Have death company ever worn terminator armour

[BERZERKER!]

At the end of the day, brother, they're your models.

 

You dont need anyone else to justify it for you. Maybe they wen't into the Black rage moments before battle, and their armour was sprayed in the stormraven on the way down. You can think of a reason if you really want, it doesn't need to be awesome fiction.

 

If you put black termies in front of me, as an opponent, i wouldn't even think twice. It's up to you what you do, and anyone who says otherwise is a pretentious :D, who's forgotten what 40k is about.

 

EDIT;

 

as an aside, you asked "is it possible". It's 40k, anything is possible.. thats why it's great, hence my earlier point. A commander might decide to field DC in TDA. It might not be a good call, but who's gonna argue with the man in charge?

 

Except maybe the inquisition. But shhh... we won't tell them :D.

[Spam Monkey]

Death Company are rare.

Terminator Armor is rare.

You do the math.

Probably doesn't happen too often.

But its fantasy so paint the models how ever you like.

[Gv0zD]

You may paint your minis as you like. But fluff-wise there is no tda in dc. As was already mentioned, after induction to dc all ranks are stripped, there are only dc marines, there's no distinction between assault or tactical marines. Dc marines are likely to die in battle, so sacrificing sacred tda is almost a herecy. Dread is a different story. Dread tears through enemy ranks and [as mentioned in dex] is likely to continue its frenzy even after battle is won, so the techmarines have to decide whether to 'turn it off'. Tda is more resilient than pa, but unlike Dread it will still suffer unrepairable damage in fight when worn by dc marine.

[SamaNagol]

Dreadnoughts once interred cannot be removed until dead. Marines brains still function within those sarcophagi and as such they can still fall to the Black Rage.

 

Marines can fall to the Black Rage in battle at any time. It is rare but it does happen. That means however they wouldnt be in black armour, they would be in red armour.

 

Marines who fall to the Black Rage 'on the eve of battle' as described in the numerous BA Codices are inducted into the Death Company and have their armour painted black. They wouldn't be in Terminator armour.

[Marik]

Since the DC is usually placed in suspension until a battle I doubt that they would be given a suit if terminator armor while gearing up. However dreads don't get that choice since if they leave their housing they will die.

[DreadLift]

True that. I painted one of my assualt terminators in Death Company colours tho.

 

I thought about doing a whole army based on the DC paint scheme. I was going to justify it by saying that a whole sub chapter of the blood angels had fallen to the black rage and Astoroth in a moment of compassion decided to have the whole chapter painted as DC and sent them into one glorious last battle so the chapter could die with honour and in service to the imperium one last time. To make it fluffy include Astoroth as an HQ and chuck in as many Chaplains as you see fit. Help yourself to these ideas if you wish :cuss

[Octavulg]

There used to be rules for a Death Company army. The justification was that it was basically a chain reaction - one squad would succumb, then another, then another. It was kind of neat.

 

Of course, then they wouldn't be in DC colors...

[Leonaides]

The 'justification' for that army also was completely against the background at the time (still is, come to think of it). It was poorly justified, poorly thought out, and I thoroughly wish the designer who said it had engaged his brain before opening his mouth.

[1Drop]

This has already been discussed quite recently, there's a HUGE thread on it like 3 pages long.

 

As has been discussed in the past... If you put a squad of assault termies with a chaplain and a sang priest they become the equivalent to DC Terminators anyway. If you wanna paint them black the. Go for it but it won't be very fluffy as no one is gonna paint their prized TDA armour black and send it to destruction.

 

It has also been said that if a brother falls to to the flaw while in TDA, how the hell you gonna get him out of it. but saying as the only people aloud to pilot TDA are veterans they have greater self control and are far less likely to fall to the black rage.

[DreadLift]

The 'justification' for that army also was completely against the background at the time (still is, come to think of it). It was poorly justified, poorly thought out, and I thoroughly wish the designer who said it had engaged his brain before opening his mouth.

 

Justification or not anybody who wishes to play an army and paint it anyway they wish, hell why not ?. I personally would have no problem playing an army in a DC style paint scheme, but then I have considered it myself :)

[Leonaides]

I have no problem if someone wants to paint their army black with red crosses etc, or even pink with orange polkadots, thats completely theri choice. But if you are talking about a fluff justification for having an entire army of DC (note - not just lots of DC squads a la Astaroth) then there really isnt anything without resorting to 'the warp did it'. Sorry, but thats just they way I see it.

