Techmarine Mini HQ

[Captain Psycho]

I fully agree that the homing device does nothing to the blast, as the wargear section specifies a few times for deepstrike and even lists what units can make use of it. However, I disagree that aiming at the servo skull would not reduce scatter. The servo skull entry does not modify the "will not scatter" but simply states that all blasts and deepstiking grey knight units that do so within 6" of it will scatter D6 less. So the blast would still scatter regardless, but only D6. However its somewhat a moot point as any enemy unit moving within 6" of it will cause it to self destruct. So if you did aim it at an exiting skull, you probably have less of a chance to hit something then if you aimed anywhere else.

 

I used to take the Lance strike almost every time, mostly as a deterant/denial of an objective, but I don't think I will spending the 50points on a model (already price and has to stay still) for it. At least you used to be able to have a chance to hit something. Now really only if you are playing hordes or a parking lot.

 

Can you target a servo skull? P16 of BRB "a firing unit can choose a single enemy unit" - the servo skull is neither (per the codex it is a counter, not a unit).

 

I'll be curious to see if the OSR + servo skulls combo makes it into any tournaments (not likely) and if so what the ruling will be.

[IraSummers]

I fully agree that the homing device does nothing to the blast, as the wargear section specifies a few times for deepstrike and even lists what units can make use of it. However, I disagree that aiming at the servo skull would not reduce scatter. The servo skull entry does not modify the "will not scatter" but simply states that all blasts and deepstiking grey knight units that do so within 6" of it will scatter D6 less. So the blast would still scatter regardless, but only D6. However its somewhat a moot point as any enemy unit moving within 6" of it will cause it to self destruct. So if you did aim it at an exiting skull, you probably have less of a chance to hit something then if you aimed anywhere else.

 

I used to take the Lance strike almost every time, mostly as a deterant/denial of an objective, but I don't think I will spending the 50points on a model (already price and has to stay still) for it. At least you used to be able to have a chance to hit something. Now really only if you are playing hordes or a parking lot.

 

Can you target a servo skull? P16 of BRB "a firing unit can choose a single enemy unit" - the servo skull is neither (per the codex it is a counter, not a unit).

 

I'll be curious to see if the OSR + servo skulls combo makes it into any tournaments (not likely) and if so what the ruling will be.

 

You are correct, but I was wrong with my measure. It says "placed within 12" of..." so you cannot target it, no one can "treated as counters rather than units..."

 

That is an interesting tactic, but it will be hard to get your opponent to position something within 12 but outside 6" of the skull. You may be able to pull it off once, twice if you are lucky. But after that your opponent will simply move within 6" of the skull and say good by to 3/5 pts that easly.

[The Mad Hatter]

Regarding techmarines with orbital strike relays - the wording in the codex states that "they always scatter the full 2D6" even on a hit. Based on that wording no ballistic skill reduction, no servo skull reduction (might be FAQ'd otherwise but RAW says "always" and "full" so not much room for interpretation). However you do get the BS reduction when firing a conversion beamer, and with enough servo skulls on the board you should be able to get in at least one turn of 1D6 CB shooting. That's a max 2" scatter on a large blast (possibly S10 depending on the range) with 66% chance of no scatter.

 

I fully agree that the homing device does nothing to the blast, as the wargear section specifies a few times for deepstrike and even lists what units can make use of it. However, I disagree that aiming at the servo skull would not reduce scatter. The servo skull entry does not modify the "will not scatter" but simply states that all blasts and deepstiking grey knight units that do so within 6" of it will scatter D6 less. So the blast would still scatter regardless, but only D6. However its somewhat a moot point as any enemy unit moving within 6" of it will cause it to self destruct. So if you did aim it at an exiting skull, you probably have less of a chance to hit something then if you aimed anywhere else.

 

I used to take the Lance strike almost every time, mostly as a deterant/denial of an objective, but I don't think I will spending the 50points on a model (already price and has to stay still) for it. At least you used to be able to have a chance to hit something. Now really only if you are playing hordes or a parking lot.

 

Not only, the same Karamazov special rule demonstrates that the orbital strike rules can be affected. Both Servoskulls and Karamazov special rule are external effects that would work on an equally specified orbital strike restriction: the first one would reduce the scatter of 1D6, whereas it is specified it is of full 2D6, and the second one would impede the scatter, even if it is specified it always scatters. Thus, if Karamazov rule works, the Servoskulls do as well, otherwise both of them do not work. Said that, knowing that the Karamazov special rule has been written for this purpose only, let us think that it works, and consequently Servoskulls should do too.

