My latest battle vs GK notes/highlights

[syypher]

I played against a standard competitive GK list with Dreadnought S8 + Psy weapon spam in Rhinos and an Assassin with the list below. So crap tons of hard to stop Dreads and high S shooting from the Dreads and squad guns.

 

Held 3 objectives at the end of the game to his 0 since I tabled him on turn 6. Gotta say I love the list. In total I lost the Furioso, 1 RB and 1 Predator the entire game. It was a scary list but I mostly outplayed my opponent due to positioning my Predators.

 

Game notes/ Notes on list:

-Have to say I REALLY like the Furioso with Frag Cannons + Pod. I've tested so many variants of the Furioso and I think this is actually my favorite and best one yet. I've also tested them with the Stormraven. It draws fire, good for your Preds and RBs, it doesn't draw fire good for you because now you have a Melta in 2d6 range + S10 weapon going at their AV. Took out a Ven Dread with it! Bought it's points back for sure! I also have to note with a Furioso with Frag Cannons the Pod is definitely the way to go over the SR. Tested games with both transports.

-Mephiston is sick. I have tested him before but never really ran him the way I did this time. I played him more defensive/offensive instead of all out offensive. He didn't get into combat until turn 3 but after that it was 1 Dread or entire squad a turn that he ate. I think his total kill count was 2 Dreadnoughts and 1 squad of GKs. Hopped him behind vehicles until turn 3.

-Attack Bikes were awesome as well and weren't targeted very much. I MUCH rather have Attack Bikes after play testing both them and Speeders. I killed 2 Dreadnoughts with these.

-Tacticals were definitely not missed. I have been testing tacticals out for so many games. The las/tlplas RB + meltagun + 5 RAS was cheaper by 50 something points and MUCH more effective imo. With terrain and well thought out objective placement I was able to unload 5 RAS behind terrain and next to an objective that blocked them completely from view. I then zoomed my RB up to assist in firepower to the rest of my army.

-I really don't think I'm going to change the list very much. EVERYTHING performed very well minus 1 Baal that got immobilized out of range and sight of everything. The Predators were much more reliable and effective than Vindicators compared to my other games with Vindis. IMO Vindis = fun and deadly but Predators = reliable and effective and still deadly.

-Lack of a Librarian was not a big deal. Proper movement gave most anything I wanted cover anyways.

-If I had to change something I would find a way to get dozerblades on my vehicles. I didn't get immobilized because of terrain but I just like having that cushion...Another change is since my list is 5 pts under 1850 I would definitely have bought searchlights. I forgot they were so cheap and should have put them on since we rolled DoW.

 

 

Will try to set up a batrep soon. Sadly no pictures were taken though. Any comments or questions on the list are welcome. BA 1 GK 0

 

 

Mephiston 1

 

Furioso 1

Frag Cannon 1

Transport: Drop Pod 1

 

Assault Squad 5

Meltagun 1

Transport: Razorback 1

TL Assault Cannons 1

 

Assault Squad 5

Meltagun 1

Transport: Razorback 1

TL Assault Cannons 1

 

Assault Squad 5

Transport: Razorback 1

Las/ TL Plas 1

 

Assault Squad 5

Transport: Razorback 1

Las/ TL Plas 1

 

Baal Predator 1

Heavy Bolter Sponsons 1

 

Baal Predator 1

Heavy Bolter Sponsons 1

 

Attack Bikes 2

Multi-Melta 2

 

Predator 1

Las Sponsons 1

 

Predator 1

Las Sponsons 1

 

Predator 1

Las Sponsons 1

[Gridlocked]

-Lack of a Librarian was not a big deal. Proper movement gave most anything I wanted cover anyways.'

 

Just as a note I would say the Libby vs GK would be there for the hood more then anything. But you have Mepphy already there so that works too.

[syypher]

-Lack of a Librarian was not a big deal. Proper movement gave most anything I wanted cover anyways.'

 

Just as a note I would say the Libby vs GK would be there for the hood more then anything. But you have Mepphy already there so that works too.

