Speed Painting Grey Knights?

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

Apparently my internet search-fu is weak, because I can't seem to find the answer to my question. I want a silver spray paint to basecoat my new Grey Knights. I have heard that some metallic spray paints are often hard to paint over, like the paint doesn't stick to it properly. So I am wondering if you guys know of a silver spray paint that can be used as a basecoat? Thanks!

[henrywalker]

i am planning to use army painter plate mail. i loike their sprays generally but i have never used this one so don' take my word for it.

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

i am planning to use army painter plate mail. i loike their sprays generally but i have never used this one so don' take my word for it.

 

Oy. Didn't realize they had a silver. Bit expensive, but if washes and paint can be applied over it without any trouble, that may be the way to go. (Although I always assume a cheaper alternative is out there somewhere. It is easy enough to prime black with Krylon for $3 and then use a suitable silver (if there is one), rather than $15 primer / basecoat hybrid for AP.

[Durus]

The Army Painter spray dries matte even though it's a metal paint (Which to my understanding, most metal sprays do not, which makes painting over them harder). I saw the GK's at one of the stores around here basecoated with it and washed with a diluted blue. Seems to work fine in terms of painting.

 

You could also use a cheaper metal spray and matte varnish them so you can paint properly over the basecoat. But then you might as well just get a more expensive spray to begin with and spray them just once.

 

Anyway, what you should be looking for are matte paints. Which reminds me that Tamya also has some metal sprays. But I doubt they are cheaper than the AP stuff. Mh... :tu:

[daismith906]

Army painter plate metal works a treat as a undercoat, painted all my silver skulls SM & some grey knights using it.

 

For best results once sprayed basecoat it with watered down metal paint of your choice i.e boltgun metal etc to get a nice smoooth finish to apply your washes.

[Fred Johnson the 3rd jr]

For best results once sprayed basecoat it with watered down metal paint of your choice i.e boltgun metal etc to get a nice smoooth finish to apply your washes.

 

Wait wait wait. What? I thought the whole point of Army painter spray paints is that they are primers and basecoats in one. If I have to go back and paint a metal basecoat, even if it is a thin one, what is the point of using a fancy spray?

[Olis]

Er... less labour? :P

[Brother Valerius]

I agree with Fred Johnson. If you have to go over the metal undercoat with a basecoat of normal metallic paint, it's just as much work as doing the same basecoat over black/white undercoat... so what would be the point?

 

I figure I'll try without the added hand painting of a basecoat, if I ever do GK, and see how it goes. As Fred Johnson noted, the paint is designed to be a primer and basecoat in one... it can't be THAT bad to paint on top of.

[daismith906]

For best results once sprayed basecoat it with watered down metal paint of your choice i.e boltgun metal etc to get a nice smoooth finish to apply your washes.

 

Wait wait wait. What? I thought the whole point of Army painter spray paints is that they are primers and basecoats in one. If I have to go back and paint a metal basecoat, even if it is a thin one, what is the point of using a fancy spray?

 

I said "For Best Results" to apply a watered down metla paint of your choice as this as a nice smoth coat that sometimes spray base coating doesnt & adds some extra depth & shading to the mini ready for whatever you want to do next.

 

The spray works fine on its own, but for an extra 2-3 minutes work the benefits are imo worth it :rolleyes: !

[DV8]

Sad really when an extra step in basecoating metallics (especially silver, arguably one of the easiest colors to paint) becomes extraneous labor that musters up cries of "good heavens" and "ye gads!"

 

:)

 

 

DV8

[Brother Valerius]

That's not fair, DV8. This isn't about laziness. This is simply a matter of: if you buy a special spray to allow you to easily basecoat, and then you have to throw down a basecoat anyway, what's the point? Why shouldn't I simply hand paint the basecoat on and save myself the cost of the special spray? That's not being lazy, that's simply recognizing when there's no point to buying an extra tool.

[Whitefireinferno]

Because the use of the watered down basecoat over the Special silver spray helps flatten the colour and if you don't ham fist it on it will help shade and give the mini depth.

 

Hell if you don't want your army to look good by taking time on it why not just use sprue grey?

[Brother Valerius]

You're not reading what I'm saying. The point isn't "it's silly to hand paint if I spray", it's "it's silly to buy a spray if I need to hand paint anyway".

[DV8]

Because it's stupid to assume that one can achieve anything other than mediocre results with a simple spray and wash. If anything, why not cut to the root of the problem (instead of buying a different colored spray for all your armies, invest in an airbrush and you'll have access to "sprays" of virtually any color)?

 

If applying another "basecoat" on top of a sprayed color achieves a better looking result, why not do it? You've already spent so much money on your models, heaven forbid you have to spend a little extra time to get them looking presentable.

 

But hey, what do I know...

 

 

DV8

[pingo]

If applying another "basecoat" on top of a sprayed color achieves a better looking result, why not do it? You've already spent so much money on your models, heaven forbid you have to spend a little extra time to get them looking presentable.

