Astartes Inquisitor?

[Prathios]

Who would have thought just a few years ago that the Space Puppies would be riding around on giant wolves and Grey Knights would have exo suits... But clearly if it hasn't been done before it can't happen later.

[MadDoc]

And fluff wise. Nathaniel Garro. Now I haven't heard the audiobooks about him however. The grey knights have their own gene seed so Garro could not be one of them. He could be made into a deathwatch for intents and purposes but when telling him about his new assignment the emperors right hand man clearly states " we need people of an inquisitive nature" which to me leads to believe he was turned into an inquisitor. To say this wouldn't happen again is a very narrow minded approach.

What is with this continued insistance of some people in reading so much into a single line in a single source? Read all of the relevant sources (which have been mentioned already) and you'll see that of the 12 people Malcador collected and brought before the Emperor the four Mortals went on to form the Inquisition and the eight Astartes went on to form the Grey Knights (no mention of their geneseed being used, C:GK even says a second specially engineered source was used for that purpose), meaning Garro was not an Inquisitor (I have heard all of the HH audiobooks released thus far, and Garro's actions in them don't even resemble those of an Inquisitor).

 

If you're going to try and use a background "facts" to justify something, try presenting those facts in context and with all the relevant material given due consideration, rather than simply resorting to the selective interpretation of a single sentence from a single source.

 

Hows this relevant some of you may ask?

 

Just trying to keep things honest by ensuring the "facts" that some are using to support their position are put in proper perspective and that errors/misrepresentations/misinterpretations (of limited sources) don't get mixed up with the actual facts.

[Brother Captain Kezef]

I do get bored of the "Garro is Death Guard so can't be a grey Knight because he doesn't have Grey Knight geneseed" argument.

 

NONE of the first 8 grandmasters where Grey Knights.

[Prathios]

I do get bored of the "Garro is Death Guard so can't be a grey Knight because he doesn't have Grey Knight geneseed" argument.

 

NONE of the first 8 grandmasters where Grey Knights.

 

The only thing that puts a wrench in it for me is his lack of psychic powers. He could have trained the recruits in combat and the ways of daemons but not in any of the special GK stuff that revolves around the aegis.

[Inquisitor Apropos]

Space Marines and Inquisitors have completely different duties that require completely different skillsets. Also, an Astartes Inquisitor would be a lot more restricted in his options for addressing many situations; an 8-foot tall 1000 lb superhuman wouldn't really do too well with undercover work, for example.

 

Do you really find it unusual for an Inquisitor to work by proxy? If only there were an example of one who did. Perhaps he could be a cripple, in a heavily armoured life support chair. Now, let's say he's a powerful psyker, with a genius level intellect and a highly skilled team of operatives. But that's just silly. No one would buy that.

 

Sarcasm aside, your other comments about the political implications of the Inquisition attempting to recruit Astartes as Interrogators is pretty much on the mark. Most Chapters wouldn't allow it. Most Inquisitors wouldn't try it. But that doesn't make it impossible, just incredibly improbable. And remember what Terry Pratchett said: "Million to one chances crop up nine times out of ten."

[Brother Captain Kezef]

I do get bored of the "Garro is Death Guard so can't be a grey Knight because he doesn't have Grey Knight geneseed" argument.

 

NONE of the first 8 grandmasters where Grey Knights.

 

The only thing that puts a wrench in it for me is his lack of psychic powers. He could have trained the recruits in combat and the ways of daemons but not in any of the special GK stuff that revolves around the aegis.

 

I don't see it as a problem.

 

The first 8 Grand Masters would of been chosen for what they could teach the growing Chapter. I'm sure some (maybe even most) of the first 8 where pyskers but it does not assume they all where.

 

I'd imagine a mix of abilities and skills brought by the first 8, garro's skills and experience would be invaluable. I just can't believe that the Sigilite wouldn't recruit Garro into this project.

 

People assume each Grand Master was given a Brotherhood and trained them on their own, I don't think it would of worked that way.