 

Yup. Failed the hood disruption when he casted the +1 Str stuff anyways. Oh well, still won.

[Zhukov]

Sweet list, good to see you noticed you can play with Razors fine against GK :P (saw your Land Raider/Pred spam list in the list review section and died a little inside :D )

 

Looking forward to seeing more battreps with this list of yours!

[syypher]

Sweet list, good to see you noticed you can play with Razors fine against GK <_< (saw your Land Raider/Pred spam list in the list review section and died a little inside :P )

 

Looking forward to seeing more battreps with this list of yours!

 

Thanks :down:

 

Ya I was a little "too afraid" I guess of all that firepower. I mean a VenDread with S8 TL BS5 that can't be stunned or shaken...cmon! That screams 1 dead RB/Rhino a turn. However proper placement with my normal list with a couple adjustments on my Furioso transport and loadout lead to some great results! :)

 

I guess I just needed a little more confidence in my abilities. It is a very tough fight though keeping those RBs alive so you can contest further objectives...

 

I'm in the works on trying to come up with a 1x LR list. I don't want to spam 3 like my previous list but I think 1 will be viable alone. Finding space is going to be hard though. Maybe if I ever play 2k games I will try a LR...

[Enzephalon]

How exactly did you use Mephiston and the Furioso?

It seems we share the same flavour concerning the playstyle... so I'm a bit curious.

[FallenAngels]

Congrats on your victory! Just so you are aware be careful with Meph against the GK. They have wargear that allow some pretty nasty things to happen to psykers, mainly nemesis force weapons (daemonbane), and psyk out grenades. If you get assaulted by a unit or character with Psyk out grenades (standard equipment usually like frag/krak grenades) mephs initative goes down to 1, and if he takes an unsaved wound from a nemesis weapon he has to pass a leadership test or die. :ermm: just some things to be aware of, your tactics with him worked great, and holding him back a turn or two probably helped you greatly from getting multi assaulted! Congrats on your win again, and I really think you have a solid/impressive all comers list!

[syypher]

How exactly did you use Mephiston and the Furioso?

It seems we share the same flavour concerning the playstyle... so I'm a bit curious.

 

Furioso dropped in then hid in some house that obscured him from my enemy LOS. I had turn 1 and it was DoW so remember that I wasn't able to optimally place him since my opponent kept everything off the field and due to the way Drop Pods come in I had to drop it into an open field. But I dropped the pod in the middle on his deployment area and put the Furioso covered in terrain. What this allowed me to do was to force my opponent to place everything on 1 side, or split his army in half. (My pod and furioso was splitting his deployment zone in half so he had to come out on one side or the other. He placed everything one side and I ran my Furioso and tied up one of the shooty dreadnoughts because I did not want it to shoot at my RBs.

 

Meph was defensively ran up behind a Baal Predator. If he hugs the back of any Pred/RB he won't be seen by the enemy at all. Turn 3 he wings and flew out at a dread and blew it up. He kept consolidating into cover or behind stuff that would make him hard or impossible to see. Then the next turn he would fly out again and tie-up/kill another Dread. Thing is you need to learn to know what to assault. Nothing with lots of PW/TH/PFs. But big enough threats that aren't capable of going through his 2+ very well are perfect...like AC Dreads that GK armies tend to spam!

 

 

@Fallen: Thanks for the heads up and comments! ;)

[HERO]

So RB spam victory over Rhino Spam Psycanons + Riflespam. Grats on the victory, but it sounds incredibly boring and not creative.

[teemoki]

So RB spam victory over Rhino Spam Psycanons + Riflespam. Grats on the victory, but it sounds incredibly boring and not creative.

 

What a useless post... >__>

 

Not every list has to be creative or different than the next guys...Syypher seemed to have fun playing with his list as he tests new Dreadnoughts and different ways to play Meph. I personally like his list and think Mech BA is very fun to play. Nonconstructive criticism like "sounds incredible boring and not creative" should be kept to yourself.