 

The poor guy was just confused why a coloured basecoat might be desirable when the mini had just been sprayed with that colour. No offence, but you seem to be overreacting.

 

It's an understandable confusion. Not everyone is very knowledgable about the hobby. I don't think he was denying it might be a good idea for 'best results', he simply did not understand why.

 

If someone asks questions on the General PCA Questions forum, should we not answer in friendly manner rather than make them feel like an idiot for asking?

[DV8]

If someone asks questions on the General PCA Questions forum, should we not answer in friendly manner rather than make them feel like an idiot for asking?

 

Touche. Fair enough, I shall rephrase.

 

The United States Marine Corps has a saying that I absolutely love: "Slow is steady. Steady is fast. Fast is good."

 

Yes, using spray paints to achieve some form of basecoat is all well and good, it does cut time out of the process, but don't be so eager to simply "get" your models done and on the table (a lesson I learned over my many years as a painter and gamer). Better to get your models done right the first time through, and not end up hating them a week or a month later and redoing them!

 

Unless you're using an airbrush, it's difficult to match paint pots to spray colors. By basecoating Boltgun Metal (or other suitable silver color) over top a silver spray-coat is to achieve a uniformity of color, touch up areas not hit by the spray paint, as well as giving you a fallback color should you make a mistake and have to touch up the silver. By having a color that you can color match easily as the basecoat, it allows you to touch up with ease.

 

There is also the issue of control; a color applied by hand with a brush is far easier to control and manipulate than a color applied via aerosol.

 

 

DV8

[Tanhausen]

There is also the issue of control; a color applied by hand with a brush is far easier to control and manipulate than a color applied via aerosol.

DV8

 

You mean that the spray has a cone "landing area" whilst the brush only lays paints where my shaking hand intends?

 

I'm asking because I'm still learning how to fine-tune the use of my AB. I always end up with paints a bit too thin, which means a lot of paint comes out unless I "block" the rear screw...but then it takes of ages to build colour.

 

Yep, I'm in the "I need 3 colours" list.

[Brother Valerius]

The issue I'm having is not so much why one should lay down color by hand, but why one should bother with the spray. It's going to take just as long to cover the model in (insert color of choice here), whether you use the spray or not. To me, it seems like if you need to hand paint, then the spray is a waste of money. That's my hangup, and I'm trying to find out if there's any advantage at all to using the spray, because it doesn't seem so.

[DV8]

You mean that the spray has a cone "landing area" whilst the brush only lays paints where my shaking hand intends?

 

I'm asking because I'm still learning how to fine-tune the use of my AB. I always end up with paints a bit too thin, which means a lot of paint comes out unless I "block" the rear screw...but then it takes of ages to build colour.

 

Yep, I'm in the "I need 3 colours" list.

 

Well by aerosol I was referring specifically to spray paints, but even so yes you have more control with a brush simply because you lay down exactly where you want the paint. You can get close to that kind of control with an airbrush, but the smaller and finer the detail, the more the brush wins out.

 

In regards to your airbrush problem, it's difficult to say. Truth be told I'm still learning the ins and outs of mine as well, in addition to experimenting a lot with new techniques to "cut corners", so to speak (it's how I got my Wolfwing done so quickly!) You can try experimenting with less dilution in your paints, or increasing the air pressure of your compressor.

 

The issue I'm having is not so much why one should lay down color by hand, but why one should bother with the spray. It's going to take just as long to cover the model in (insert color of choice here), whether you use the spray or not. To me, it seems like if you need to hand paint, then the spray is a waste of money. That's my hangup, and I'm trying to find out if there's any advantage at all to using the spray, because it doesn't seem so.

 

Of course there is, similar to why you want to prime models in the first place! It gives the paint something to adhere to, and in some cases can be a quick way of laying down a base color before working on top. Of course on an individual scale it's kind of useless, but when you're painting armies, why not cut corners? If the results are good, it doesn't matter really how you got there! Keep in mind too that laying a basecolor down affects the colors laid on top of it. Obviously if you spray a model silver first, and then go back with Boltgun Metal, you'll be making less coats than if you were to apply Boltgun straight onto black primer (or white primer). So on a large scale it still does save you time and aggravation!

 

Of course, one shouldnt' cut corners and assume the spray is all you need (which is why I was attempting to be facetiously douchey before), but it is a tool that you may or may not want to use to make painting your army easier. Similar in principle to an airbrush. Why spend weeks and weeks basecoating by hand when you can accomplish the same thing in an hour with an airbrush?

 

 

DV8

[Tanhausen]

Doing my ravenwing right now and primed black and basing astronomican for the clear parts ( feathers and robes ). It took me 20 minutes by brush for 1 model... And 20 min for 15 models by AB.

 

The day I learn to wash by AB, Ill be a very happy man.