Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 If one was to take 3 teleportintg Dreadknights (mostly or all heavy incinerators with maybe 1 Heavy psycannon) what would one use for the rest of ones army? At the moment I'm thinking draigo and 15 Paladins as an anvill to the Dreadknights hammer (aiming for 2000pts) but I'm curious as to what others would do. I'm convinced that 3 teleporting Dreadknights working together is very very powerfull but obviously its also very expensive. They can zoom up a flank and maul a squad or 2 with their ranged weapons before the enemy even reacts, and with 18" charges most turns they should be able to press the attack hard untill they all die. The benefits of this I think are rather obvious but how should the rest of the army be constructed to make best use of that? Draigo and the Paladins spring to mind firstly because they fit the theme of the army and secondly because they are only really vunerable to the same kind of fire that will hurt the dreadknights. Perhaps drop a few paladins for a venerable dread? With fortitude and venerable its going to be a total bitch to kill and every shot that goes its way is one less thats going into the paladins and DK's. Seems like that could be worth 3 or 4 paladins perhaps? What do people think? I know I cant be the only person determined to field 3 dreadknights in an army! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 3 Dreadknight lists will be called the crutch list for horrible Gk players. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709234 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMouth Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 3 Dreadknight lists will be called the crutch list for horrible Gk players. Great way to contribute to the post. :) As to OP, I would go with my personal fav, chimera + henchmen spam for everything else. :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709242 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 3 Dreadknight lists will be called the crutch list for horrible Gk players. Shurely thats going to be purifier spam? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709245 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Apropos Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Clearly, you need 3 Venerable Dreadnoughts to accompany your Dreadknights. And 3 Stormravens for them to ride in. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709247 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 The reason why it will be a crutch list because it will be just that. 3 Dreadknights Fill your Troops slots with whatever will be able to survive long enough to hold objectives till the game is over. Reminds me of: Rune Priest WG, 5 GH, Las/Plas Razorback WG, 5 GH, Las/Plas Razorback WG, 5 GH, Las/Plas Razorback Long Fangs x6, ML x5, Las/Plas Razorback Long Fangs x6, ML x5, Las/Plas Razorback Long Fangs x6, ML x5, Las/Plas Razorback Which I also consider a crap list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709255 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 Clearly, you need 3 Venerable Dreadnoughts to accompany your Dreadknights. And 3 Stormravens for them to ride in. :) I totally dig the Ven dreads but why ravens? Wouldent psyfleman be ideal support here, leaving the ravens pts for some actual troops (given 3ven dread 3 DK and 3 ravens is basically 2000pts with no troops or HQ) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709256 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmk17 Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Might want to go back and put [sarcasm] [/sarcasm] around his post. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709259 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitefireinferno Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 I am going to go with Ramses but then again I view it as something that makes TWC look appropriate But then again I do plan on a Purifier army so I guess I need a crutch because foot slogging PA guys is so crutch like. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709261 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Valerius Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 3 Dreadknight lists will be called the crutch list for horrible Gk players. Who cares? It sounds like it would be a fun list to run, so if the OP wants he should play it and ignore whatever people say. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709273 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 I am going to go with Ramses but then again I view it as something that makes TWC look appropriate But then again I do plan on a Purifier army so I guess I need a crutch because foot slogging PA guys is so crutch like. Considering that most of the 3 DK tactics lists I see have them equipped with Personal Transporters, counting on 30" shunt moves as Scout moves, 12" move, 6" assault on first turn, foot slogging PA guys really isn't such a bad thing. What is it? 200+ points per Dreadknight with personal teleporter before weapons? 200-250pts for a HQ to get Grand Strategy? Pushing 1k right there so what is going to be your Troops? MSU in many transports or hidden in cover near or on objectives. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709274 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 I am going to go with Ramses but then again I view it as something that makes TWC look appropriate But then again I do plan on a Purifier army so I guess I need a crutch because foot slogging PA guys is so crutch like. Considering that most of the 3 DK tactics lists I see have them equipped with Personal Transporters, counting on 30" shunt moves as Scout moves, 12" move, 6" assault on first turn, foot slogging PA guys really isn't such a bad thing. What is it? 200+ points per Dreadknight with personal teleporter before weapons? 