 

Great job Syypher! GK is a tough army for us to beat imo but you make it seem easy ^____^;

[Black Memories]

Good list, I like that I didn't notice the same errors that usually plague most mech lists, that being sang priests and librarians. The 5+ cover save is useful, but man it's about the most over rated thing I've ever seen on the internet. If your armor is properly saturated in a mech list you have enough stuff that you're better off spending the 200 pnts spent on the shields elsewhere.

 

That said welcome to the attack bike dark side. They're abusively good for their price.

 

One other thing I'd say is you may want to consider swapping 1 pred with 1 vindicator. The variety of weaponry won't hurt, and vindicators draw more fire than anything but a stormraven. Even if offensively it doesn't do what you want it to, psychologically it's a massive advantage.

 

Mephiston excels in mechanized lists. A good general with mephiston makes for a difficult opponent, even if the rest of the army is a flop. Mephiston used correctly with stall tactics elsewhere can make up for some very bad rolls or decisions earlier in a game. He's a game changer.

 

Interesting notes on the fragcannon. I've had people swear up and down that it's really good, but I'm still skeptical. Without using a raven though I think drop podding the fragnaught could be terribly effective, good to know it worked out for you.

[HERO]

So RB spam victory over Rhino Spam Psycanons + Riflespam. Grats on the victory, but it sounds incredibly boring and not creative.

 

What a useless post... >__>

 

Not every list has to be creative or different than the next guys...Syypher seemed to have fun playing with his list as he tests new Dreadnoughts and different ways to play Meph. I personally like his list and think Mech BA is very fun to play. Nonconstructive criticism like "sounds incredible boring and not creative" should be kept to yourself.

 

Great job Syypher! GK is a tough army for us to beat imo but you make it seem easy ^____^;

 

 

RB spam vs. RB spam is hardly impressive, please. That's just laughable.

 

If BA is reduced to RB spamming vs GKs because they have absolutely no way to fight I6 Force Halberds, then that's a game design problem, and thus that's something you should be talking about, not take RB spam or go home. That would make for an incredibly lame metagame even more so than it currently is.

 

Instead, you should be asking yourself the following questions given what your opponent took:

 

Are any other lists viable vs. what he took?

What about your unit selection, can anything be subbed out to be more effective? How do you feel about taking a Libby over Meph with Sanguine Sword + Shield for your Razorspam?

Were there any units he had on his side of the field that made your units feel obsolete or useless? What can he do to address your list in the future?

 

Here's what I see with GK lists:

You can't fight I6 Halberds unless you're throwing 2-3x the # of units for cost into combat. You just can't. Only 3 SCs in the army can hit I7+ with FC, and they the chance to get instant-killed.

There's no way to circumvent Rad Grenades, Blind or Psychostroke. How do you deal with this otherwise? The way I see it, GK basically looks BA in the eye and go: You assault me, you lose. As the premiere assault MEQ in the game, I find this to be extremely off-putting.

 

I have GK, BA and SW. It's always interesting to see these armies fight each other, and for that I'm curious.

[Brother Nathan]

i fail to see your point in that. sure ba mech is common, dosent mean its not fun to play. actually we have a few different ways to play. though the way i see it mech is our best matchup vs gk, and this bat rep gives an illustration of that, despite the gk player having dreads with the autocannon things. at the moment grey knights are proobably the worst match up for ba. powerweapons slice tough our armour and fnp with ease, being init 6 just makes it worse, nevermind that they have stormbolters and phsycic powers etc... and i dont know about you but when something can beet you in cc you generally do atack it, you shoot it. razorbacks are a good thing for this. and they are weak so die easy. if anything this shows that greyknights arnt unstopable. which, unlike you obviously, i am glad to hear. You may not find it useful, but i and likely others do. no need to be negative. I think our fellow player did well here, and i thank him for sharing. :)

[Black Memories]

RB spam vs. RB spam is hardly impressive, please. That's just laughable.

