Grey Knights Chaplains

[henrywalker]

so why are there no grey knights chaplains? in the novels there are so why not in the codex?

[Whitefireinferno]

Is that not the role of the Brotherhood champion? he does the normal Re roll Chappies do But is better sure he don't make the Unit Fearless but that can be a good thing.

[Drachnon]

Isn't it because grey knights are incorruptable? No point having chaplains in a chapter that isn't susceptible.

[Redo]

Isn't it because grey knights are incorruptable? No point having chaplains in a chapter that isn't susceptible.

 

This sounds about right. Not a single Grey Knight has fallen to the temptations of Chaos...ever. Perhaps in their training each and every one of them recieves additional training that bares similarities to that of Chaplin?

[Lord Typhon]

Because the Codex writer probably thought they weren't needed as it would confuse new players;

 

Redshirt: Grey Knights are the incorruptable daemon killers of mankind.

Newguy: Why do they have chaplins then, why would incorruptable daemon killers need a priest?

Redshirt: Because it's cool

Newguy: ....huh?! *headexplodes*

 

Atm it's only a WIP codex anyway as far as i know, and thus not released and we can't comment on it because of this. We'll know by this time next week if this is actually the case.

[Whitefireinferno]

Heh it is the codex people will be getting as it is the ones in stores so yeah this is how it will be.

[SamaNagol]

Nothing is stopping you from modelling one. Just because they don't confer re-rolls to hit and Fearless doesn't mean they do not provide much needed guidance.

 

Just because no-one has ever fallen to chaos is no reason to take it for granted that no one ever will in future. I would say Chaplains in GK are even more important than in a Marine chapter. They face FAR greater tests of faith

[AoC]

Heh, first Grey Knight army list had Chaplains (and Librarian and Medics and Devastators and Assault Squads, and Inquisitors and Daemonhunters and Arbitres and Guardsman and Techmarines and Tacticals).

[Andrew B]

Nothing is stopping you from modelling one. Just because they don't confer re-rolls to hit and Fearless doesn't mean they do not provide much needed guidance.

 

Just because no-one has ever fallen to chaos is no reason to take it for granted that no one ever will in future. I would say Chaplains in GK are even more important than in a Marine chapter. They face FAR greater tests of faith

 

Well, not really. They are pretty much absolute in faith, they are prepared for any test of will they might face. Plus you have Brotherhood Champions act somewhat like Chaplains. And they are spelled chaplain, not chaplin.

[SamaNagol]

And might I ask as to HOW they become absolute in faith? Furthermore, there are clearly levels of absoluteness.... Purifiers have stronger faith than normal Grey Knights.

[Lord Typhon]

And they are spelled chaplain, not chaplin.

 

I know, mispelt deliberately because of it being a Newguy, along the lines of "Fabulous Billy" (Fabius Bile) and "A Bad One The Despoiler" (Abaddon The Despoiler). xD

[Andrew B]

And might I ask as to HOW they become absolute in faith? Furthermore, there are clearly levels of absoluteness.... Purifiers have stronger faith than normal Grey Knights.

 

Intensive training, they really are made to deal with such situations on a day to day basis, that means they should be prepared. And if you have never had signs of corruption in ten thousand years it is a pretty safe bet that they are as incorruptible as it gets.

 

Purifiers are a different story, they are focused on this strength of will, which makes them even less candidates for corruption. Not that signs would lead to a possible corruption with GK ranks, but as things are going pretty bad in the 41st millennium they could prove useful for future situation. Purifiers are another nail in the coffin for Chaplains, not an excuse for inducting any.

[Lord Typhon]

Having said all this, Grey Knight Chaplains DO exist...just not in the codex. Grey Knight Trilogy of books is one clear example as there's multiple conversations with a Grey Knight Chaplain; they're probably restricted to working with initiates to cause the unshakeable faith seen in full battlebrothers.

[Lord Clinto]

There is nothing saying you couldn't paint one of your Terminator "sergeants/captains" as a chaplain.

 

I did this with one of my brother-captains from the description in the GK novels and the original daemonhunter codex by painting his left arm black and his personal icon was a full black shield with a white skull transfer. Outfitted him with a thunder hammer to make him stand out a little more.

 

For all intents and purposes he was a brother-captain, though in my lists he was marked brother-chaplain.

[Legio Draconis]

I was thinking of converting a dread knight to represent a Chaplain. It would make no difference in game but thought it would look cool. He would still be in his babies carriage but, change the hammer to a crozious, use the metal Terminator chaplain in the harness and you are good to go.

[number6]

I was wondering when this old issue would raise its head again. ;) (And this is a VERY old debating point.)

