Techmarine Mini HQ

[Adir]

Is anyone considering using techmarines as mini HQ choices? Given that most of our HQ choices are TDA and can't jump on a rhino, the T/M might be able to help out.

 

For 100 points you get a guy with 2 power fist attacks, 1 power weapon attack, a plasma pistol, and rad grenades. Plus (for some reason) he can cast hammerhand.

 

So with a purifier squad, he can give them hammerhand while they cleansing flame or force weapon the enemy.

 

I included rad grenades as a cool upgrade but he can do any of the grenades and take cheaper servo skulls. Wounding marines on a 2+.... just like old times :thanks:

[Ashe Darke]

He's an Elite choice...

[biglou666]

I think adir is aware of this, but he/she is considering using the techie as a good strong addition to a squad, like you would a real he choice. Sound like it could work :thanks:

[IraSummers]

I am thinking of using one just like that. I am building Purifiers first (as most of my models are halibrids already, so min proxy and I used mine largely assulty, so its the closest to what I was used to start out). So I have one HQ slot and a 150pt waste of space (kind of). I am thinking of using one Inq with rad for one squad and tech marine with rad for the other squad. Seems like a cheap, effective way to get another source of hammerhand and rad grenades cheaply.

[Adir]

I think adir is aware of this, but he/she is considering using the techie as a good strong addition to a squad, like you would a real he choice. Sound like it could work :)

He ;) - that is correct, mini-HQ given how crowded our HQ choices are. Basically, I would take grand master, librarian, and techmarine... and put the techmarine with a purifier deathstar unit in a rhino (9 'fiers + 2 psy/c).

[DevianID]

I like the techmarine, but I admit I never considered using him as an hq replacement for a squad. I liked him for bolster defenses with a vindicare assassian to benefit from a 2+ cover, with servo skulls and the orbital strike relay. However, with rad grenades in place of the strike relay you do save some points; I just dont know how good the strike relay is yet without playtesting.

[Techmarine Harkus]

I'm way more interested in giving one an orbital bombardment relay thing. I like the bombardment, but I dont like the idea of my melee power character standing around lasing targets. It might be a bit expensive, but I'd rather a tecmarine wth orbital bombardment than with a conversion beamer for instance.

 

D3 Barrage just appeals to me, and if it hits a lance strike would be pretty awesome v anything.

[Gentlemanloser]

If only the Brotherhood Champions were Elite...

[Adir]

D3 Barrage just appeals to me, and if it hits a lance strike would be pretty awesome v anything.

That was my initial take on him as well. Give him the relay and hide him in terrain. Especially with the new expansion Gridlock 40k^TM out now, lance strike is going to hit something.

 

What really appealed was simply that we get a t/marine that is an excellent force modifier for purifiers, GKT, etc. for the same cost as a vanilla techmarine. I have gotten so used to t/marines being less than attractive that I got a bit blinded to this guys close combat upside in a GK list.

[Red Lost Soldier]

He costs almost double the vanilla techmarine, not exactly the same cost I'd say, though the harness is included I'll admit. As much as I love techmarines, he suffers from Brotherhood Champion syndrome; ie. too many points for 1 wound.

 

Orbital relay is nice, but good luck trying to hit anything with the lance. Average scatter is 7" remember, and you always scatter.

[DevianID]

Well, with servo skulls you might not always scatter 2d6, and with a lance strike's rule of always being s10 ap1 with a 1d6 scatter, minus 1.5 inches for the radius, you are looking at 4.5 inches of displacement maximum for 1d6 on the hulls of vehicles sometimes 8 inches long (land raider looking at you!!!)

 

I mean, kazimof (sp?) or whatever lets you hit with no scatter as part of his special rule, so the servo skull's special rule may also apply to the strike relay. Heck, with the faq it may even stack with other servo skulls! (I doubt it hehe)

[Aidoneus]

... too many points for 1 wound.

This...

 

...good luck trying to hit anything with the lance.