[Brother Captain Kezef]

Space Marines and Inquisitors have completely different duties that require completely different skillsets. Also, an Astartes Inquisitor would be a lot more restricted in his options for addressing many situations; an 8-foot tall 1000 lb superhuman wouldn't really do too well with undercover work, for example.

 

Do you really find it unusual for an Inquisitor to work by proxy? If only there were an example of one who did. Perhaps he could be a cripple, in a heavily armoured life support chair. Now, let's say he's a powerful psyker, with a genius level intellect and a highly skilled team of operatives. But that's just silly. No one would buy that.

 

Sarcasm aside, your other comments about the political implications of the Inquisition attempting to recruit Astartes as Interrogators is pretty much on the mark. Most Chapters wouldn't allow it. Most Inquisitors wouldn't try it. But that doesn't make it impossible, just incredibly improbable. And remember what Terry Pratchett said: "Million to one chances crop up nine times out of ten."

 

I agree that a Chapter wouldn't give up one of their marines easily.

 

But what about the death watch or Grey Knights? As i mentioned, Ben Counter's novels show how a Grey Knight could evolve into an Inquisitor. A Death watch marine, especialy a black shield, could go through a similar process.

 

Nobody is saying it's at all likely, but it's not impossible.

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

Space Marines and Inquisitors have completely different duties that require completely different skillsets. Also, an Astartes Inquisitor would be a lot more restricted in his options for addressing many situations; an 8-foot tall 1000 lb superhuman wouldn't really do too well with undercover work, for example.

 

Do you really find it unusual for an Inquisitor to work by proxy? If only there were an example of one who did. Perhaps he could be a cripple, in a heavily armoured life support chair. Now, let's say he's a powerful psyker, with a genius level intellect and a highly skilled team of operatives. But that's just silly. No one would buy that.

 

Ravenor didn't start out that way, and was a field agent for Eisenhorn at the beginning of his career. You really think an Inquisitor just gets handed an office and suddenly has a group of operatives and contacts across the Imperium? The very nature of the job requires that you start at the bottom and work your way up, learning from a more experienced Inquisitor, as well as making contacts and picking up some troubled souls to join you in your fight against the threats to the Imperium of Man.

 

Sure, an Inquisitor could just ride roughshod over local government officials, appropriate armies and demanding everything his rosette will get him, but that rarely works because the person you're hunting would see you coming a mile away and be long gone before you got there. Subterfuge is the way most Inquisitors get their job done. And based on the reaction a normal person in this universe has to an Astartes, it would be disastrous for one to be out and about in a hive, trying to blend in.

[Brother Captain Kezef]

Space Marines and Inquisitors have completely different duties that require completely different skillsets. Also, an Astartes Inquisitor would be a lot more restricted in his options for addressing many situations; an 8-foot tall 1000 lb superhuman wouldn't really do too well with undercover work, for example.

 

Do you really find it unusual for an Inquisitor to work by proxy? If only there were an example of one who did. Perhaps he could be a cripple, in a heavily armoured life support chair. Now, let's say he's a powerful psyker, with a genius level intellect and a highly skilled team of operatives. But that's just silly. No one would buy that.

 

Ravenor didn't start out that way, and was a field agent for Eisenhorn at the beginning of his career. You really think an Inquisitor just gets handed an office and suddenly has a group of operatives and contacts across the Imperium? The very nature of the job requires that you start at the bottom and work your way up, learning from a more experienced Inquisitor, as well as making contacts and picking up some troubled souls to join you in your fight against the threats to the Imperium of Man.

 

Sure, an Inquisitor could just ride roughshod over local government officials, appropriate armies and demanding everything his rosette will get him, but that rarely works because the person you're hunting would see you coming a mile away and be long gone before you got there. Subterfuge is the way most Inquisitors get their job done. And based on the reaction a normal person in this universe has to an Astartes, it would be disastrous for one to be out and about in a hive, trying to blend in.