[Brother Tyler]

Other discussion

[DreadLift]

I have no problem if someone wants to paint their army black with red crosses etc, or even pink with orange polkadots, thats completely theri choice. But if you are talking about a fluff justification for having an entire army of DC (note - not just lots of DC squads a la Astaroth) then there really isnt anything without resorting to 'the warp did it'. Sorry, but thats just they way I see it.

 

until GW make some fluff to fit (it could happen, hell who would have said Necrons as allies in fluff) ..........then what ? Fluff changes and just wait until you see the next Necron codex to prove my point :D . You never know a pure DC all units army painted now could be 5 years ahead of the game. The point I am trying to make is you cant really use fluff to restrict an idea as "said" fluff is changing all the time.

[Cpt. Blood Donator]

There was a D.C army, Jervis wrote it. Jervis got credd (except for that little C:CSM fiasco), no denying there was one. Go ahead and do whatever you like.

[Leonaides]

Yep - thats the one. Disliked it then, dislike it now. How many people remember the Moripatris, with the chaplains moving amongst their brethren, identifying those who show the signs of the Rage, either calming them or singling them out for the Death Company, where they will fight and die in honour before madness takes their minds away. Quite simply - an army falling as in that Gav Thorpe text could only happen if every chaplain assigned to the force was a complete incompetent, which means every chaplain in the chapter is also incompetent for not recognising that, and has been for some time... Am I the only one who sees a problem there?

 

So I can write something now, and claim it is fluffy even thoguth it disagrees with every single piece of fluff ever written for marines, and still be fluffily correct because at some point the fluff mught change? I'm pretty sure you didnt mean to suggest that, not really, but thats exactly what you have suggested, Dreadlift.

[Cpt. Blood Donator]

Yep - thats the one. Disliked it then, dislike it now. How many people remember the Moripatris, with the chaplains moving amongst their brethren, identifying those who show the signs of the Rage, either calming them or singling them out for the Death Company, where they will fight and die in honour before madness takes their minds away. Quite simply - an army falling as in that Gav Thorpe text could only happen if every chaplain assigned to the force was a complete incompetent, which means every chaplain in the chapter is also incompetent for not recognising that, and has been for some time... Am I the only one who sees a problem there?

 

So I can write something now, and claim it is fluffy even thoguth it disagrees with every single piece of fluff ever written for marines, and still be fluffily correct because at some point the fluff mught change? I'm pretty sure you didnt mean to suggest that, not really, but thats exactly what you have suggested, Dreadlift.

 

If you work at GW, sure.

[DreadLift]

Yep - thats the one. Disliked it then, dislike it now. How many people remember the Moripatris, with the chaplains moving amongst their brethren, identifying those who show the signs of the Rage, either calming them or singling them out for the Death Company, where they will fight and die in honour before madness takes their minds away. Quite simply - an army falling as in that Gav Thorpe text could only happen if every chaplain assigned to the force was a complete incompetent, which means every chaplain in the chapter is also incompetent for not recognising that, and has been for some time... Am I the only one who sees a problem there?

 

So I can write something now, and claim it is fluffy even thoguth it disagrees with every single piece of fluff ever written for marines, and still be fluffily correct because at some point the fluff mught change? I'm pretty sure you didnt mean to suggest that, not really, but thats exactly what you have suggested, Dreadlift.

 

 

Yep thats exactly what I suggest :P

 

I just don't get the whole "if it aint fluff you cant do it" argument. Its our game lets play it how we want. As long as 2 opposing players agree to anything either non-fluff or rules then I don't see an issue really. Obviously rules in tournament are cannon but fluff isn't something I get hung up on. Its nice to see some originality in an armies paint scheme and ideas now and then. Would a full BA army painted in DC colours be fluffy ? as you have pointed out not really, would it look cool on the table if painted well, absolutely.

[JamesI]

Come on guys, don't post links to pdfs of GW published material. That's against the B+C rules (unless the material is posted on GW's website).

 

I'm going to merge this with the older discussion, we don't need 2 DC terminator discussions only a month apart.

[Leonaides]

Dreadlift -

 

My mistake - for some reason I thought this was a discussion based on current BA background 'fluff' - not a discussion of "would I be happy to play against someone who painted all his marines black and said that they were all DC..."

