asaye83 Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 So I am gonna finally start getting back into 40k soon. and I wanna do it with some style! This time around I'm looking at doing a BA successor chapter and I've been kicking around tons of ideas. I've started narrowing down which direction I'm gonna go finally so here I am coming to you guys for some much needed help and advice as to how to do it. So on to the nitty gritty of it. As for the chapter and its origins I'm gonna base them more specifically off of the Angels Sanguine chapter. The whole robed and mysterious vampire thing kinda appeals to me in some way but I wanna put my own touch onto it. Basically here's the quick rundown of what exactly I wanna do with 'em. 1) As much as I wanted to have them be a fleet based chapter, I settled on them being based on something like a earth sized moon orbiting a gas giant with a near by imperial civilized world in system so I can later do a IG army to accompany mah power armored boys. As for the home base itself, imo it wouldn't be a worth while home base if it wasn't a death world inhabited by tribes of humans constantly squaring off against all kinds of nasties. Hard humans make hard marines, right? 2) The politics of the Imperium is pretty daunting to me, so I really don't know exactly how to fit the chapter into the larger picture of things. The ideas I'm having here are to have the chapter basically be loved by some, yet hated by others, and the best way I've thought of doing this is to have the different Ordos have differing views on them. I want the chapter to have a lot of experience with fighting both Chaos, Dark Eldar. and Ork forces, and the best way to play with this is to have them be high in favor with the Ordo Malleus, so-so with the Ordo Xenos because of the chapters willingness to ally itself with the Eldar in the fight against their dark cousins, and finally, abysmal with the Ecclesiarchy because of the chapters tribal views interfering with those of the church. That gives me some leg room to fluff them up i guess. 3) Tactically I'm leaning heavily toward the BA successors penchant for close combat, but what's sold me the most on making a BA chapter isn't just the whole space-vampire thing, but also their availability of the kickin new stormraven model. I love airplanes and have mad respect for RL pilots (I basically grew up traveling from place to place and spent a LOT of time in airports), and so I want my chapter to reflect that in some way. So, tactically what I'm looking at is them being CC heavy, very reliant on stormravens for transport and tank hunting, and maybe having a higher number of land speeders to reflect their skill at piloting. One major question I have here is how much leeway I have in changing the Codex Astartes chapter make-up. How hard would it be on the chapter to change the standard SM company roster to 4 tactical, 4 assault, and 2 devastator squads to reflect more of their willingness for CC? So yeah. That's the direction I'm headed in now. The only things that are really starting to bug me now are a chapter emblem, and which colors to go with on the armor. Here's where I really could use your guys help. I need some help finding some great ways of whipping up some emblems and then how to load them on to the finished marines from the SM painter. This is the main thing puzzling me as of late in regards to my chapter, and once I get past this I can really start finishing off everything about them fluff wise so I can get my bearings on how to actually build and model them. As for the emblem, I am really leaning towards something like the eye of horus, but with the BA blood drop inside of it to look like the eyes pupil with either bird or bat wings coming off the sides of it. If you guys can show me how to make something like that on the computer so I can later make decals later, I'd love you forever! Anywho, that just about wraps this up. Any help with fluff ideas, making emblems, or anything else for that idea is greatly appreciated. Thanks for reading! :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavement Artist Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Hey there. 1.) Recruiting from death worlds is fairly standard procedure for a lot of chapters so no problem there :) It'd be nice if the culture of the planet (or planets) your chapter recruited from were woven into your army's lore. Would add some unique depth and flavour. And buggery to civilised. I want to see a nice feral IG army. All blowpipes and bad attitude. 2.) Here is some slightly shakey ground here. Being a Blood Angel's successor, you will still be suffering from the flaw which would put you in a precarious position with the upper echelons of the Imperium. Cultivating cordial relations with the Ordo Malleus would be a bit risky in so much that the first time they see you go bat schnitz on the battlefield, who isnt to say they're going to chalk it up to possession? (The inquistion can hardly be called rational at the best of times.) Given what you've written, it'd be cool if they were slightly pally with more radical elements of the ordo Xenos, given that you said that they would team up with eldar if needs be. 3.) The Hawk lords are another chapter who have a penchant for aircraft action so id say thats a great theme to go for. In terms of the codex Astartes- dont worry about it too much. You're not attempting to be as half as divergent as the Templars or Space Wolves. There is no reason that you have to feel restricted by it. If your chapter wants to lean more towards assault squads then go for it. The mechanincs are there in the codex with assault squads as troops. It's your army, build it however you want mate. Your emblem idea sounds absolutely killer. Im a bit iliterate with photo editing/manipulation jazz so someone more knowledgable will have to weigh in on that. It sounds great though. How you can salvage something useful from my ramblings. Good luck! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2705831 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaren Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 The problem is that the Eldar don't "team-up" with anyone, as their views and their entire thought process is so radically and completely different from Humanity's. If anything they will use you, position you to aid them, and then turn on you. Humanity is but a large group of pawns that the Eldar maneuver about the Galaxy to accomplish their own mysterious ends. They have no allies but themselves, because they believe they are superior to everyone else. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2705853 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavement Artist Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Whilst you are absolutely spot on about the eldar's mindset. From the imperial side of things, they do frequently make the mistake of assuming theyre considered on equal terms. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2705896 Share on other sites More sharing options...