 

If BA is reduced to RB spamming vs GKs because they have absolutely no way to fight I6 Force Halberds, then that's a game design problem, and thus that's something you should be talking about, not take RB spam or go home. That would make for an incredibly lame metagame even more so than it currently is.

 

Instead, you should be asking yourself the following questions given what your opponent took:

 

Are any other lists viable vs. what he took?

What about your unit selection, can anything be subbed out to be more effective? How do you feel about taking a Libby over Meph with Sanguine Sword + Shield for your Razorspam?

Were there any units he had on his side of the field that made your units feel obsolete or useless? What can he do to address your list in the future?

 

Here's what I see with GK lists:

You can't fight I6 Halberds unless you're throwing 2-3x the # of units for cost into combat. You just can't. Only 3 SCs in the army can hit I7+ with FC, and they the chance to get instant-killed.

There's no way to circumvent Rad Grenades, Blind or Psychostroke. How do you deal with this otherwise? The way I see it, GK basically looks BA in the eye and go: You assault me, you lose. As the premiere assault MEQ in the game, I find this to be extremely off-putting.

 

I have GK, BA and SW. It's always interesting to see these armies fight each other, and for that I'm curious.

 

While I agree with some of what you're saying, you're reading the OP the way you want and negatively spinning it. In fact if you go back and read his highlights, most of his comments were not about razorback spam, but about the fact that other units in his list really suprised him with how well they did or held up. I really have a hard time reading his post as "oh yes razorbacks are the only way", when clearly the highlights were different units entirely. The only thing mentioned about the razorspam is that they held up to the plethora of S8 shooting and he originally thought that would be an issue.

 

In no way do I think mech is the only way to beat GK. I don't play against super competitive GK players so take what I'm saying with a grain of salt but GK appears to be a situation where assaulting with the right units is a lot better than assaulting with a lot of units. Getting charges is important, and be able to shoot back competitively (have some balance). That's what I took from the post. That's good information that can be used by mech, hybrid, and DoA armies. I get the complaint on mech being boring, but I think you're a bit out of bounds on the comments because the majority of what was said had nothing to do with razorspam.

 

I take mephiston, attack bikes, a furioso, and predators in several of my lists. I also take razorbacks from time to time. By no means am I a razorspam mech player. This information is useful to anyone that wants to read it objectively. In no way did I read this as a "mech spam is the win haha" type post that you seem to be implicating it as. I think you should reread the OP.

[syypher]

@Teemoki, Nathan, Black: Thanks for the kind words and reading my post the way it was meant to be read. Appreciate it :) Also glad to have given a little insight!

 

@Hero: Dude, what's wrong with you? Did you even read my post o_o????? Just like Black Memories said I am not enforcing ANYTHING you are saying or trying to argue about! I just posted information about things that surprised me in my fight against a GK player. Like my initial thought of RBs going obsolete due to the effective S8 firing they can dish out etc. I am not enforcing only 1 way of playing or any of that crap you are spewing out.

 

You have great points and that's an awesome way to analyze plays against the GK that you suggested. However, if you read I am not analyzing how to play against GK. It was merely a report on my thoughts on a game. Is the title of my post "The one and only way to ever beat GK with Blood Angels"? No...but with the way you are responding it damn well seems like it.

 

Also, you seriously need to chill. Teemoki is right, you don't need to be saying that crap your saying which has nothing to even do with my post lol. Enforcing razorspam has NOTHING at all to do with my post. BlackMemories hit the nail on the head with his last post. Either keep your own irrelevant comments to yourself or learn to read.

[JamesI]

Ok, lets try to keep this thread calm. I think if everyone steps back and takes a moment to read the thread, hopefully it can stay on track.

 

I think people are misunderstanding Hero's post. I think he's saying that he believes that Razorspam is the only way to beat GK and he's upset about that as bad game design. I don't agree with him, but my experience against GK is limited.

[HERO]

@Teemoki, Nathan, Black: Thanks for the kind words and reading my post the way it was meant to be read. Appreciate it :P Also glad to have given a little insight!