200-250pts for a HQ to get Grand Strategy? Pushing 1k right there so what is going to be your Troops? MSU in many transports or hidden in cover near or on objectives. Bloody hell who peed in your cornflakes this morning? Anyway I think you just confirmed my suspicion that you are having a knee-jerk reaction to a proposal I dident even make here! At no point did I mention MSU troops, mech or even scouting with grand strategy! This isent supposed to be an attempt at a cheese list, I'd never suggest this as anything even close to the strongest build in the book and that was never its purpose. I want an army with 3 teleporting dreadknights because I really like spacemarines and big stompy robots and the DK is both! If you will turn your gaze towards my first posts you will see I was thinking of running Draigo and 10-15 paladins with it, in normal (for stupidly elite terminators) 5 or so man squads. And they arnt for just sitting on objectives either they are there to assist the DK's in kicking peoples faces off (while they get chunks blown out of them in return). Not having a go at purifiers but if were throwing dirt around then I'd say they are easily the cheesyest thing in the book (which is fine but I'm not the one with the attitude about this), with halberds and cleansing flame they are basically unassaultable & 2-4 psycannons per squad quickly gets mental if you take mostly purifiers. I dont have any problem with that whatsoever but it seems far more of a brainless crutch if you just think of it in such black and white terms list than what I am suggesting which can be torn appart very quickly if you dont think about where you want to put your units, what to kill 1st etc. just like any DS/JP heavy list. We dont all think entirely in terms of what is most likely to win, I personally am much much more interested in getting the main units I want into an army and then finding ways to make it work reasonably well on the table. If you are suggesting that some MSU shenanigans are what it will take to make this list work then fine but there was no need for the bile and the presumptions on your part. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709306 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 So? Draigo 5 man Paladin 5 man Paladin 5 man Paladin Dreadknight Dreadknight Dreadknight Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709317 Share on other sites More sharing options...
biglou666 Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 So? Draigo 5 man Paladin 5 man Paladin 5 man Paladin Dreadknight Dreadknight Dreadknight If you were to run this list, i feel you would be better off running terminators. And a grandmaster instead of draigo. People will almost always concentrate thier firepower on your dreadknights, so you dont need to pay for the 2 wounded paladins. Plus, without draigo and pallies soaking up points, you can buy extra terminator bodies, and/or a vindicare -_- the main selling point of pallies over terminators is thier survivability, which just isnt needed in this list, especially if your dreadknights are shunting and jumping. keep those points for somthing else. :P just my 2 cents...... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709351 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 So? Draigo 5 man Paladin 5 man Paladin 5 man Paladin Dreadknight Dreadknight Dreadknight That was my initial idea yes, maybe substituting a few palies for a venerable psyfleman as I imagine it will look pretty handsome next to the rest of the army (and bridge a size gap) whilst providing usefull long range fire and diversion. I dont consider 5 man paladin units to be MSU in that config certainly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709356 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Apropos Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 While I was half joking about the Stormravens, namely the silliness that beleives they cease to be MCs when you give them teleporters, one Raven might not be bad idea. Load it with a shrouding librarian and as killy an escort as you can think of, then run it up behind your Dreadbash wall. It's a hell of a target priority issue for your opponent, and while I'm not sure if they're actually tall enough to give it cover, Skimmers Moving Fast+Shrouding ought to get you there alive. You could even cut it back to 2 Psyflemen and get one of the VenDreds stuck in too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709406 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 If you were to run this list, i feel you would be better off running terminators. And a grandmaster instead of draigo. People will almost always concentrate thier firepower on your dreadknights, so you dont need to pay for the 2 wounded paladins. Plus, without draigo and pallies soaking up points, you can buy extra terminator bodies, and/or a vindicare ;) the main selling point of pallies over terminators is thier survivability, which just isnt needed in this list, especially if your dreadknights are shunting and jumping. keep those points for somthing else. :cuss just my 2 cents...... This very idea has swilled around my mind too, my other most favored list at the moment is based around mordrak and 20ish terminators. Draigo is super handy if your squad is likely to be left out in the open which is half the reason I took him and I'm not so shure its that cut and dry with the dreadknights drawing all of the fire & that extrta wound on paladins starts to pay dividends in the right circumstances (mostly CC). That said theres probbably a ballance to be had here and I'd love to squeze Justicar Thawn in. How about something like this: Mordrak +5xghosts 6xPaladin 5xTerminator With Thawn 5x terminator 3x Dreadknights 2000pts (Give or take) I fear the best tweak to that list maybe to drop a dreadknight ironicaly :ermm: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709468 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DinoDoc Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 I don't like the list for aesthetic reasons due to me really starting to hate Coteaz due to his ubiquity but this seems like a decent 2k list assuming GW clarifies Coteaz's Formosa rule the way Stelek argues: Coteaz. 