Nrthstar Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 With the 'Ard Boys thread up, I gotta say Arjac is absolute must for it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2781875 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kassill Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 Gonna try Arjac out tomorrow for the first time. Running him with PA armored WG in a Crusader. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2781901 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted June 4, 2011 Author Share Posted June 4, 2011 Thanks for all the replies. I think I'll try him out in my 2k list footslogging with wolfguard in terminator armor and see how it works out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2782299 Share on other sites More sharing options...
commander alexander Posted June 4, 2011 Share Posted June 4, 2011 To be honest I dont find wolf guard worth their points that often, and so I don't often take them, and therefor I don't take Arjac. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2782300 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nrthstar Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 To be honest I dont find wolf guard worth their points that often, and so I don't often take them, and therefor I don't take Arjac. I've been playing 1250 and below games so I've been in the same boat. This week will be my third week in a row of 1500 and up so I'm going back to my termies. I have a 25 tdas that have gone unused for too long. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2782330 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kassill Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 To be honest I dont find wolf guard worth their points that often, and so I don't often take them, and therefor I don't take Arjac. I've been playing 1250 and below games so I've been in the same boat. This week will be my third week in a row of 1500 and up so I'm going back to my termies. I have a 25 tdas that have gone unused for too long. Playing a 1500pt game tomorrow with a ten man unit of Wolf Guard that clocks out at 610pts with Arjac, 9 PA'd guys, 2x Frost Axes, 4x Wolf Claws, 2x PF/CM (for GH's) inside a Crusader with a Wolf Priest who's clocking 140 with upgrades. Alotta eggs in one basket but I am so excited to play this! ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2782337 Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxvaderxx Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Arjac + Wolf priest + Wolf banner + Mark of the wulfen = dead enemy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2782367 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillen Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 lol Yup. It does. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2783533 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted June 6, 2011 Author Share Posted June 6, 2011 I was going to try him in a drop pod with 8 grey hunters. I find spearhead objective games to be the biggest weakness of my army and maybe having arjac to drop behind lines would help cause a big enough distraction. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2783870 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levitas Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Arjac + Wolf priest + Wolf banner + Mark of the wulfen = dead enemy. Arjac + Ragnar + Wolf banner = dead vehicle Every days a school day with Arjac. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2783968 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nrthstar Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I can't decide how to deliver the big Guy, I have him in a drop pod with ulrik and grey hunters ring now, but of course then he can only toss the hammer and sit, and I don't want to waste the points on a raider Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2783992 Share on other sites More sharing options...
HERO Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 I can't decide how to deliver the big Guy, I have him in a drop pod with ulrik and grey hunters ring now, but of course then he can only toss the hammer and sit, and I don't want to waste the points on a raider Well, being in TDA, LRs and Drop Pods are your only real option. Personally, I take mine in a 10-man fully kitted out unit of Grey Hunters in a LRC. Wolf Standard with Arjac is just not fair, considering how any 1s gets to be re-rolled on Terminator armor for a round :wallbash: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2784012 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simo429 Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Arjac + Wolf priest + Wolf banner + Mark of the wulfen = dead enemy. But can a unit like that ever make back its points? Generally you will have them in a rhino so like someone else said thats a 600 point army. Because of the amount of dark lances and melta out there land raiders aren't consistent to get there and with the amount of high strength spam we see now can they survive a few turns out in the open. I played a pure paladin army this weekend and eventually with 15 missiles death star units like that fail enough saves that they die and then its difficult to get your synergy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2784099 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Arjac + Wolf priest + Wolf banner + Mark of the wulfen = dead