 

@Hero: Dude, what's wrong with you? Did you even read my post o_o????? Just like Black Memories said I am not enforcing ANYTHING you are saying or trying to argue about! I just posted information about things that surprised me in my fight against a GK player. Like my initial thought of RBs going obsolete due to the effective S8 firing they can dish out etc. I am not enforcing only 1 way of playing or any of that crap you are spewing out.

 

You have great points and that's an awesome way to analyze plays against the GK that you suggested. However, if you read I am not analyzing how to play against GK. It was merely a report on my thoughts on a game. Is the title of my post "The one and only way to ever beat GK with Blood Angels"? No...but with the way you are responding it damn well seems like it.

 

Also, you seriously need to chill. Teemoki is right, you don't need to be saying that crap your saying which has nothing to even do with my post lol. Enforcing razorspam has NOTHING at all to do with my post. BlackMemories hit the nail on the head with his last post. Either keep your own irrelevant comments to yourself or learn to read.

 

I'll be frank: I didn't read your OP as well as I should and I apologize. This is due to me skimming over your army list and wanting to pick out my eyes.

 

To me, BA spamming mech is failed army design. The same could be said about my beloved Space Wolves, where everyone and their grandmother knows how to utilize target priority in boxes with big guns on top from across a map.

 

What I meant to say is this:

 

Blood Angels are meant to be played as a powerful assault army right? An army that's arguably the fastest of the Space Marines as well as the hardest hitting CC/Assault troops right? I have sad news for you all. Assaults into GK w/ I6 Halberds and their grenade sheningans is literally like trying to assault a brick wall with a bottle of water. I've had many games vs. GK with my BA and vice versa and I'd say it's one of the dumbest matchups in the game. It's dumb because if anything, GKs are no longer really Daemonhunters and are more Marine-hunters. I6 Force Weapons cuts through Marines much faster than Daemons sadly, because at least Daemons have a damn invul save. It gets even funnier if they have Khorne Collars.

 

I have 3 armies for Marines, BA, SW and GK. GK came first, then SW and last, BA. Out of all those armies, none of them play like they're supposed to, and for that reason, I'm furious. I took it out in the wrong place, in the wrong thread, so I once again, I'm sorry.

 

But in all honesty, if I see another Razorlist, I'll probably pack up my :) until next edition.

[syypher]

@Teemoki, Nathan, Black: Thanks for the kind words and reading my post the way it was meant to be read. Appreciate it :cuss Also glad to have given a little insight!

 

@Hero: Dude, what's wrong with you? Did you even read my post o_o????? Just like Black Memories said I am not enforcing ANYTHING you are saying or trying to argue about! I just posted information about things that surprised me in my fight against a GK player. Like my initial thought of RBs going obsolete due to the effective S8 firing they can dish out etc. I am not enforcing only 1 way of playing or any of that crap you are spewing out.

 

You have great points and that's an awesome way to analyze plays against the GK that you suggested. However, if you read I am not analyzing how to play against GK. It was merely a report on my thoughts on a game. Is the title of my post "The one and only way to ever beat GK with Blood Angels"? No...but with the way you are responding it damn well seems like it.

 

Also, you seriously need to chill. Teemoki is right, you don't need to be saying that crap your saying which has nothing to even do with my post lol. Enforcing razorspam has NOTHING at all to do with my post. BlackMemories hit the nail on the head with his last post. Either keep your own irrelevant comments to yourself or learn to read.

 

I'll be frank: I didn't read your OP as well as I should and I apologize. This is due to me skimming over your army list and wanting to pick out my eyes.

 

To me, BA spamming mech is failed army design. The same could be said about my beloved Space Wolves, where everyone and their grandmother knows how to utilize target priority in boxes with big guns on top from across a map.

