prenelf Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Just having a read of the codex and i saw that the vindicator comes with a storm bolter standard but you can also buy one. does this mean that you can have two on top of the tank or is it just a mistake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Like Rhinos, Vindicators come with a Storm Bolter and can buy another. One of the flukiest things I ever saw was my Vindicator got the big gun destroyed and was immobilized. Having no other targets in LOS, I fired the stormbolter at 2 Deathwing terminators. 2 hits, 2 wounds, both saves came up 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prenelf Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 haha! nice the best i got was taking out a dark reaper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Who remembers to shoot the SB on drops pods? ... not me. They only time I did it sored two wounds on a IG command squad that ran off the table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prenelf Posted May 11, 2011 Author Share Posted May 11, 2011 also im just wondering why it costs so much to put a storm bolter on tanks? its only 3 points for a marine to have one but 10 for a tank?? why not 5 points? i love storm bolters and really wish that tac squads could all take storm bolters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baba Lem Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Having an additional weapon in case of a vehicle means they're more survivable against consecutive scores of Weapon Destroyed on the damage chart. And a driving Rhino, is certainly better than an immobile one. Though, who really does bother to buy the SB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD78 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 I've never bought it, but I can see where it might come in handy - thinning the ranks so the pie plate has a bigger likelihood of making them remove something valuable from under it. Still, I'd rather take a siege shield for the same cost. And why doesn't the siege shield count as extra armor, anyway? If I was going to make a house rule, that thing would count as ABLATIVE armor, taking hits meant for the tank until it was destroyed by a weapon destroyed or eating a vehicle destroyed result (not a "destroyed and blows up" roll - just the "destroyed" roll). Might even count it as bumping the front armor of the tank up to FA14. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 personally, I don't think the Stormbolter is worth it. Remember, you can't fire the stormbolter the same turn as the big gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Chris Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Cost is different because it is an upgrade to the marine (Sternguard or sergeant etc), replacing an all ready paid for bolter. For the vehicle it is completely additional. I still think it is a mistake, I have never seen a GW picture of a rhino type with two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Cost is different because it is an upgrade to the marine (Sternguard or sergeant etc), replacing an all ready paid for bolter. For the vehicle it is completely additional. I still think it is a mistake, I have never seen a GW picture of a rhino type with two. Its legal, just not usually a great idea for the cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD78 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 personally, I don't think the Stormbolter is worth it. Remember, you can't fire the stormbolter the same turn as the big gun. If it's stationary, you can't fire all of the weapons? Rulebook says you can stay stationary and fire all weapons (BRB p.73) move at combat speed (6") and fire one weapon plus all defensive weapons (BRB p.73) - and stormbolters count as a defensive weapon (C:BA p.60, BRB p.58) I agree that I don't think it's worth it with one exception - if you've got 10 points to spare because you've outfitted everything else in your list with every possible upgrade and you're still 10 points under the point limit... THEN it's worth it. Otherwise, I wouldn't bother with it, and I don't really see why they even offer it as a choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 personally, I don't think the Stormbolter is worth it. Remember, you can't fire the stormbolter the same turn as the big gun. If it's stationary, you can't fire all of the weapons? Rulebook says you can stay stationary and fire all weapons (BRB p.73) move at combat speed (6") and fire one weapon plus all defensive weapons (BRB p.73) - and stormbolters count as a defensive weapon (C:BA p.60, BRB p.58) I agree that I don't think it's worth it with one exception - if you've got 10 points to spare because you've outfitted everything else in your list with every possible upgrade and you're still 10 points under the point limit... THEN it's worth it. Otherwise, I wouldn't bother with it, and I don't really see why they even offer it as a choice. You can't fire an ordnance weapon and other weapons the same turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD78 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Not even with PotMS at BS 2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Not even with PotMS at BS 2? First, POTMS is BS4 now. Second, Vindicators can't take POTMS anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Otherwise, I wouldn't bother with it, and I don't really see why they even offer it as a choice Because if they didnt then everyone'd be discussing why they didnt. It potentially gives your vindi a whole extra life (another weapon to destroy before it gets wrecked by glancing hits), gives you firepower approximatley equivalent to a combat squad of marines if your main gun gets destroyed, and boosts your firepower for when you dont dare fire your main gun (if your units are too intermingled with the enemy to fire a 3" blast into the mix). There is a use for eveything in the Codex, but there are a lot of people who lack the comprehension to see them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD78 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Not even with PotMS at BS 2? First, POTMS is BS4 now. Second, Vindicators can't take POTMS anymore Army Builder'd AGAIN! :cuss I'm about to email them and ask for a refund or something. So far it's screwed up: Wargear options Transport vehicle capability And now, PotMS. Is asking for a non-screwball data file for AB against the rules? Seriously, right now it's telling me I can fit 30 death company models inside a Razorback. Also, the attacker gets to choose which weapon gets destroyed on a weapon destroyed result on the vehicle damage table, not the owner of the model. So there's no extra life for the pintle-mounted storm bolter. Edit: If I were to hazard a guess, the extra storm bolter is to give it at least 4 bolter shots while moving, instead of having to move then sit there like a wounded duck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 Well, it is legal to take 30 DC and give them a Razorback, its just not legal to put them in it. Army Builder should NEVER be taken as a perfect source. It makes mistakes. Always check in the rulebook or Codex to be sure (I stopped using Army Builder mostly because of the issues of fixing it to be perfect took longer than I felt it was worth. The extra stormbolter can add life to a Vindicator. On a weapon destroyed result and there are no weapons, it upgrades to immobilized. If already immobilized, it upgrades to wrecked. So that extra weapon could extend the life of the vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD78 Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 A vindicator without its demolisher cannon might as well be destroyed anyway, so it's kind of like keeping a brain dead person on life support, in my opinion. But yeah, I see where you're coming from on that - at least the smoking hulk can be used as mobile cover until it's immobilized! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 11, 2011 Share Posted May 11, 2011 A vindicator without its demolisher cannon might as well be destroyed anyway, so it's kind of like keeping a brain dead person on life support, in my opinion. But yeah, I see where you're coming from on that - at least the smoking hulk can be used as mobile cover until it's immobilized! A Vindicator without a demolisher cannon is a battering ram! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD78 Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 Ha, yeah - did they add that in the new edition, or did I just not notice it during 4ed? I wasn't playing many vehicles back then, and the vehicles I was playing against weren't interested in ramming at all (tau, IG, necron). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 a vindi without a main gun can also win you the game by contesting an objective, so is that worth 10pts? Maybe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PD78 Posted May 12, 2011 Share Posted May 12, 2011 I like the battering ram idea better. I actually tank shocked an IG company away from a pretty important bit of our gaming table tonight with a demolisher-less vindicator - we had an orbital relay set up in the center of the table, and if you managed to keep a troop unit in base contact with it for an entire turn, starting the next turn's shooting phase and every turn afterward that you had at least one unit in physical contact with it, you could call down an orbital strike (from the chapter master special rules in the C:SM). If I hadn't managed to pull that off, I would've taken a lot more casualties than I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.