drop podding devastators

[meniscusmike]

Any tried this? My idea is to have a ten man squad with their 4 multimeltas and/or plasma cannons and a fist. Drop it right in your opponents face first turn and your opponent must react to it, and ten marines are hard to remove if you can run them into cover and they have to watch out for the fist if he gets too close. This gives the rest of the army time and space to get forward hopefully leaving your rhinos and ravens safe. This is just a theory anyone think its a good idea?

[knife&fork]

A good idea in theory but it all depends on the terrain, deployment, board layout and how good your opponent is at dealing with marines on foot. A 10 man dev squad with plasma cannons, fist and drop pod is a pretty big chunk of points. Slightly too much for a bait unit.

[Cpt. Blood Donator]

A good idea in theory but it all depends on the terrain, deployment, board layout and how good your opponent is at dealing with marines on foot. A 10 man dev squad with plasma cannons, fist and drop pod is a pretty big chunk of points. Slightly too much for a bait unit.

 

What he said, Melta good, plasma bad. Don't forget that you might also buy a drop pod for a devastator squad and have it empty if you've got a spare one. Can be used to block line of sight and other annoying things.

[meniscusmike]

Thats why i like the idea it give so much flexability because they can deploy normally and use the drop pod to annoy or you can even combat squad them depending on circumstance. I think it may work really well with my list with two ravens and two razorbacks flying foreward with the devs providing interferance.

[Morollan]

Doesn't sound good to me. If you land just slightly too close to the enemy you're going to have your devs in close combat before they ever fire a shot. If you want bait, maybe Sternguard? At least they can shoot on the turn they arrive. Not sure how the point cost would compare though. Both would be fairly expensive.

[Gv0zD]

I'm gonna side with both knife&fork and Morollan. 10 devs with plasmas in a drop pod is both too risky and pricey. As Morollan suggested Sternguard are better as they can shoot when they arrive, also have flexible ammo, and are better in CC if the get assaulted due to more attacks.

[JamesI]

I'm gonna side with both knife&fork and Morollan. 10 devs with plasmas in a drop pod is both too risky and pricey. As Morollan suggested Sternguard are better as they can shoot when they arrive, also have flexible ammo, and are better in CC if the get assaulted due to more attacks.

Agreed. Devs in a pod aren't the best plan, if they could shoot the turn they landed it would be awesome (but then everyone would be doing it).

 

Sternguard will work even better with combi-weapons and able to shoot when they land

[knife&fork]

I don't think there's anything wrong with deploying dev or tac squads with drop pods, I just think that it's not such a good idea to drop an expensive unit that can't shoot well on the turn they arrive or assault right next to the enemy.

[meniscusmike]

I did think about a sternguard but a unit of ten with no upgrades is 250pts while a unit of devs with a fist, 3 meltas and a plasma cannon is only 240pts. Just saying...

I suppose saying podding in someone face was a poor choice of words, perhaps podding the unit in a place where they can't be ignored would have been a better way of putting it.

[*Riken*]

Even with the slightly high point cost dropping sternguard would be a better option load them afew combi weapons so they can deal with tougher units and tanks and they can still hold there own in CC. Dropping devs just seems like a bad idea to me, as dropping them far away so they can sit for a turn seems kind of pointless and you drop them too close and they will get assaulted. Also using Multi meltas puts you within 24 inches of the enemy line or within 12 if you want to use the melta rules. 12 inches your going to be assaulted just to keep them from firing and within 24 i think a half decent opponent would either target he devs and obliterate them or put a meat shield in front of his tanks so they at least get cover. Don't mind my touch of heresy here but, drop podding Havoc marines with 4 melta or plasma guns that would be worth it.

[knife&fork]

I did think about a sternguard but a unit of ten with no upgrades is 250pts while a unit of devs with a fist, 3 meltas and a plasma cannon is only 240pts. Just saying...

I suppose saying podding in someone face was a poor choice of words, perhaps podding the unit in a place where they can't be ignored would have been a better way of putting it.

 

Yes, nothing wrong with podding them in to a flanking position in an otherwise empty board section. It's certainly more reliable than using a rhino. But since you want to keep your distance the multi melta is not the right tool for the job. One is ok to get better anti tank up close and encourage your opponent to keep his distance. Maybe 3*ML or 3*PC plus one MM. Put a combi weapon on the sergeant and don't bother with the fist. Those points are better spent upgrading the drop pod stormbolter to a deathwind which makes the pod much harder to just ignore, forcing your opponent to deal with and hopefully taking some of the heat off your devastators. NOrmally I wouldn't recommend the deathwind but in this context it makes sense.