 

What I meant to say is this:

 

Blood Angels are meant to be played as a powerful assault army right? An army that's arguably the fastest of the Space Marines as well as the hardest hitting CC/Assault troops right? I have sad news for you all. Assaults into GK w/ I6 Halberds and their grenade sheningans is literally like trying to assault a brick wall with a bottle of water. I've had many games vs. GK with my BA and vice versa and I'd say it's one of the dumbest matchups in the game. It's dumb because if anything, GKs are no longer really Daemonhunters and are more Marine-hunters. I6 Force Weapons cuts through Marines much faster than Daemons sadly, because at least Daemons have a damn invul save. It gets even funnier if they have Khorne Collars.

 

I have 3 armies for Marines, BA, SW and GK. GK came first, then SW and last, BA. Out of all those armies, none of them play like they're supposed to, and for that reason, I'm furious. I took it out in the wrong place, in the wrong thread, so I once again, I'm sorry.

 

But in all honesty, if I see another Razorlist, I'll probably pack up my :D until next edition.

 

 

No problem man. Alls good. :)

 

I understand what you mean by them being CC specialists though and not really being as expected. I created a thread a while back talking EXACTLY about that part that you were complaining about. Even before GK's new 'dex to be honest they weren't that optimal in CC. Yes we had awesome unique force multipliers in the form of Sanguinary Priests but with the cost of points it took to start making effective lists with our truly effective and efficient CC units (Assault Terminators) we start carving out a huge hole of points from our lists. We have DC that have downsides via rage but are rocking at CC. However that uncontrollable factor puts a huge dent in consistency if your opponent knows what their doing.

 

Hero, I can keep on going forever on that topic. But that is another topic. I understand what you mean. I had originally stopped playing BA for about a month and a half because I was dissatisfied with them not doing what I expected them to do. And now GK comes out as the "Marine-hunters" as you say.

 

However the difference between us is I really love the BA and playing Mech. It was my primary way I wanted to play them from the get-go anyways. So I can deal with it since our most competitive lists are Mech. After all my testing and playing different version of it I am slowly coming up with units that work well for me and I'm learning how best to deal with specific threats. Makes me love it even more! :P

[Black Memories]

I don't personally have much experience with GKs but I will ask those who have played, since it's in the topic. If Mephiston is THAT effective against GK, how effective would an assault term/deathstar unit be? I generally don't use assault squads as extensively in assaults as I used to and instead rely on more elite assault units to do the job now. How effective is this against GK? I ask because while they have power weapons, if you run against them with assault terminators and the like the odds of you taking them down, despite going second, seems pretty high. The big threat it seems to me would be paladins, which hammernators would be able to smash up (I've done vacuum rolls and they dominate vs paladins).

 

I'm just curious as to how this works out because I feel like the way I play (usually fast heavy mech assault lists) would seem to do fairly well in a vacuum with GKs, but on a table thats a different story. Has anyone tried any of those "deathstar" type combos against them?

[Joasht]

I have a fairly halberd-spammy GK army (30 old metal GKs, its inevitable :)) and as a BA player as well, I must say that I6 power weapon Marines are just going to be nigh-impossible to beat if you plan to simply shove Assault Squads into the woodchipper that is the Halberd Purifier Squad.

 

That said, unfortunately in order to combat the ever-present possibility of facing GKs, the BA army has to be tweaked a little to be able to somehow mitigate that. I haven't quite figured out the best possible solution to it, but I'm thinking high armor saturation (Pred spam? Maybe Furioso spam? Talons make short work of MEQs) for a more shooty and mobile army. GKs aren't the most mobile army out there, and with enough armor on board and some way to rapidly take out their Psyfles you'd force the opponent into a situation where they simply need to rend all the time, which isn't always entirely reliable.

 

Unfortunately that kind of brings us back around to some sort of vehicle spam, but I guess the presence of Predators and/or Dreads means its not truly a Razorspam, because you'd probably only have space for about 3-4 RB squads max. Its a pity, but my usual playstyle with the BA (very assault-orientated) would be utterly creamed by a halberd-heavy GK army, so some adaptation is inevitable.

 

Poor game design? Perhaps.

