christheodorou Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 im having real difficultly deciding on either taking a Land raider or a stormraven for my Bloodangels army. Either way the transport is going to be carrying a 5 man assault terminator squad, but i really can decide on whats best Im fielding a full jump pack force 2x ten man assualt squad and a 9 man death company with a recluisarch so a storm raven would fit in nicely with overall theme of a fast hard hitting force, but everything i have read points to a storm raven being an utter fire magnet, an oppenent seeing your lovely stormraven on the board, screaming and shooting at it till it dies, unless you can get the first turn that is. I wanted my transport to be able to destroy vehicles once its dropped its payload and the landraider or the stormraven can both forefill the hunter killer role. A stormraven is the sligtly cheaper option at 215pts with extra armour over the 250pts for a landraider, but at arnour 12 makes it quite fragile to incoming heavy weapons fire, (i know in my imperial guard army i field a lascannon heavy weapons platoon next to my command squad, order bring it down to twin linked the lascannons and thats one dead stromraven in my opinion. Having thought about it do i try and find 105pts from somewhere and include Brother Corbulo and his far seeing eye special rule giving me a reroll for the first turn? At least with tha landraider the all round armour of 14 means youve got a damn good chance of weathering the storm Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedemptionNL Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 You might get more (meaningful) responses in the Blood Angels forum. One important advantage the Stormraven has over the Land Raider, especially in a Blood Angels army, is the ability to transport Dreadnoughts and Jump Infantry. But yeah, they tend to be fire magnets, especially as they're hard to hide out of line of sight. Reserving them if you don't have first turn is a popular solution though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2698619 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brovius Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 He may have posted here, knowing our experience with Land Raiders (spamming them being the only solution for compettiive GKs using C:DH) could be of use. Storm Ravens can be pretty effective, but only if you are carrying jump infantry. I wouldn't bother with anything else, because if you make the Storm Raven move flat-out and it gets immobilised or worse, you lose the occupants. At least jump troops can bail out rather safely during the flat-out move. Land Raiders are not that much more expensive, and much more reliable for shrugging off firepower. Crusader/Redeemer pattterns are particularly vulnerable, as they are charging headlong into the threat range of many various weapons tooled to kill AV14. Godhammer pattern LRs are always a solid choice, but are for more of a fire support role than a transport option. If you think you can tie up lance or melta-equivalent weapons in assault before the LRC/LRR gets to the enemy lines, then they can be a solid choice. Otherwise, SRs ferrying Assault Marines will likely be the best option. Maybe wed the two ideas, 2XSRs with jump infantry, and a single Crusader or Redeemer holding the DC squad. Flat-out the SRs, bail the occupants towards the end of the SR's movement, and bring up the LR behind. If you move at cruising speed with the LRC/LRR, you'll be half-way across the board, with the Assault Marines a good 6-12" closer to the enemy's lines. Combined with a Drop Pod assault to give the enemy more immediate targets, this could be a potentially damaging and in-your-face list for BAs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2698743 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall666 Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 I am missing my BRB, but i didnt think u lost the occupants... Is it not take a would on a 4+ ? with saves allowed? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2699101 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredegar Kadere Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 If a flat-out vehicle is immobilized on its player turn, all occupants are destroyed. In a regular game the only way for that to happen is if the Raven ends in difficult terrain and rolls a 1 on its test. It is possible in Apocalypse and in certain special scenario/missions for the enemy to shoot you during your turn, in which case an immobilize results means the death of those inside. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2699298 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vindicatus Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 I believe he may also be referring to the fact that if normal troops disembark after flat-out movement, you have to do a whole lot of rolling for dangerous terrain to get them on the ground via scatter (which could end poorly). Jump Infantry make a controlled descent, and do not scatter upon jumping out of the aircraft, similar to our interceptor squads. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2699304 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall666 Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 Yeah, thats what i thought, It believed it was to prevent people like Dark Eldar from suicide ramming or tankshocking their opponenets at Flat-out speed, and then being able to assault in the next phase as they didnt technically disembark ... I am currently building a dual Storm Raven Grey Knights List, Led by a Librarian with shrouding (3+ Coversave :)) . In a 1000pts game where i only fit one in i have been pleasantly suprised at its survivability and if i manage to take out an expensive tank with the MM at the end of its move, all the better. On a side note, That definately sounds like another good reason for me to avoid ever playing apocalypse. Nothing personal i just find that game to slide further along the whoever has the biggest wallet wins heh. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2699308 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Johnson the 3rd jr Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 Stormravens, plural, in a new GK list could work pretty dang good, especially with Shrouding, provided you go first. Even then you'd want other things out there to worry the enemy so they don't focus all of their fire on one raven (or if they do they pay the price). If you go second, what then? Reserving them "works", but not *nearly* as well as going first. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2699456 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall666 Posted March 23, 2011 Share Posted March 23, 2011 Yeah the not going first is a killer... And of course when u think u are going first they can always sieze the initiative anyway and that could be some real trouble. If that happened so that both SR's were shot down first turn id probably go for a more war of attrition, using my mid range shooting of the psycannons and hunker down in mid table cover to protect against heavy weapons and contest objectives (as 2/3 chance thats what the scenario will be around) Keeping them in reserve is an option depending on how much heavy fire im against, of course the only thing that i can use as definite cover for my stormraven.. is the other storm raven... so i'd plan on using one stormraven to obscure the other one and still with shrouding it will get a 3+ cover and 6+ cover for the one infront (which will contain less important troops). The plan would be in the one that is covered (and hopefully survives..) to deliver its payload including librarian who can then "summon" the unit that was stranded by loosing their transport in the following turn. I agree though getting second turn with a Dual SR list can be a scary prospect. Just my 2 cents, Marshall Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2699465 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 You can lose Raider's just as easily with the abundance of Melta and Lance stuff about. No reason to hold them in the backfield, get them up close and use cover if you arent Boosting Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225484-storm-raven-or-land-raider/#findComment-2699547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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