3 Venerable Dreads with 2 Autocannons, Psybolt ammo. 4 Rhinos with 3 meltagun warriors, 5 warriors with boltguns, and 1 warrior 2 Razorbacks with psybolt ammo, 2 jokers, and 7 warriors. 3 Dread Knights with personal teleporters. http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2011/03/live-b...-2-the-2k-part/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709537 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 One thing to consider when unit spamming is think of the weaknesses of the unit you are using and what a smart opponent would do to counter said unit and then plan the rest of your army accordingly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709615 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 One thing to consider when unit spamming is think of the weaknesses of the unit you are using and what a smart opponent would do to counter said unit and then plan the rest of your army accordingly. .................WHOWUDDATHUNKOFIT! :tu: Seriousey tho care to make any suggestions? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709620 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 One thing to consider when unit spamming is think of the weaknesses of the unit you are using and what a smart opponent would do to counter said unit and then plan the rest of your army accordingly. .................WHOWUDDATHUNKOFIT! :tu: Seriousey tho care to make any suggestions? Yea, stop spamming MSU DK lists. LOL! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709624 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 I have barely looked over the new codex so my advice is going to be lacking plus I'm a dirty traitor Haha. Honestly I think DK were basically terminator MCs so I know I wouldn't want to field anything that's only a 3+ save as ML spam and BCs would just Target the other units. This means more terminators makes sense to dilute the AP weapons further. After that I'd want to cover anti horde as MCs usually lack that, so flamers and blast weapons would be a start. ill have to review the book further before i say anything else. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709635 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 Yea, stop spamming MSU DK lists. LOL! You do understand what MSU is right? cause 350-400pt 5-6 man units arnt MSU, especially when theres only 3 or 4 in the whole army. Henchmen are another matter but that dosent fit the army theme at all for me and I'm certainly not the one discussing that... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709638 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman_woo Posted April 1, 2011 Author Share Posted April 1, 2011 I have barely looked over the new codex so my advice is going to be lacking plus I'm a dirty traitor Haha. Honestly I think DK were basically terminator MCs so I know I wouldn't want to field anything that's only a 3+ save as ML spam and BCs would just Target the other units. This means more terminators makes sense to dilute the AP weapons further. After that I'd want to cover anti horde as MCs usually lack that, so flamers and blast weapons would be a start. ill have to review the book further before i say anything else. I agree but isn't this basicaly already being discussed? Terminators and Paladins have come up more than once in the thread, but regardless yes I totally agree. Terminators, Paladins and Dreadnaughts (venerable natch.) seem like the only units that could take the same kind of fire as the DK's and keep going. Termies and Paladins also bring psycannons into the mix every one of which will be worth its weight in gold with such a small moddelcount. The reason why I thaught about Draigo & Palies as it creates 2 or 3 slow moving but very very daingerous steamrollers for the Dreadknights to try and marshal things into, or if you know you are fighting an army that will come to you like nids, sit in cover and create a very hard to assault baseline. Now I'm thinking maybe Mordrak with mostly terminators (and one squad of Paladins for woo factor) might be better as it should prove more flexible and normal terminators are still plenty daingerous with Halberds, plus Mordraks unit can get right in the S**t alongside the DK's from the get go if needs be, or dominate some midfield cover early with DK support. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709648 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 These trial lists would get wrecked by any list designed by a primitive predecessor of modern humans. DKs die quick, so do your proposed support units. Literally everything in your proposed lists can be one-shotted by any mildly sentient creature playing the game. It wouldn't even be fun to play against. I would suggest more diversity and less trying to hammer a mold around a near-useless unit and concept. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/226262-dreadknight-spam/#findComment-2709738 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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