But in my very humble opinion, none of GW's games were ever designed to be tournament games. If you want fun and variety stick to casual games where everyone just plays what they own. Tournament-level lists WILL result in bland games, there is really no two ways about it.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I'm not a fan of razorspam but it is quite popular. I see it as having some serious problems versus GK psiflemen and psycannons. Stormshields are your friend versus massed force weapons.

 

G :)

[syypher]

I'm not a fan of razorspam but it is quite popular. I see it as having some serious problems versus GK psiflemen and psycannons. Stormshields are your friend versus massed force weapons.

 

G :)

 

I had thought so too, but like my little batrep said it wasn't as bad as I thought. I have to admit though I heavily outplayed my opponent during the movement phase. All my RBs were constantly having a cover save throughout the entire game.

 

After my games with GK I have to say that razorspam should have a little tougher time against them BUT it shouldn't be impossible. The movement phase and positioning is just going to be A LOT more important imo. You have little leeway for mistakes during your movement and the way you position your vehicles. While the GK will have a much easier time.

 

 

I don't personally have much experience with GKs but I will ask those who have played, since it's in the topic. If Mephiston is THAT effective against GK, how effective would an assault term/deathstar unit be? I generally don't use assault squads as extensively in assaults as I used to and instead rely on more elite assault units to do the job now. How effective is this against GK? I ask because while they have power weapons, if you run against them with assault terminators and the like the odds of you taking them down, despite going second, seems pretty high. The big threat it seems to me would be paladins, which hammernators would be able to smash up (I've done vacuum rolls and they dominate vs paladins).

 

I'm just curious as to how this works out because I feel like the way I play (usually fast heavy mech assault lists) would seem to do fairly well in a vacuum with GKs, but on a table thats a different story. Has anyone tried any of those "deathstar" type combos against them?

 

 

A terminator/deathstar army is actually what I had tested out before. I ran 5x Terminators 2x with TH/SS, 1x Sang Priest and 1 Libby with Unleash and Sword. They are definitely a great unit to have and very effective vs the GK but I have to say that the points they soak up in anything under 2000 is not worth it. Mephiston is the cost of their transport (I would recommend a Land Raider when taking a Termy Deathstar).

 

With that said Mephiston is very strong in a Mech list because he offers that counter CC, late game counter punch, scary CC threat that Mech lists generally lack and my favorite is that he can way easily hide behind any vehicle we have (except land speeders...). Tip: Use him defensively first then offensively second. He has a 2+ but any AP1/2 will totally decimate him if hes in the open. Play careful with him and don't rush him into CC. Just keep him jumping up with your forward closer range weaponry vehicles until the time is right.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

GK have lots of powerful counters to Mephiston.

 

G :)

[syypher]

GK have lots of powerful counters to Mephiston.

 

G :)

 

Definitely. Speaking more from a general hes awesome in a Mech list pov ;)

[Isryion]

I have 3 armies for Marines, BA, SW and GK. GK came first, then SW and last, BA. Out of all those armies, none of them play like they're supposed to, and for that reason, I'm furious.

 

Maybe this is off topic, but some food for thought. Why don't these armies, in particular BA, play the way their supposed to? Who defines this? Is it because the tournament circuit says mech is what you have to play to be competitive, or because you find choices in the list that are more efficient than an assault troop? Is it because if they are supposed to assault and win easily against everyone because that's what the fluff says? Fast mech isn't BA? (Not my style either).

 

Why not trying to build and play the army the way you think it is supposed to be played and see if that works? Many of us play DoA type lists and have had success with them, too. Is that the way BA is supposed to be played? I personally have had a ton of fun with my Blood Angels and have never fielded more than one Baal Pred, one rhino or razorback at a tie, and have never played Mephiston. I feel like they're very BA, but then I don't think BA are supposed to be the best assault army in the game (they're still marines). My take is that they're a fast army, but balanced overall with a tendency (not dominant) toward assault.

 

As far as on topic as Grey Knights go, I guess I don't know them well enough to know all their rules, but those halberd units definitely have me worried enough that I'd probably plan on shooting them as much as possible.