 

 

Unless the Astartes in question has worked with an Inquisitor for many years and is chosen as that Inquisitor's successor, inheriting the network of informants and operatives.....

 

The problem is the assumption that all astartes are mindless killeers with no appreciation of subtlety. There are MANY examples of Astartes skilled in diplomacy, subtlety and even subterfuge. Marneus Calgar, Dante, hell even Logan Grimnar has diplomatic skills and he's a bloody wolf!

 

They prove that an astartes can rise through the ranks and gain the skills required to be an Inquisitor if their paths went differently. There is every reason to assume that a Deathwatch Black Shield or even a Grey Knight like Justicar Alaric can become an inquisitor under rare and exeptional circumstances.

[Something Wycked]

This is good stuff right here, Kezef. An Astartes Inquisitor would need an excellent sense of discretion. Working through proxies for 99% of everything that needs to be handled, he could have one of his henchmen pose as an Inquisitor if the presence of an Inquisitor needed to be known. The Astartes could pose as a bodyguard if the danger was great enough, or simply stay hidden and direct his proxies from afar until such time as he needed to physically be present.

 

I don't think it improbable that given an excellent relationship with at least one Inqusitor, the Astartes could be gifted a henchman or two and piggyback on the Inquisitor's contacts for a short time while developing his own network.

[Chengar Qordath]

I don't think it improbable that given an excellent relationship with at least one Inqusitor, the Astartes could be gifted a henchman or two and piggyback on the Inquisitor's contacts for a short time while developing his own network.

That's quite plausible; according to their respective books Eisenhorn and Ravenor both inherited some henchmen and contacts from their masters, after all.

 

Like most of the complications with an Astartes Inquisitor, the need to do a lot of work via proxies is a weakness/drawback that makes managing an Astartes Inquisitor more difficult, but not something that makes it flat-out impossible.

[MadDoc]

I ask the B&C the following question:

 

Would it be possible for an Astartes to become an Inquisitor? Lets set up a hypothetical situation just to explain away most of the stumbling blocks- stack the deck in his favor, as it were.

 

*SNIP*

 

Is it possible? What are your thoughts?

Perhaps a better question than either of those for your OP might have been "What do I need to account for, or ignore, to make an Astartes Inquisitor happen?", since thats been the basic path the thread has followed.

 

This entire exercise has been about getting others to validate your already fixed position, you never had any intention of doing anything other than ignore any comments or arguments which ran contrary to your position (even going so far as to modify your proposed hypothetical to remove possible impediments that were raised).

 

You demand fluff proof from Kage and I, and yet ignore the established fluff patterns Kage has offered, and conveniently ignore the fact that I've personally debunked one of the most repeated (and false/flawed) arguments in support of your position.

 

If you'd been honest up front and just said something like, "How can I make this work within the background?" there wouldn't have been an issue. You were not though, you asked the above questions and then did everything possible to ignore any opinions contrary to your desired outcome. Kage is right, this thread is a joke. :)

[Something Wycked]

Funny that its only yourself and Kage that feel that way, MD. Thanks for the input though, have a great night ;)

[MadDoc]

You're right we should have followed the example of the others who saw this thread for what it really was and not have bothered with it.

 

Thanks for ignoring any input that disagrees with your desired outcome, and wasting our/my time...

[Task Force Gauntlet]

It's Wycked's fluff, let him do what he wants with it. The best idea I saw was the "Inquisitor dies, Marine in retinue picks up work load" one, that I'll probably take and use on my own. But really, let this thing die already, it's turning into a flame war.

[Brother Captain Kezef]

It's Wycked's fluff, let him do what he wants with it. The best idea I saw was the "Inquisitor dies, Marine in retinue picks up work load" one, that I'll probably take and use on my own. But really, let this thing die already, it's turning into a flame war.

 

Yeah it's an angle I quite like, goes with the stuborn sense of duty most astartes have. The jo isn't done, so the Marine will make sure it's finished.