[Sanguinarian]

I did think about a sternguard but a unit of ten with no upgrades is 250pts while a unit of devs with a fist, 3 meltas and a plasma cannon is only 240pts. Just saying...

I suppose saying podding in someone face was a poor choice of words, perhaps podding the unit in a place where they can't be ignored would have been a better way of putting it.

 

Yes, nothing wrong with podding them in to a flanking position in an otherwise empty board section. It's certainly more reliable than using a rhino. But since you want to keep your distance the multi melta is not the right tool for the job. One is ok to get better anti tank up close and encourage your opponent to keep his distance. Maybe 3*ML or 3*PC plus one MM. Put a combi weapon on the sergeant and don't bother with the fist. Those points are better spent upgrading the drop pod stormbolter to a deathwind which makes the pod much harder to just ignore, forcing your opponent to deal with and hopefully taking some of the heat off your devastators. NOrmally I wouldn't recommend the deathwind but in this context it makes sense.

 

 

The Deathwind ML puts you even closer than the MM!There just isn't a good reason to drop pod a Devastator Squad. Their job description is to kill stuff on Turn 1, not Turn 3 when they get into position and are now only a 5-man squad.

 

Only Sternguard and Dreadnoughts do exceptionally well in Drop Pods.

 

Devastators (and Sniper Scouts) deploy on rooftops; inside buildings or ruins; or in terrain. All of which should provide Cover Saves and have wide fields of kill zones.

 

YOU can do what you want, but we believe the chances of success are slim. ;)

[knife&fork]

The Deathwind ML puts you even closer than the MM!There just isn't a good reason to drop pod a Devastator Squad. Their job description is to kill stuff on Turn 1, not Turn 3 when they get into position and are now only a 5-man squad.

 

Only Sternguard and Dreadnoughts do exceptionally well in Drop Pods.

 

Devastators (and Sniper Scouts) deploy on rooftops; inside buildings or ruins; or in terrain. All of which should provide Cover Saves and have wide fields of kill zones.

 

YOU can do what you want, but we believe the chances of success are slim. :tu:

 

Huh?

 

The deathwind is an upgrade to the drop pod, it's not going anywhere. It's just a S5 large blast there to make your opponent think twice about going close to the drop zone.

 

I think it's pretty given that we don't just drop our devs in the open somewhere, it's implied you drop them close to a building or area terrain which they can march right into when they dismount. Buildings, ruins and terrain can be anywhere on the table, not just in your deployment zone unless you play with some very odd house rules.

 

I'm not sure why you think only dreads and sternguard benefit from pods.

[Sanguinarian]

Huh?

 

The deathwind is an upgrade to the drop pod, it's not going anywhere. It's just a S5 large blast there to make your opponent think twice about going close to the drop zone.

 

I think it's pretty given that we don't just drop our devs in the open somewhere, it's implied you drop them close to a building or area terrain which they can march right into when they dismount. Buildings, ruins and terrain can be anywhere on the table, not just in your deployment zone unless you play with some very odd house rules.

 

I'm not sure why you think only dreads and sternguard benefit from pods.

 

Not saying you can't, just saying you lose a Turn or 2 of shooting when you do. By the time you get them into proper firing positions, your CC units should be in the thick of a fight. Sure you can then keep the big uglies at bay around Turn 3, but why not just start on the board with 4xML that can shoot anything they aim at within 48"? Sternguard and Dreads are just more solid choices since they can also CC - at least better than a Heavy Weapons Team. Just a matter of preference. -_-

 

As far as DWML goes, it can't shoot on Turn 1, and after that, unless it has an LB on it, why would anyone need to go near it? It's instantly immobolized, so isn't that a KP? I guess it's just because I've never dropped a pod in the middle of a ruined city. My DC Dread prefers to drop in behind enemy lines and crunch and munch his prey while driving them into the meat-grinder approaching from the other side of the board. To each their own.

