Anarchyman99 Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Is it worth the trade off of losing one extra close combat attack, to gain one 24" range or two at 12" shooting attacks? Is it only worth it VS 5+ save armies? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Well, clearly a bolter is a better choice on a model with a thunder hammer or power fist. If I actually used DC ever, I would run most with CCW, maybe 1 guy with a bolter and chainsword rather than the bolt pistol just for something different. If you are drop podding, bolters are probably better. taking a Raven or Land Raider, mostly bolt pistol/chainsword instead. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769053 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Theseus Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 If I actually used DC ever, I would run most with CCW, maybe 1 guy with a bolter and chainsword rather than the bolt pistol just for something different Not really a good idea. If you rapid fire with that one guy, then the whole unit is prohibited from assaulting. He would make for a cool model though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769069 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 If I actually used DC ever, I would run most with CCW, maybe 1 guy with a bolter and chainsword rather than the bolt pistol just for something different Not really a good idea. If you rapid fire with that one guy, then the whole unit is prohibited from assaulting. He would make for a cool model though. DC have relentless. They can rapid fire and charge. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769079 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt. Blood Donator Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 I run mine with bolters. D.C, rhino 2 x powerfist and 10 x Bolter. Hope you get the first turn, otherwise hide behind something. Go full out, pop smokes. No matter what happens, they will be in range during your next turn. Even running around and harassing people with bolters, they still absorb a lot of shooting. I like my bullet magnets. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769092 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBW Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 If you did a DC only fluff list with three Ravens, would you take Bolters or Pistols? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769137 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 In Ravens, mostly pistols. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769139 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBMAKENZIE Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 In Ravens, mostly pistols. I disagree James. I think in ravens Bolters would be more useful where you can garunteed set up your assaults carefully and where being able to rapid fire combined with the raven's weapons could clear things out. Obviously theres no definitive answer but it seems to me as though Bolters would be mighty useful on a raven squad. ;) Praticularly to help against stray land speeders or other light tanks or even heavy infantry DC might have trouble with trying to bait you away after your initial assault. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769147 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crimson Cartel Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Slight threadjack here... :) I notice around these parts that most of my brethren seem to prefer DC with bolters over CCW's ... Is this strictly due to points expense? Aren't the DC supposed to be (fluff wise anyway) close combat animals.?. I haven't fielded a single DC model with this new dex, so I have no experience with em... But hitch em to a ride, arm them to the teeth, point in a direction and poof... bye bye bad guys... or no? -CC Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769292 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt. Blood Donator Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Slight threadjack here... :) I notice around these parts that most of my brethren seem to prefer DC with bolters over CCW's ... Is this strictly due to points expense? Aren't the DC supposed to be (fluff wise anyway) close combat animals.?. I haven't fielded a single DC model with this new dex, so I have no experience with em... But hitch em to a ride, arm them to the teeth, point in a direction and poof... bye bye bad guys... or no? -CC Cost they same as B.P and C.C weapon, so no. We're doing it because it's good. And having power weapons on every model is far from viable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769318 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crimson Cartel Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Slight threadjack here... :) I notice around these parts that most of my brethren seem to prefer DC with bolters over CCW's ... Is this strictly due to points expense? Aren't the DC supposed to be (fluff wise anyway) close combat animals.?. I haven't fielded a single DC model with this new dex, so I have no experience with em... But hitch em to a ride, arm them to the teeth, point in a direction and poof... bye bye bad guys... or no? -CC Cost they same as B.P and C.C weapon, so no. We're doing it because it's good. And having power weapons on every model is far from viable. For sure I realize that BP/CCW and Bolters cost the same (was addressing points expense of PW's/Fists,etc.) .. I was more trying to get at the "why" of using them this way,why it is so good. Aren't there units that out-shoot DC (or not due to relentless) for similar points? I know PW's on every model isn't viable, but a small unit with em can wreak havoc right... -CC Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769331 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt. Blood Donator Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Slight threadjack here... :) I notice around these parts that most of my brethren seem to prefer DC with bolters over CCW's ... Is this strictly due to points expense? Aren't the DC supposed to be (fluff wise anyway) close combat animals.?. I haven't fielded a single DC model with this new dex, so I have no experience with em... But hitch em to a ride, arm them to the teeth, point in a direction and poof... bye bye bad guys... or no? -CC Cost they same as B.P and C.C weapon, so no. We're doing it because it's good. And having power weapons on every model is far from viable. For sure I realize that BP/CCW and Bolters cost the same (was addressing points expense of PW's/Fists,etc.) .. I was more trying to get at the "why" of using them this way,why it is so good. Aren't there units that out-shoot DC (or not due to relentless) for similar points? I know PW's on every model isn't viable, but a small unit with em can wreak havoc right... -CC That's what they can't anymore. They're no more resiliant than RAS with a priest. The bolters are good for loads of things, such as chasing speeders, and getting less attacks on the charge. As you want to stay fighting during your opponents turn, B.P and C.S might be overkill. It adds some versatilty and indirect flexibilty to a single-minded unit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2769349 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korloth Darkwolf Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 I use the following unit pretty much most games (occasionally it drops to 8 DC) Reclusiarch, 10 DC (8 bolter and chainsword, 2 bolter and PW) in a Stormraven (TLAC, TLMM, Hurricane) The bolters seem to give me so much more use in most games. I play against orks and nids a lot and there are a few units where I need weight of shots either to get though some invulnerable saves or just to whittle the 30 strong mobs down. An example from the last game I had where having the bolters helped (IMO) far more than the extra attack: It was against Orks in an Annihilation with Dawn of War game. The Orks had deployed first on the halfway line so I was pretty much stuck against my table edge. I started with two 5 man RAS in TLAC razors, the Orks had Thraka, 5 Nobz and a pain boy in a Trukk, along with a 30 strong 'ard boyz mob strung out along the halfway line. By the end of turn two, every Ork reserve was on and I had nothing else apart from a drop pod based Furioso on turn one. Turn three Thraka declared his Waagh and piled into my left side razorback unit, destroying the Razorback. Luckily the RAS were out of the tank and in combat further up the table. Though next turn pretty much all I had on the table would have been lost to Thraka and the Nobz on the charge. I needed some luck for my turn three. I rolled well and My Stormraven came on. I moved 6" deployed the DC and the Reclusiarch within charge range of Thraka. I fired the Hurricane bolters and the DC bolters (both rapid fire) into the unit, whittling a wound off of everything. Then charged in. In that combat phase I managed to fell the whole unit, including the Nobz with 5++ save and Thraka and his 2++ save. I really don't think that the bolt pistol/chainsword combo would have done it in one go. The extra ten attacks in combat, even with the re rolls on the charge, don't produce enough results to warrant the loss of 20 bolter shots in this instance. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2770128 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morollan Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 I really don't think that the bolt pistol/chainsword combo would have done it in one go. The extra ten attacks in combat, even with the re rolls on the charge, don't produce enough results to warrant the loss of 20 bolter shots in this instance. You only lost 10 bolter shots as you would still have had 10 bolt pistols firing. So in this instance you traded 10 bolter shots (which might perhaps have caused all models within 6" to be removed, preventing a charge) for 10 cc attacks with rerolls to hit and wound. There are circumstances in which Bolters>Bolt Pistols. This isn't one of them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2770275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain Angel Posted May 25, 2011 Share Posted May 25, 2011 I take a mix, that way i can put wounds on the bolter dudes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/230483-dc-bolters-and-ccws/#findComment-2770300 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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