Falcons vs halberds mathhammer

[number6]

There are no I3 and lower units I can think of that require bonus power weapon attacks to eliminate. Even basic GKs with swords should be capable of taking these units down. You need neither extra attacks nor I6 to help you out.

 

Im thinking of big units of imperial guard and 30 man ork units. The extra attacks would help a LOT in these cases.

 

If you're assaulting 30-man units, you're playing into your opponents hands. They want to bog down superior assault units with tar pits. Thin them down with shooting before assaulting (if you even bother to assault at all). You just don't run into a full-strength unit with just one of your own. I assumed smarter tactical play than that! :lol:

 

And yes, Falchions on our I5 HQ is actually OK instead of a Halberd. However, you still have to pay points for that. And honestly, I think the sword giving you a Storm Shield-equivalent save in close combat for free is a pretty nice deal.

[Brother Dylan]

Well I have to say that in my opinion falchions are only a worth taking on paladins. Paladins have the wounds to still survive going after or at the same time as your opp, then drowning him in powerweapon attacks.

[Chengar Qordath]

Also, in the Falchion's favor, Codex:GK does have options for boosting your initiative/decreasing the enemy's besides using halberds. Falchions become a bit better if you regularly plan to field a Librarian with Quicksilver...

Psyker powers are not reliable enough to be counted upon. In particular, most armies have numerous ways of shutting them down. If your army really needs Quicksilver in order to function properly in the Assault phase, you're doing it wrong.

 

Beyond that, Quicksilver only functions in your player turn. When your opponent's half of the turn comes round, you won't ever have the boosted Init. And, of course, it is in your opponent's turn that furious charging Death Company will come in to kick your butt ... unless you are always at Init 6 to at least make him think about the very real risk you present before committing.

I quite agree; halberds are still generally the better choice in an all-comers list. Things like Quicksilver, Psyk-out Grenades, and the Initiative-reducing result on Pscyhotroke Grenades can all make Falchions better in the right circumstances, but the Halberd always works no matter the situation or opponent.

[bl00d bath76]

If you're assaulting 30-man units, you're playing into your opponents hands. They want to bog down superior assault units with tar pits. Thin them down with shooting before assaulting (if you even bother to assault at all). You just don't run into a full-strength unit with just one of your own. I assumed smarter tactical play than that! laugh.gif

 

But you see that is the brilliance of taking falcons. You CAN assault these huge blogs and win. Your opponent will deliberaly give you the charge as they assume they are safe. This means you can put fireppower elsewhere.

 

However this does not mean i will be taking falcons because i do not like to specialise and halberds are good all round.

[Freman Bloodglaive]

Cleansing flame deals with hordes quite nicely.

[Jaarl Stormfang]

For interceptors or strike squads remember that only having one base attack means that falchions are a higher percentage improvement than they are for purifiers. Something to take into account.

 

Also, only having a couple falchions in say an interceptor squad, means that you keep a higher proportion of your attacks after casualties. Means you need to take a lot more casualties to seriously reduce the effectiveness of the squad. Kind of like having multiple sergeant upgrades. A unit of 10 with 5 falchions has 20 attacks at full strength, and 15 at half strength. Not a great difference and it means your opponent really has to finish your squads off or they'll still be very dangerous.

[yperihitikos]

The squad will shoot at least one time against the incoming assault. In close combat against terminators they will hammerhand. Every sane player would include at least 2 psycannons and most players 4. Otherwise, they will have psybolt ammunition. Psycannons mean less force weapons, less attacks. Obviously, you should get some falchions to counter this.

 

NO as shown by my post this is not the case. Just because you have psycannons this does not change the fact halberds in that squad will kill more as well as gettting less of your squad killed in return. It makes no difference. Also may i ask what the point is in including shooting. No matter if you have falcons or halberds you will kill the same number so when comparing falcons and halberds there is no point in this being factored in.

 

 

First of all your enemies won't assault in full strength due to shooting. 4 psycannons are must due to their effectiveness.

If we say that in an assault you are still 10man strong, you will have 12 halberd attacks or 24 falchion attacks. The enemy that will attack purifiers and threaten them will either have better Def, At and In (special characters) or high Str, Def and low In or low Str, Def and high In. Against special characters, monstrous creatures, big mobs of footmen you need thunderhammers and as many attacks as you can get. Halberds are effective only against berzerkers who die on the other hand from shooting just like any marine from 12 storm bolter shots and 16 S7 rending shots. And any terminator squad prepared to fight grey knights will have thunderhammers and stormshields, where your I6 won't make any difference.

[Brom MKIV]

For interceptors or strike squads remember that only having one base attack means that falchions are a higher percentage improvement than they are for purifiers. Something to take into account.

 

Also, only having a couple falchions in say an interceptor squad, means that you keep a higher proportion of your attacks after casualties. Means you need to take a lot more casualties to seriously reduce the effectiveness of the squad. Kind of like having multiple sergeant upgrades. A unit of 10 with 5 falchions has 20 attacks at full strength, and 15 at half strength. Not a great difference and it means your opponent really has to finish your squads off or they'll still be very dangerous.

 

I was going to say this myself :) If we do the same analysis on gkss and interceptors I suspect we will find falchions perform better than halberds, albeit at far higher cost. Its also worth noting that cleansing flame compliments halberds far more than falchions.

 

Very good analysis overall and thank you for taking the time.

[501st]

Personally i arm all my purifiers with falchions mainly cos they have a librarian with quick silver sitting with them cos then i get it all and with a level 2 librarian i can cast it and still activate force if need be