[meniscusmike]

I feel like i need to explain myself regarding this idea. First i want the dev unit to be a distraction as i only have one drop pod it will arrive turn one and because I'm not a moron I'll hopefully have the presense of mind to either drop them or run them into some cover. I appreciate firing turn one is ideal but spending a turn to get a good position is sometimes worth the sacrifice and it wouldn't matter in dawn of war anyway. Ideally it would be great to start shooting things once on the table but what i hope the unit does is put the opponent on the back foot early. This dev unit must be dealt with which takes the preasure off the rest of the army to get in close, the fist makes them more prickly in assault or they can ignore them in which case they're taking fire from 4 heavy weapons. Either result is good, sometime a unit doesn't have to kill alot of things to have been effective sometime the preceive threat they impose is enough for them to get the opponent to do what you want them to do.

[Gv0zD]

To each their own.

QFT. If you find such tactics useful and awarding- go for it. In my opinion, having a distraction worth of 240 pts that cannot shoot until turn 3 is not effective. Also, why would anyone get distracted by a unit, that's gonna shoot only in turn 3? Doing this you give your opponent more time to set up his forces, and possibly thin your own troops. So by the time Devs will pose *real* threat, he'll be able to counter them by either shooting or CC units, that had already dealt with some of yours that were deployed from the beginning.

 

Just my 0,02$

[Sanguinarian]

I feel like i need to explain myself regarding this idea. First i want the dev unit to be a distraction as i only have one drop pod it will arrive turn one and because I'm not a moron I'll hopefully have the presense of mind to either drop them or run them into some cover. I appreciate firing turn one is ideal but spending a turn to get a good position is sometimes worth the sacrifice and it wouldn't matter in dawn of war anyway. Ideally it would be great to start shooting things once on the table but what i hope the unit does is put the opponent on the back foot early. This dev unit must be dealt with which takes the preasure off the rest of the army to get in close, the fist makes them more prickly in assault or they can ignore them in which case they're taking fire from 4 heavy weapons. Either result is good, sometime a unit doesn't have to kill alot of things to have been effective sometime the preceive threat they impose is enough for them to get the opponent to do what you want them to do.

 

You are absolutely right. If that is your intention for DoW scenarios specifically, then yes you might as well move into as best a position as you can until the fog lifts. But what happens in non-DoA scenarios or on an empty board?

[knife&fork]

Not saying you can't, just saying you lose a Turn or 2 of shooting when you do. By the time you get them into proper firing positions, your CC units should be in the thick of a fight. Sure you can then keep the big uglies at bay around Turn 3, but why not just start on the board with 4xML that can shoot anything they aim at within 48"? Sternguard and Dreads are just more solid choices since they can also CC - at least better than a Heavy Weapons Team. Just a matter of preference. :woot:

 

As far as DWML goes, it can't shoot on Turn 1, and after that, unless it has an LB on it, why would anyone need to go near it? It's instantly immobolized, so isn't that a KP? I guess it's just because I've never dropped a pod in the middle of a ruined city. My DC Dread prefers to drop in behind enemy lines and crunch and munch his prey while driving them into the meat-grinder approaching from the other side of the board. To each their own.

 

Keeping a tactical reserve lets you react to unexpected situation or take advantage of weakness. The drop pod is unique in that you can place that reserve anywhere on the table in an extremely safe manner because of the inertial guidance and the fact that you simply can't be targeted before you arrive. Having the squad start on board is not an automatic advantage, specially if deployment doesn't go your way.

 

The entire battle /probably) doesn't hinge on that dev squad, they are there to force the opponent to make some uncomfortable decisions like how to face his armor or giving up shooting in favor of moving or running. As a bonus you also get the pod to use for LOS blocking, cover and fire. The down side is of course that you might lose one turn of shooting and that you'll have less target saturation if you don't go first.

 

Why would anyone go near the pod? Because they want to deal with the dev squad raining plasma on their backs from the patch of jungle next to it.

 

It's not about preference or having to pick one favorite, it's about recognizing that the pod can be valuable for a long range unit as well.

[meniscusmike]

The drop pod does arrive on turn one so at the latest they're going to be doing their thing by turn two. This is all just theory understand I'll need to try it out few times and see how it work out.

[toaae]

I like the basic idea, what with using Multi-Meltas to scare your opponent. 4 effectively closes off a 12" area around the squad from vehicles. But, rather then dropping them in, I'd rather put them in a rhino, and be able to drive them up to a spot. It's area denial to vehicles. If your opponent is heavy-vehicles, such a squad can help you dictate his movement.

 

More I think about it, a 6 man squad in a Heavy-Flamer Razorback is a fairly effective area-denial unit. The multi-meltas take care of vehicles, and the Razorback deals with troops.