asaye83 Posted March 30, 2011 Author Share Posted March 30, 2011 Thanks for the input guys! :( Now that I see the nightmarish headache that imperial politics can be, I think I'm gonna try and gravitate as much as possible away from it all lol. Instead I think I'm going to try and have the whole loved and hated aspect come from some of the chapters actions in battle instead. One idea that I've had about the chapter is to try and make them as "civil" as possible while off the battlefield, while on the other hand in pure BA fashion, when its time to throw down, they bring it hard, CRAZY hard, quite possibly crazier than most other BA marines might be. Basically I'd like them to be as posh as someone from the BA should be while chillin at his pad, yet be absolutely cunningly savage and blood thirsty (quite literally haha) on the battlefield as say someone from the SW might be. What this causes is the ability for the chapter to maintain the perception of civility towards imperial politicians and church members, yet also have that ferocious reputation that labels them as "loose cannons". My thoughts on the whole Eldar thing is this. THE ENEMY OF MY ENEMY IS MY FRIENDLY ENEMY By no means do I want this chapter to try and be "allies" with them, just WILLING to ally when things get out of control and they just happen to be there to lend a hand. Much like the Eldar, my chapter will use them as a chess piece to help be their "shield" so they can spend more time being the "hammer". Where other imperial forces might be too arrogant themselves to accept help, my chapter will realize the folly of such a thing, being able to do whatever is necessary to "play to win". This ties in with what I'm getting at next. The mindset I'm trying to get my chapter to have is that they realize that humanity is in dire trouble, and that a large part of it has to do with the standards and practices of the leadership that is in place. They realize that the ego of the few is endangering the lives of the many, and cannot stand for such a thing seeing as how they are supposed to be the ultimate defenders of humanity. This again helps the whole loved/hated thing with the Imperium. While being more than willing to fight what they perceive as "true" enemies of the Imperium (chaos, xenos, etc.), they will on the other hand flippantly disobey orders from higher ups which they deem a waste of time. Any thoughts? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2705932 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 1) As much as I wanted to have them be a fleet based chapter, I settled on them being based on something like a earth sized moon orbiting a gas giant with a near by imperial civilized world in system so I can later do a IG army to accompany mah power armored boys. As for the home base itself, imo it wouldn't be a worth while home base if it wasn't a death world inhabited by tribes of humans constantly squaring off against all kinds of nasties. Hard humans make hard marines, right? *Sound of a bursting bubble.* The Imperial Guard and Adeptus Astartes are two separate branches of Imperium's military. The Imperial Guard follow the orders of Departmento Munitorium and Astartes their own, most of the time. The enemy of my enemy is problem for later, right now they are useful. Corrected for you. By no means do I want this chapter to try and be "allies" with them, just WILLING to ally when things get out of control and they just happen to be there to lend a hand. Much like the Eldar, my chapter will use them as a chess piece to help be their "shield" so they can spend more time being the "hammer". Where other imperial forces might be too arrogant themselves to accept help, my chapter will realize the folly of such a thing, being able to do whatever is necessary to "play to win". This ties in with what I'm getting at next. The problem with Eldar is that they are not here to "lend you a hand". They are here to pursuit their own agenda(s) and most likely use you as the shield or sword for their own ends. "The suspicious mind is healthy mind." - is not proverb in Imperium for nothing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2706260 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Michaels Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 for notable babttles you could play a small part in "the darkest hour" where baal was attacked and all successors except lamentors defended baal so if your a BA successor then you could say you was in that ps you could a have a ancient bond between your chapter and the eldar its up to you we are here just to give advice not to lecture your ideas Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2706316 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavement Artist Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Asaye: The problem is, that the flaw isnt something that can be controlled or kept hidden all that well. All it would take is for a Guard regiment in the same theatre of conflict to see your marines fall to the red thirst and they could run their mouth to the inquisition. It's a horrible genetic curse, it's not quite the same as the Space wolves savagery which is by and large, quite a deliberate, manufactured facade. Nightrawen: That's a bit unfair. Macragge has a large standing military arm that is fairly beholden to the ultramarines. We're not suggesting that Asaye's chapter be in charge of this particular guard army, perhaps they have some sort of bond of honour? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2707077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