... and this.

 

The Techmarine looks all fancy, but he's a primary example of the main problem with GKs; they cost a ton to pay for all the bling, but they still die like vanilla marines. Maybe if you could take him as your only HQ to save on some points, that'd be okay. But taking him in addition to an HQ means you don't get to take another combat squad or most of a dreadthing.

[SamaNagol]

Put him in the backfield with a Conversion Beamer in a Rhino and he's ridiculous

 

Or you can give him a Warding Stave and Grenades of your choice and fling him in a unit to go up close.

 

He works very well in Henchmen lists

[Joasht]

Some people did that back in the 4th ed Space Marine codex, sticking Techmarines with squads, but IIRC back then they had two wounds (I don't recall clearly, I never did it myself). Problem is the poor guy might get cut down before swinging anything.

[Brother Dylan]

I've thought about using him in a gunline style army in conjunction with a librarian using the shrouding power, 2+ cover save in a ruin anyone?

[Adir]

The GK t/marine is exactly the same cost as a vanilla marine w/power weapon and servo harness but he also has psyk grenades, hammerhand, and reconstruction. On the downside he gets stuck with a boltgun and no way to get the extra CC attack from a second CC weapon.

 

His biggest positive for me is that his use of hammerhand frees up the squad he's with to use other powers. Add to that the rad grenades reducing toughness and he starts looking strong even for a one wound model.

 

Giving him a warding stave would be tempting and wouldn't increase his cost too much. You could then slam him into that power fist sarge with impunity!

 

On paper at least he's the best t/marine in the game... which may not be saying much once I get my first game in with him.

[Gaz1858]

I really like the idea of adding an inexpensive character in to allow Purifiers to use both Hammerhand and the other one.

 

However as good a choice as the Techmarine is, would it not be more pertinent to use one of the Xenos or Malleus Inquisitors?

 

Especially the Xenos IMO, he can take Needle Pistol (12" wounds on 2s and AP2), Hammerhand, Force Weapon, Rad and Psychotroke Grenades, Power Armour and 3 Servo Skulls for 117 points.

 

This is actually cheaper than the Techmarine by 7points (15 if remove Power Armour which isnt essential), has 2 more wounds, 2 more attacks(3 with 2 cc weapons) and stubborn.

 

Id say this may be a better option than the Techmarine for use in a Purifier squad.

 

What do you think?

[jimbo1701]

If limited HQ is not so much of a problem, how about an ordo xenos INQ + TM (both +conversion beamers) and a few warrior acolytes in a rhino?

[IraSummers]

I really like the idea of adding an inexpensive character in to allow Purifiers to use both Hammerhand and the other one.

 

However as good a choice as the Techmarine is, would it not be more pertinent to use one of the Xenos or Malleus Inquisitors?

 

Especially the Xenos IMO, he can take Needle Pistol (12" wounds on 2s and AP2), Hammerhand, Force Weapon, Rad and Psychotroke Grenades, Power Armour and 3 Servo Skulls for 117 points.

 

This is actually cheaper than the Techmarine by 7points (15 if remove Power Armour which isnt essential), has 2 more wounds, 2 more attacks(3 with 2 cc weapons) and stubborn.

 

Id say this may be a better option than the Techmarine for use in a Purifier squad.

 

What do you think?

 

That is exactly what I am looking at using. However, the reason I like the techmarine is I am planning on using 2 squads of purifiers (as troops), so the Inq goes with one squad, largely for Rad grenades. It would be great if I could use two like this, but Crowe takes up my other HQ slot. So its one Inq and one Techmarine for the other (or swap inq for libby when I try out stormravens).

 

Devain, That sounds like a decent plan, but remember, if an enemy model moves within 6" of the servo skull it will auto destruct. So not something I would rely on.

[Adir]

That is exactly what I am looking at using. However, the reason I like the techmarine is I am planning on using 2 squads of purifiers (as troops), so the Inq goes with one squad, largely for Rad grenades. It would be great if I could use two like this, but Crowe takes up my other HQ slot. So its one Inq and one Techmarine for the other (or swap inq for libby when I try out stormravens).