 

To be brief: GKs aren't Space Marines. They don't follow the Codex: Astartes, they do what they want. They are also entirely incorruptible. The role of a Chaplain in the lesser Astartes chapters is to restore, renew, and rebuild faith in the Emperor among the battle brothers. To watch for the taint of heresy, treason, and chaos and do what they can to stamp it out before it takes strong root.

 

There is, quite simply, no need for that at all among the GKs. Their faith is never shaken. Never. And it is absolute. Always.

 

So no GK Chaplains. I don't care what Ben Counter says. :lol: Never liked his stuff anyway. :P

 

All that said, 40K is a wide open game. And there have been many on this board who have, in the past, tried to make a strong case for the existence of GK Chaplains. I remain unconvinced, but then again, this isn't my game, either. It is all of ours. If your switch is flipped by fielding a "GK Chaplain", please do so! Obviously there aren't any rules for them, but you could use another HQ unit to "count as" your Chaplain and go to town.

 

If you do follow this route, I expect pictures of your wonderful conversion as well as the justification. Why do this if it isn't fun, right? :)

[Andrew B]

I was wondering when this old issue would raise its head again. :lol: (And this is a VERY old debating point.)

 

To be brief: GKs aren't Space Marines. They don't follow the Codex: Astartes, they do what they want. They are also entirely incorruptible. The role of a Chaplain in the lesser Astartes chapters is to restore, renew, and rebuild faith in the Emperor among the battle brothers. To watch for the taint of heresy, treason, and chaos and do what they can to stamp it out before it takes strong root.

 

There is, quite simply, no need for that at all among the GKs. Their faith is never shaken. Never. And it is absolute. Always.

 

So no GK Chaplains. I don't care what Ben Counter says. :lol: Never liked his stuff anyway. :)

 

All that said, 40K is a wide open game. And there have been many on this board who have, in the past, tried to make a strong case for the existence of GK Chaplains. I remain unconvinced, but then again, this isn't my game, either. It is all of ours. If your switch is flipped by fielding a "GK Chaplain", please do so! Obviously there aren't any rules for them, but you could use another HQ unit to "count as" your Chaplain and go to town.

 

If you do follow this route, I expect pictures of your wonderful conversion as well as the justification. Why do this if it isn't fun, right? :)

 

You just got on my Christmas list.

[boreas]

I was wondering when this old issue would raise its head again. :lol: (And this is a VERY old debating point.)

 

To be brief: GKs aren't Space Marines. They don't follow the Codex: Astartes, they do what they want. They are also entirely incorruptible. The role of a Chaplain in the lesser Astartes chapters is to restore, renew, and rebuild faith in the Emperor among the battle brothers. To watch for the taint of heresy, treason, and chaos and do what they can to stamp it out before it takes strong root.

 

There is, quite simply, no need for that at all among the GKs. Their faith is never shaken. Never. And it is absolute. Always.

 

So no GK Chaplains. I don't care what Ben Counter says. :lol: Never liked his stuff anyway. :)

 

All that said, 40K is a wide open game. And there have been many on this board who have, in the past, tried to make a strong case for the existence of GK Chaplains. I remain unconvinced, but then again, this isn't my game, either. It is all of ours. If your switch is flipped by fielding a "GK Chaplain", please do so! Obviously there aren't any rules for them, but you could use another HQ unit to "count as" your Chaplain and go to town.

 

If you do follow this route, I expect pictures of your wonderful conversion as well as the justification. Why do this if it isn't fun, right? :)

 

Dude, you're completely wrong!!!

 

Oh, no wait... You're actually making sense in this great universe of GW-related forums :)

 

I vote for this as "Post of the Year".

 

Phil

 

ps, I like GK Chaplains :P I'm also happy I got GK techmarines and GK Librarians as I've been advocating them for a long time!

[AoC]

I was wondering when this old issue would raise its head again. :lol: (And this is a VERY old debating point.)

 

To be brief: GKs aren't Space Marines. They don't follow the Codex: Astartes, they do what they want. They are also entirely incorruptible. The role of a Chaplain in the lesser Astartes chapters is to restore, renew, and rebuild faith in the Emperor among the battle brothers. To watch for the taint of heresy, treason, and chaos and do what they can to stamp it out before it takes strong root.

 

There is, quite simply, no need for that at all among the GKs. Their faith is never shaken. Never. And it is absolute. Always.

 

So no GK Chaplains. I don't care what Ben Counter says. :lol: Never liked his stuff anyway. :)

 

All that said, 40K is a wide open game. And there have been many on this board who have, in the past, tried to make a strong case for the existence of GK Chaplains. I remain unconvinced, but then again, this isn't my game, either. It is all of ours. If your switch is flipped by fielding a "GK Chaplain", please do so! Obviously there aren't any rules for them, but you could use another HQ unit to "count as" your Chaplain and go to town.