asaye83 Posted March 31, 2011 Author Share Posted March 31, 2011 Asaye: The problem is, that the flaw isnt something that can be controlled or kept hidden all that well. All it would take is for a Guard regiment in the same theatre of conflict to see your marines fall to the red thirst and they could run their mouth to the inquisition. It's a horrible genetic curse, it's not quite the same as the Space wolves savagery which is by and large, quite a deliberate, manufactured facade. Nightrawen: That's a bit unfair. Macragge has a large standing military arm that is fairly beholden to the ultramarines. We're not suggesting that Asaye's chapter be in charge of this particular guard army, perhaps they have some sort of bond of honour? If i went that route with the whole civil and aloof yet brutal and savage on the battlefield it would allow me to really pick and choose which other Imperial armies I would be willing to ally with. My best bud plays SW and Dark Eldar, so I'm trying to find some clever ways to fit some story in between our armies, and then of course I have my way off in the future IG project I'd want to do on the side with my marines. So for instance, my chapter would shun most outsiders unless of course they were greatly trusted in some way. Somewhat slow to befriend, yet loyal to the end with who they decide to work with. So it'd likely end up being that my chapter would only ever really find itself fighting along side BA and SW chapters, and my IG army as well and that's about it, of course barring the rare circumstance they end up working with xenos (cause they give a crap about imperial politics right?). I'd like to be able to have some more allies just so I can make their fluff allow them to work with most others in some way, but mainly have them stick to the more obscure or shady parts of the Imperium, basically the SM chapters and IG armies that don't like being told what to do and don't care about how things get done, just that they do. Guys have any ideas about what kind of Imperial armies would fit the bill or how to work this into the greater scheme of avoiding the finger of the Inquisition? Another thing I just had an idea about was trying to find a way to cover up what exactly the flaw has done to the chapter. I for sure want them to have a strong space-vampire motif going, but of course do it in a way that tries to cover up that perception towards others. Perhaps instead of outright drinking the blood of their enemies, they collect it in jars or something and take them back home to be refined and purified into something a lil more palatable? So for my guys, going to war would be like going to the grocery store in a sense haha. If you guys have some cooler ways of letting my guys be able to do the vampire thing safely in the Imperium I'm all ears. Things are definitely starting to come together with this chapter, and I'm loving the hell out of it. There's just something to having a SM chapter that you can call your complete own. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2707564 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 Nightrawen: That's a bit unfair. Macragge has a large standing military arm that is fairly beholden to the ultramarines. We're not suggesting that Asaye's chapter be in charge of this particular guard army, perhaps they have some sort of bond of honour? Planetary Defence Forces of Macragge, like any other PDF, are under control of governor, in this case Chapter Master of Ultramarines. But they cannot move these units anywhere out of the system. Even taking temporary command over IG regiments is viewed as suspicious and wayward. So it'd likely end up being that my chapter would only ever really find itself fighting along side BA and SW chapters, and my IG army as well and that's about it, of course barring the rare circumstance they end up working with xenos (cause they give a crap about imperial politics right?). You are misunderstanding here something. Hatred towards Xenos is not Imperial politics, it's Imperial dogma. Observe: CATECHISM OF THE XENO To be Unclean That is the Mark of the Xenos To be Impure That is the Mark of the Xenos To be Abhorred That is the Mark of the Xenos To be Reviled That is the Mark of the Xenos To be Hunted That is the Mark of the Xenos To be Purged That is the Fate of the Xenos To be Cleansed For that is the Fate of all Xenos ~ extract from the Third Book of Indoctrinations. I'd like to be able to have some more allies just so I can make their fluff allow them to work with most others in some way, but mainly have them stick to the more obscure or shady parts of the Imperium, basically the SM chapters and IG armies that don't like being told what to do and don't care about how things get done, just that they do. Guys have any ideas about what kind of Imperial armies would fit the bill or how to work this into the greater scheme of avoiding the finger of the Inquisition? Technically speaking, you cannot. The main purpose of Inquisition is poking their noses into affairs of others, especially if they are dubious and shady figures. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2707888 Share on other sites More sharing options...
asaye83 Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 Finally came up with my chapter emblem! http://ploader.net/files/a8085bc9f550eb111...452d65d38e1.png What do you guys think? Got any ideas to improve it? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/225985-sup-guys-wanna-help-a-dude-out/#findComment-2708475 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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