as far as I recall, disregards the past of a recruite from the moment of initiation.

Also they ganger-children of Bedrock prove themselves by surviving life on Bedrock, and then only the finest examples are taken as potential recruits.

And there does actually exist somekind of honour and loyalty among thieves, you know :P

*Shrug*

Well, to me the Bedrock looks like exact opposite of Foe Eaters ideology. -_-

[Malthe]

It's funny you should say that, as the planet, in my mind, is a very concrete metaphor for the chapter itself.

The ancient days of prosperity, destroyed by the hands of those who dwelled there, with Rogue Traders desperate to squeez out the last bit of riches.

The Overseers desperately trying to maintain controle of a tough rebelious population who wants something more.

Do you see my point?

 

And yes, the Foe Eaters would probably prefer only to recruit from children of pilgrim and fanatics, but unfortunately they cannot allow themselves the luxury of waiting for a Children's Crusade to come along, ripe for recruitment. Though that would be kind of cool :P

As it is, they are stuck with Bedrock, course it's all they can afford to do. Luckily the planet produces both strong recruits and minerals for the chapter forges.

And if the Priesthood of the Blood Angels can make a Space Marine out of a radioactive-poisened mutant, surely the Foe Eaters' can make just as fine a recruit from an adolecent ganger.

There is plenty of precedence, after all.

 

Also I would like to share what, along with Christian symbology, is actually my main source of inspiration:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUpTJg2EBpw...feature=related

 

I hope I'm not the only one who can see the similarities between Ernie Ford and the Foe Eaters -_-

 

 

As always comments are more than welcome!

Cheers guys!

[Malthe]

Updated first post today, March 20th.

 

Mostly some minor editing and the addition of a recruitment section; as Nightrawen had a point in questioning it.

 

Feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers all!

[Aqui]

I can't really add anything else that everyone else has mentioned except to may suggest that:

 

 

“Have He not commanded you? Be strong and courageous. Do not be afraid; do not be discouraged, for He your Father is with you wherever you go.”

 

 

Might read/sound better as:

 

"Hath He not commanded you? Be strong and courageous! Be not afraid! Do not be discouraged! For He is your Father and is with you wherever you go"

 

Only a suggestion though <_<

[Malthe]

Hi mate, thanks for reading!

 

I've actually copy/pasted that line directly from the first chapter of Joshua, and I quite like the sound of the New International Version.

Personally I admire the complete lack of exclamation marks, it is as if they are not needed for the messenge to ge through :)

[Brother Michaels]

I've thought about painting them these colours, by the way:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/sm.php?b62c=@hIAEG_hk8Yt.hozqS_______i8y3o_hyvFn@@hLL9JhYbiB@@@@@@@@@@@haLvy_haLvy_@@@@@@@@@@..@@@___@@_____.iakk7&grid=TRUE

 

What do you think?

 

they look like flesh tearers

[The_son_of_Dorn]

my thoughts too

 

Problem is red is a hard colour to a get a good match to, only white and black & gold really go with it, so i suggest red everything but make the lower boots black and keep the helmet black.

[Malthe]

Hi folks, thanks for commenting!

 

I have a colour change in mind, but I want to tweek it a bit more before posting it for review. Thanks for your input though, it's always nice :D

 

 

With that in the works: I'm thinking of upping the cannibal-aspect of the Foe Eaters.

I've always been fasinated with that aspect of Christianity and given the nature of Sanguinius gene-seed I think it's very appropriate.

Not quite sure how to do it though, it's more of a vibe-thing than something defining for the chapter, I think... Hmm.

 

Anyone have any experience with this sort of thing?

Have you seen someone, succesfully, use cannibalisem (and blood drinking) as an element of an IA?

 

If so please do point me in the right direction :D

The same goes for bad experience, by the way, if you think it's a horrible idea, please do tell!

 

 

Cheers

- Malthe

[NightrawenII]

Well, Mortifactors spring to mind, official Chapter with cannibalism vibe.