[IraSummers]

Regarding techmarines with orbital strike relays - the wording in the codex states that "they always scatter the full 2D6" even on a hit. Based on that wording no ballistic skill reduction, no servo skull reduction (might be FAQ'd otherwise but RAW says "always" and "full" so not much room for interpretation). However you do get the BS reduction when firing a conversion beamer, and with enough servo skulls on the board you should be able to get in at least one turn of 1D6 CB shooting. That's a max 2" scatter on a large blast (possibly S10 depending on the range) with 66% chance of no scatter.

 

I fully agree that the homing device does nothing to the blast, as the wargear section specifies a few times for deepstrike and even lists what units can make use of it. However, I disagree that aiming at the servo skull would not reduce scatter. The servo skull entry does not modify the "will not scatter" but simply states that all blasts and deepstiking grey knight units that do so within 6" of it will scatter D6 less. So the blast would still scatter regardless, but only D6. However its somewhat a moot point as any enemy unit moving within 6" of it will cause it to self destruct. So if you did aim it at an exiting skull, you probably have less of a chance to hit something then if you aimed anywhere else.

 

I used to take the Lance strike almost every time, mostly as a deterant/denial of an objective, but I don't think I will spending the 50points on a model (already price and has to stay still) for it. At least you used to be able to have a chance to hit something. Now really only if you are playing hordes or a parking lot.

 

Not only, the same Karamazov special rule demonstrates that the orbital strike rules can be affected. Both Servoskulls and Karamazov special rule are external effects that would work on an equally specified orbital strike restriction: the first one would reduce the scatter of 1D6, whereas it is specified it is of full 2D6, and the second one would impede the scatter, even if it is specified it always scatters. Thus, if Karamazov rule works, the Servoskulls do as well, otherwise both of them do not work. Said that, knowing that the Karamazov special rule has been written for this purpose only, let us think that it works, and consequently Servoskulls should do too.

 

Agreed. Let us just hope that the FAQ addresses any of the ACTUAL questions about the codex.

[Captain Psycho]

Not only, the same Karamazov special rule demonstrates that the orbital strike rules can be affected. Both Servoskulls and Karamazov special rule are external effects that would work on an equally specified orbital strike restriction: the first one would reduce the scatter of 1D6, whereas it is specified it is of full 2D6, and the second one would impede the scatter, even if it is specified it always scatters. Thus, if Karamazov rule works, the Servoskulls do as well, otherwise both of them do not work. Said that, knowing that the Karamazov special rule has been written for this purpose only, let us think that it works, and consequently Servoskulls should do too.

 

That's a good point - again I'll be curious to see how this gets handled in competitive environments.

 

Apologies to the OP - this thread wasn't meant to be a rules discussion. Point of my first post was that the techmarines can also make a good shooty mini-HQ (like inquisitors) in addition to a force multiplier close combat mini-HQ.

[Marmande]

Personally, I'd run him with a halberd, Rad+Blind Grenades for 115 points. Toss him in a unit of Purifiers (also with Halberds except for a Daemonhammer here or there) in a Stormraven. Makes them a great 'hammer' to, say, a unit of Terminators holding up the midfield's anvil. Only real problem is that he's Ld8, which makes the 'free' Hammerhand something which should be used sparingly rather than all the time.

[AlexHolker]

That is an interesting tactic, but it will be hard to get your opponent to position something within 12 but outside 6" of the skull. You may be able to pull it off once, twice if you are lucky. But after that your opponent will simply move within 6" of the skull and say good by to 3/5 pts that easly.

What if you used two skulls, one 5-6" behind the other? That way anyone that tries to get within 6" of the first comes within 12" of the second.

[Captain Psycho]

That is an interesting tactic, but it will be hard to get your opponent to position something within 12 but outside 6" of the skull. You may be able to pull it off once, twice if you are lucky. But after that your opponent will simply move within 6" of the skull and say good by to 3/5 pts that easly.

What if you used two skulls, one 5-6" behind the other? That way anyone that tries to get within 6" of the first comes within 12" of the second.

 

The list I posted in the army list subforum has 12 servo skulls between HQs and techmarines so I can pull off exactly what you described above (at least for a couple of turns) and minimize scatter on my deep striking GKs.

[Entilzha]

Spending 9points for three servoskulls even without blast seems like a good deal. They will still posiable help with Deep Striking and they can help keep infltrators back farther away.