 

As I said before - I have no problem with whatever colour someone wants to paint their models, nor what justification they want to say there is for it. I genuinely dont care. I can say that they sky is magenta, the clouds are green and the sun has a giant baby's head in the middle of it, and that is my opinion, and thus a prefectly valid opinion, but i'd still be wrong... In the same manner that Gav Thorpe was, to my mind, wrong. What you want to house-rule is between you and the guy on the other side of the table.

 

You could house-rule that deep striking landraiders only suffer a DS mishap if they land on a vehicle with an AV in excess of 10, and infantry that they land on take an I test or die, but that would be against the currently published rules. If that was suggested in the OR, would anyone who pointed out that that was against the rules be wrong? ;)

 

Meh...... Time for a beverage.

[SamaNagol]

Blood Angels acting incompetent?

 

I look forward to James Swallow's next BA book involving entire companies falling to the Black Rage due to the oversight of one their entire Reclusium. lol

[shatter]

With the Rage felt by the community over the Necron fist-bump, I'm surprised whole chapters didn't fall to the Rage.

[Raz Na Ghoul]

As mentioned before to use TDA you have to absolve a special training. I dont think that a madman would be able to control them.

[Jimmy Carmine]

It has also been said that if a brother falls to to the flaw while in TDA, how the hell you gonna get him out of it.

 

 

My Lord Sanguinius, the Traitors close on the palace. We have readied fresh armour and weapons for you, Dorn sends his regards and requests that you lead the Sanguinary Guard to reinforce the Eternity Gate.

 

:jaw:

[shatter]

10,000 years of the flaw and no one fell while wearing TDA? I know marines with the required training have fallen as it says so - all blood angels fall eventually.

Space Hulk - blood angels in TDA are inserted to battle.

C:BA - before battle guys fall to Rage.

 

QED.

 

The game =/= the entirety of the 40k universe.

 

 

The codex we use to play is for a game. The game does not present us with TDA DC to use... or does it? Perhaps in their maddened state, their defenses in TDA is reduced to that of mere PA, yet their ferocity re-enables sweeping advance.

 

*shrug*

 

However because of WYSIWYG this must be modeled as PA as that's the defense their entry states.

 

 

Say, think, write what you like, just observe WYSIWYG for game mechanics.

[Riconas]

I was in the midst of creating a Successor Chapter, with one of the main themes being that the Death Company was made up entirely of Veterans from the 1st Company, which would be entirely Terminators. My original thought was, as many have stated here and elsewhere, "once they fall to the Black Rage, good luck getting the armour back". Then I started thinking that an entire Death Company of Terminators might be a bit excessive, plus I don't think there are any "official" rules regarding Death Company clad in Terminator armour, so I decided to do a bit of research and found this thread. After reading through, it actually does make sense that veterans would be able to withstand the Rage more, and that the chapter would likely try to save all of their TDA suits. However, veterans are not immune to the Rage, and it's possible that, with flaws in the gene-seed, they could succumb to it faster than others, and if they happen to be clad in TDA, then it's likely they won't give it up without being killed. But then, in order to kill them, you'd almost have to destroy the armour anyway, so I would think it would make more sense just to send them towards the enemy at that point, and let them do as much damage as possible before being destroyed. Also, being as tough as it is, it's possible that, while the marine inside might have died, the TDA itself may be relatively intact and able to be retrieved after the battle.

 

All-in-all, this is the conclusion I have come to regarding this (and similar) issue(s):

 

-- Gameplay: If you're going to use the models in an actual game, remember: it's a game where the rules constantly evolve. If you're not participating in some sort of official match or tournament, and it's just a PUG or game with friends, discuss it with those you're playing with and see if you can't agree on some slight rules modifications to allow it to be used in-game, if for no other reason than to make it more interesting (and perhaps to display your awesome minis).

 

-- Chapter Fluff: If you're creating your own chapter (or successor), then do whatever you want, as long as you can come up with a semi-creative and plausible explanation. Personally, I plan on using the situation described above, but on a lesser scale, so that there may only be 1 or 2 Terminators in an entire Death Company, as it would be a rare occurrence. In the end, it's your army based on your ideas, so it really doesn't matter what you do with it, especially if you aren't using them for the actual game.

-- Miniatures: If all you're doing is painting up an army because you like assembling and painting miniatures, and you really don't care about the game or the fluff, then I would say pretty much the same thing as above for Chapter Fluff. In that case, though, you might need no explanation other than "I thought it would look cool".