Orbital Skulls

[Khorneeq]

Hi,

little problem with determining what rule has more power :)

 

Orbital Strike "...always scatter the full 2D6..."

Servo-skulls "...friendly blast templates placed within 12" of a Servo-skull roll one D6 less for scatter...".

 

Does the skull reduce this specific scatter?

 

Thanks in advance B)

[Grey Mage]

At the moment its going to be RAI, as theres not a BRB solution to this.

 

On one hand, it says always. Thats pretty strong language, and probly overrides the skull.

 

On the other hand, you could say the rule is designed to make sure you dont use BS to reduce scatter, and so the -d6 should really come into effect.

 

Id talk it over with your opponent, and be prepared to scatter 2d6 atleast until the FAQ comes out.

[Khorneeq]

Thanks Grey Mage.

It was analyze of possibilities at the stage of list making rather than problem that arose while playing.

So until it will be answered in FAQ it wouldn't be used. Simple, so why complicate game when it's not necessary. :D

[Brother Tyler]

I'd say that the "always" in the orbital strike overrides anything - nothing can change that, not even the servo skull. That word was included for a very specific reason.

[greatcrusade08]

id agree with brother Tyler.. the sheer number of weapons that can benefit from the servo skulls already warrants thier inclusion and then factor in the stoppage to infiltrate and scout moves.

 

these things are already well undercosted as it is.

[nurglez]

Yes it always scatters, unless used by karamazov to target a friendly... though in his rules it does specify that it doesn't scatter at all.

 

As I'm very unlikely to use orbital strikes, I dont see this becoming a problem, but I feel that it should probably scatter 1d6 if in range of a skull. Of course thats just my opinion and have no way to back it up :D

[Isiah]

I'd say Codex overrides BRB as that is the foundation of the rules cascade. If this is not intended to override the Orbital Strike rule then it should be FAQ'd. Probably worth sending the question in for possible confirmation either way.

[Frosty the Pyro]

both are codex rules, so are of an equal value, however always precludes alteration, otherwise the rule would simply state you do not subtract your BS when using it. It scaters the 2d6 regardless

[Wildfire]

Right now it's a grey area as far as RAW goes.

 

For me, I usually go by the rule of thumb "specific overrides general". I.e. the servo-skull rule is for all scatter, which is more general than the orbital strike rule which only applies to one specific type of scatter (it's own), and Karamazov is even more specific (he only affects his own orbital strike).

[DevianID]

my belated 2 cents... if it was always supposed to scatter than kaz would not make it do anything than always scatter 2d6. Thus the always is not set in stone.

 

As for specific versus general, it doesnt work logically.

 

In general, the orbital blast always scatters 2d6 inches.

When the orbital blast is specifically in range of a skull, reduce the scatter by 1d6 inches.

[Frosty the Pyro]

General vs specific is not a Warhammer rule, its a DnD rule.

[greatcrusade08]

the fact that the word "always" is used leads me to believe the skulls have no effect on OB

[Isiah]

both are codex rules, so are of an equal value, however always precludes alteration, otherwise the rule would simply state you do not subtract your BS when using it. It scaters the 2d6 regardless

 

Ah silly me yes <_< . In that case yes skulls have no effect.

[DevianID]

both are codex rules, so are of an equal value, however always precludes alteration, otherwise the rule would simply state you do not subtract your BS when using it. It scaters the 2d6 regardless

 

Ah silly me yes . In that case yes skulls have no effect.

 

What about kazamarof and the orbital strike relay? Its also a codex rule, and like servo skulls it prevents the OSR from always scattering 2d6. According to the logic above Kaz's rule wouldnt work either.

[Something Wycked]

While I agree with you, DevianID, the opposite side could say Karamazov's OSR is unique and follows its own rules since his rules specifically overwrite the regular rules.

 

I think the skulls' rules overwrite the regular OSR rules too, but that's ambiguous RAW for you :lol:

[greatcrusade08]

Kara fellas rules are specific to the OB, whereas servo skulls are general to blast weapons... as the servo skulls do not state they allow for the benefit to effect OB then the OBs more sepcific rules outweigh them.

[Something Wycked]

lol thank you, GC08, for filling in my "the opposite side could say" with someone actually saying it. In support for my interpretation of the rules, however:

 

Servo-skulls:

... friendly blast templates placed within 12" of a Servo-skull roll one D6 less for scatter.

Orbital Strike Relay (weapon types only):

Barrage bomb: Large Blast. Lance strike: Blast, Lance. Psyk-out bomb: Large Blast, Psi-shock.

I would argue that the world "all" can be inferred before the word "friendly" and as such all OSR strikes are included, since "friendly blast templates" is all-inclusive and would even include blast template weapons from another player who is your ally with a force that are not even Grey Knights.

 

"All" is just as strong of language as "always", even if it must be inferred.

[greatcrusade08]

yeah but you cant add in words and then base your argument on that added word.. its a little silly