Scout move and Teleport Shunt

[Dan VK]

The qualifier ‘normal’ is junk language that only occurs alongside ‘move’ in the Scouts USR entry. A ‘move’ is any movement until GW states otherwise, and if the Scouts USR entry allows a unit to move after deployment but before the first turn and the Personal Teleporter entry allows a unit to move 30” then a unit affected by both entries may combine those actions unless either entry contains a stated exception, which neither do.

 

[Whew, that sentence was a mouthful! :) ]

 

Which would normally be enough but the language of the personal teleporter specifically tells you that you are not moving, but performing a teleport shunt.

 

"Instead of moving..."

 

The mechanics of what entails a teleport shunt of course have the model moving, but the mechanics of what a shunt entails are preceded by the affirmation that you are doing something completely different then moving, you are teleport shunting.

 

So even if you did not have the normal move language within the scout move,

 

"Scout move may make a move as they do in the movement phase....(parapheased)"

 

The wording for shunting has clearly defined it as an action other then moving.

 

:P

 

The wording for 'teleport shunt' allows it to be performed in place of movement. The Scouts USR allows movement, which 'teleport shunt' may replace. I see no conflict.

 

[EDIT: I pretty much reworded my previous post, so I added what I hope is a more direct comment.]

[Grimtooth]

The qualifier ‘normal’ is junk language that only occurs alongside ‘move’ in the Scouts USR entry. A ‘move’ is any movement until GW states otherwise, and if the Scouts USR entry allows a unit to move after deployment but before the first turn and the Personal Teleporter entry allows a unit to move 30” then a unit affected by both entries may combine those actions unless either entry contains a stated exception, which neither do.

 

[Whew, that sentence was a mouthful! :devil: ]

 

Which would normally be enough but the language of the personal teleporter specifically tells you that you are not moving, but performing a teleport shunt.

 

"Instead of moving..."

 

The mechanics of what entails a teleport shunt of course have the model moving, but the mechanics of what a shunt entails are preceded by the affirmation that you are doing something completely different then moving, you are teleport shunting.

 

So even if you did not have the normal move language within the scout move,

 

"Scout move may make a move as they do in the movement phase....(parapheased)"

 

The wording for shunting has clearly defined it as an action other then moving.

 

:devil:

 

The wording for 'teleport shunt' allows it to be performed in place of movement. The Scouts USR allows movement, which 'teleport shunt' may replace. I see no conflict.

 

[EDIT: I pretty much reworded my previous post, so I added what I hope is a more direct comment.]

 

Instead of moving.

 

That is the RAW and when you use it you see that Scout calls for moving not something instead of moving called Shunting.

 

This is the prime reason smoke launchers had to FAQ'd to be allowed during the Scout move. Smoke launchers is not moving so when Scout move called for moving, you could not use Smoke Launchers because it was not moving, it was smoke launchers.

 

I realize that I am just saying the same thing both here and at Dakka for sick fun really when both issues will be FAQ'd either way.

[Dan VK]

[Dan VK: Snipped to save space]

[Dan VK: Also snipped to save space]

 

:D

 

The wording for 'teleport shunt' allows it to be performed in place of movement. The Scouts USR allows movement, which 'teleport shunt' may replace. I see no conflict.

 

[EDIT: I pretty much reworded my previous post, so I added what I hope is a more direct comment.]

 

Instead of moving.

 

That is the RAW and when you use it you see that Scout calls for moving not something instead of moving called Shunting.

 

This is the prime reason smoke launchers had to FAQ'd to be allowed during the Scout move. Smoke launchers is not moving so when Scout move called for moving, you could not use Smoke Launchers because it was not moving, it was smoke launchers.

 

I realize that I am just saying the same thing both here and at Dakka for sick fun really when both issues will be FAQ'd either way.

 

One could declare it was FAQ'd to enforce what the developers intended all along, but unless there is a reliable source to support the statement (like an article), suggesting any motivation behind the inclusion of a question in a FAQ is assumption.

 

"To represent this, after both sides have deployed (including infiltrators), but before the first player begins his first turn, any scouts may make a normal move. This is done exactly as in their Movement phase, except that during this move, scouts must remain more than 12" away from any enemy." BRB pg76

 

"Once per game, the unit can elect to make a teleport shunt instead of moving. If making a teleport shunt, the unit immediately makes a move of up to 30" in any direction." C:GK pg28

 

A unit with the Scouts USR may move "exactly as in their Movement phase," before the first turn. A unit with Personal Teleporters may replace their movement in the Movement phase with a special 30" move. The entry does not state 'teleport shunt' is not movement (it actually uses the language "makes a move"), but it does prevent the unit from moving 12" as Jump Infantry before using their Personal Teleporters.

[Grey Mage]

Is a teleport shunt allowed as a Scout move?

I would say no, as the rule is 'once per game' and the game hasnt started at that point.

[Gentlemanloser]

Smokes are once per game as well.

[Grey Mage]

Smokes are once per game as well.

However theyre not a form of movement, and had to be FAQd in. So whats your point?

[Gentlemanloser]

If they're once per game, and can be used, then it's logical to assume tha tother once per game stuff can be used in the faux movement phase that scouts give.

 

If the Scout movement phase isn't part of the normal game, as it's not started yet, then you can use your smokes twice. Once when you scout, as it doesn't class as part of the game, then once after, in normal game time.

[Dan VK]

Is a teleport shunt allowed as a Scout move?

I would say no, as the rule is 'once per game' and the game hasnt started at that point.

The Scouts USR allows the unit to move "exactly as in their Movement phase," so if the unit can move in a specific manner in the Movement phase it can move in that manner for the purposes of the Scouts USR.

 

Smokes are once per game as well.

However theyre not a form of movement, and had to be FAQd in. So whats your point?

The special 'teleport shunt' action is movement performed in place of any other movement in the Movement phase. A comparison between Personal Teleporters to Smoke Launchers is unequal because they have unrelated effects.

 

Even if 'teleport shunt' is (hypothetically) not considered movement, I do not understand why the permission granted by the Personal Teleporter entry to replace "normal" movement (it hurt to use that phrase ^_^ ) with another action is overridden by the Scouts USR entry, which grants movement and does not contain a restriction on its replacement.

 

If they're once per game, and can be used, then it's logical to assume tha tother once per game stuff can be used in the faux movement phase that scouts give.

 

If the Scout movement phase isn't part of the normal game, as it's not started yet, then you can use your smokes twice. Once when you scout, as it doesn't class as part of the game, then once after, in normal game time.

Unfortunately assumptions are not RAW, regardless of the strength of the logic behind the statement. The C:BA FAQ grants permission for Baal Predators to ignore the "per game" portion of the Smoke Launchers rules, but there is nothing that grants permission to ignore the "once" part.

 

[EDIT: Added another response to avoid double posting.]

[Gentlemanloser]

The RAW would be that the scout move actually is part of the game, which is why the Smokes cna only be used once. ^_^