 

If you do follow this route, I expect pictures of your wonderful conversion as well as the justification. Why do this if it isn't fun, right? :)

 

Small hint: Grey Knights are Space Marines.

 

(and they had chaplains in slave to darkness)

[Brother Captain Vain]

I was wondering when this old issue would raise its head again. :lol: (And this is a VERY old debating point.)

 

To be brief: GKs aren't Space Marines. They don't follow the Codex: Astartes, they do what they want. They are also entirely incorruptible. The role of a Chaplain in the lesser Astartes chapters is to restore, renew, and rebuild faith in the Emperor among the battle brothers. To watch for the taint of heresy, treason, and chaos and do what they can to stamp it out before it takes strong root.

 

There is, quite simply, no need for that at all among the GKs. Their faith is never shaken. Never. And it is absolute. Always.

 

So no GK Chaplains. I don't care what Ben Counter says. :lol: Never liked his stuff anyway. :down:

 

All that said, 40K is a wide open game. And there have been many on this board who have, in the past, tried to make a strong case for the existence of GK Chaplains. I remain unconvinced, but then again, this isn't my game, either. It is all of ours. If your switch is flipped by fielding a "GK Chaplain", please do so! Obviously there aren't any rules for them, but you could use another HQ unit to "count as" your Chaplain and go to town.

 

If you do follow this route, I expect pictures of your wonderful conversion as well as the justification. Why do this if it isn't fun, right? :)

Haha, im with you on most points, Mr. number6, especially since IM one of those members who made a strong case for GK chaplains wayyyyy back when. Why i do like much of Ben Counter's work (especially with Grey knights since there was little of the old lore to really make much of a story on, much less 3), i found the GK chaplain discussion to now be moot. Now that I have hands on experience with the new GK codex (my shop lets up play with the new rules with the promotional copy they had), the Grey Knight Librarian and Brotherhood champion has largely subsumed his role, both mechanically (ala rules) and background support (training of initiates, keeping of lore and sacred items, etc). See my previous topic, if its still available, as i go over this thoroughly there.

 

So, yea, i believe that with the new codex, the GK chaplain discussion is over and done. And To bring up any Black Library work as to why something should/should not exist, keep in mind that \

A: BL writers' have mostly free license to write in what they wish to make the story work, to a degree of course.

B: The time at which the story was written. As i stated, Ben Counter had to work with limited lore from 3.5 ed codex and earlier, and added some stuff to make the stories work. Heck, i have BL short stories that were written as far back as 2nd edition (Galaxy in Flames for those interested) which was based on very VERY old lore.

 

As dear Number 6 says, If your inspired to do something by what you read or see, then by all means go ahead. 40k was created with all the grey areas to encourage such actions to begin with, which is why many of us love this hobby. But the argument itself is, in my view, obsolete. Thank you and Good day.

[Brother Valerius]

To my understanding, chaplains are not merely for preventing the taint of chaos, but for exhorting their battle-brothers to fight harder, building up their fervor to even higher levels. To use a movie analogy, they are the guy who gives the epic speech just before the battle. It can also be presumed that even the most righteous of the Space Marines may benefit from a chaplain to bolster their faith.

 

I think the Grey Knights still would have a use for chaplains, it is simply not the exact same use another chapter might have.

[Oiad]

so why are there no grey knights chaplains? in the novels there are so why not in the codex?

 

As mentioned before, Counter's version of the Grey Knights mentioned the deployment of Chaplains (and SoD). By comparison to many other interpretations of the Grey Knights, Counter's seem more similar to a codex chapter. I'm not a fan of his approach but I would not stop you from taking favour of his version over other versions if you like it, as shouldn't anyone else. Besides, what's to say that the latest codex is inclusive of every unit the Grey Knight chapter deploys? If you prefer Chaplain models you could probably get away with using one that has been modified. Some players have mentioned that they would use a chaplain model when looking over the brotherhood-champion entry. He'd probably be your best bet to use the rules with.

[chaplainmeliadus]

People were also querying the point of Librarians in GKs, seeing as they're all psykers, so I think it unfair to dismiss Chaplains just because they're all pure. Look at how awesome the Librarians have turned out to be in this 'dex!

 

My personal idea is that GK chaplain would probably be more relic-keepers than defenders of the faith (as we already know, that's a redundant role), in the same way as I imagine GK Librarians would probably play more of a record and lore-keeping role, rather than than just the standard battlefield zappiness that normal libbys seem to play.