Pretty much this. He buffs a squad nicely and leaves our HQ slots open to pay the Crowe tax :tu:

[IraSummers]

That is exactly what I am looking at using. However, the reason I like the techmarine is I am planning on using 2 squads of purifiers (as troops), so the Inq goes with one squad, largely for Rad grenades. It would be great if I could use two like this, but Crowe takes up my other HQ slot. So its one Inq and one Techmarine for the other (or swap inq for libby when I try out stormravens).

Pretty much this. He buffs a squad nicely and leaves our HQ slots open to pay the Crowe tax :tu:

 

Haha. The Crowe Tax is taxation without representation... We pay 150 points to give our OPPONENT Furious Charge and Re-roll to hit and take the only non-power weapon at least Grey Knight in the codex. Sigh... I guess that is why purifiers are so good, otherwise he would not get so much as a second look...

[Captain Psycho]

Regarding techmarines with orbital strike relays - the wording in the codex states that "they always scatter the full 2D6" even on a hit. Based on that wording no ballistic skill reduction, no servo skull reduction (might be FAQ'd otherwise but RAW says "always" and "full" so not much room for interpretation). However you do get the BS reduction when firing a conversion beamer, and with enough servo skulls on the board you should be able to get in at least one turn of 1D6 CB shooting. That's a max 2" scatter on a large blast (possibly S10 depending on the range) with 66% chance of no scatter.

 

Over in the army list subforum I've posted some deep strike lists with techmarines as long range fire support - originally with OSRs but now with CBs for the reasons above.

 

I also like the idea of using the techmarines as an elite slot force multiplier (sort of like BA sanguinary priests), with rad grenades and a warding stave especially. Not cheap, but both upgrades actually cost less for a T/M than for the HQs that can take them.

 

One option not in the codex I would have liked is for T/Ms to automatically negate servitor Mindlock when attached to a unit of henchmen.

[boreas]

Not to mention that he can repair weapons on your rifleman dreads and possibly give them (or the vindicare) a better cover save!

 

Phil

[IraSummers]

Regarding techmarines with orbital strike relays - the wording in the codex states that "they always scatter the full 2D6" even on a hit. Based on that wording no ballistic skill reduction, no servo skull reduction (might be FAQ'd otherwise but RAW says "always" and "full" so not much room for interpretation). However you do get the BS reduction when firing a conversion beamer, and with enough servo skulls on the board you should be able to get in at least one turn of 1D6 CB shooting. That's a max 2" scatter on a large blast (possibly S10 depending on the range) with 66% chance of no scatter.

 

I fully agree that the homing device does nothing to the blast, as the wargear section specifies a few times for deepstrike and even lists what units can make use of it. However, I disagree that aiming at the servo skull would not reduce scatter. The servo skull entry does not modify the "will not scatter" but simply states that all blasts and deepstiking grey knight units that do so within 6" of it will scatter D6 less. So the blast would still scatter regardless, but only D6. However its somewhat a moot point as any enemy unit moving within 6" of it will cause it to self destruct. So if you did aim it at an exiting skull, you probably have less of a chance to hit something then if you aimed anywhere else.

 

I used to take the Lance strike almost every time, mostly as a deterant/denial of an objective, but I don't think I will spending the 50points on a model (already price and has to stay still) for it. At least you used to be able to have a chance to hit something. Now really only if you are playing hordes or a parking lot.

[Captain Psycho]

Here's another idea - give the T/M blind grenades, attach it to a unit of purifiers with halberds. If this unit gets charged they get to use cleansing flame, they will generally attack first and the charging unit will not get the bonus attack.

 

In a list with a GM you could give the purifiers counter-attack so that they will actually have more attacks in close combat than a charging unit with 2A base! Who needs an assault ramp when you can do that?!?