enemy. But can a unit like that ever make back its points? I find that "making back points" is a misnomer. Oftentimes, a unit proves its worth not through the points earned, but through points saved. If an entire enemy army spends a turn firing at Arjac (and the squad he's with), will that save enough points on what his army -could- have fired at to make back Arjac's points? If an enemy Vindicator fires at Arjac's squad as opposed to a full TWC squad about to wreak house, how do you value that? If Arjac soaks enough fire that would have killed a Hunter squad that goes on to carry an objective, was he worth it? In my eyes, a unit's worth isn't about "points earned back" but about "impact on the game." Theoretically, if you play a game and utilize superior mobility, never killing ANYTHING but having the enemy out of place enough to contest or control every objective in the game... Did they not earn back their points in the win? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2784112 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simo429 Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 Arjac + Wolf priest + Wolf banner + Mark of the wulfen = dead enemy. But can a unit like that ever make back its points? I find that "making back points" is a misnomer. Oftentimes, a unit proves its worth not through the points earned, but through points saved. If an entire enemy army spends a turn firing at Arjac (and the squad he's with), will that save enough points on what his army -could- have fired at to make back Arjac's points? If an enemy Vindicator fires at Arjac's squad as opposed to a full TWC squad about to wreak house, how do you value that? If Arjac soaks enough fire that would have killed a Hunter squad that goes on to carry an objective, was he worth it? In my eyes, a unit's worth isn't about "points earned back" but about "impact on the game." Theoretically, if you play a game and utilize superior mobility, never killing ANYTHING but having the enemy out of place enough to contest or control every objective in the game... Did they not earn back their points in the win? And thats a good idea when you have the synergy in your army but when so much of it is taken up in one unit what else can you really have, couple of troops! Thats the problem with deathstar units, there is so much power in shooting in current meta that a unit like that can be wiped out within a couple of turns and then you move on to elsewhere and you have a lot to concentrate on the few units left. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2784123 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Arjac + Wolf priest + Wolf banner + Mark of the wulfen = dead enemy. But can a unit like that ever make back its points? I find that "making back points" is a misnomer. Oftentimes, a unit proves its worth not through the points earned, but through points saved. If an entire enemy army spends a turn firing at Arjac (and the squad he's with), will that save enough points on what his army -could- have fired at to make back Arjac's points? If an enemy Vindicator fires at Arjac's squad as opposed to a full TWC squad about to wreak house, how do you value that? If Arjac soaks enough fire that would have killed a Hunter squad that goes on to carry an objective, was he worth it? In my eyes, a unit's worth isn't about "points earned back" but about "impact on the game." Theoretically, if you play a game and utilize superior mobility, never killing ANYTHING but having the enemy out of place enough to contest or control every objective in the game... Did they not earn back their points in the win? I've always had this this philosophy. "making points back" is a good guide but it should not be the one that rules them all. As Decoy states if the other army spends half their points trying to kill less than a qrtr of your force, that unit did a great job shifting their focus from your other units. Allowing them to get in better position to win. And if the fail to destroy that target when spending so many pts focusing on them, they should be in bigger trouble. Now, if your big unit dies to unit which is half your pts then that big unit placed you in a more dire position to win. Balance is to find the Goldilocks zone of offensive/defensive power in as few as many points as possible. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2784927 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xeenos Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 While ive not actually play tested it, my balanced list so far uses Arjac as my 'wolf lord' basicly with a cheep Rune Priest for the HQ slot. I use Arjac with 10 Grey Hunters, 2 Melta Banner power weapon MotW in a LRR The main idea is that the squad can destroy any monster or HQ type, use the Grey Hunter Banner so Arjac rerolls 1's? str 10 attacks? Ya.. someone is dead. Also gives him 12 wounds, too. Its a bit expensive, but i tried to keep it as cheep as i could, so i didnt add more HQs in there, nor did i use Wolf Guard besides the ones i give to squads. The LRR is my Crowd Control to try and keep the unit from getting bogged down. Untested, but it looks good on paper with the rest of my army supporting, yet not being worthless without, Arjac. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2785846 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hear da Lamentation Posted June 8, 2011 Share Posted June 8, 2011 Looks nice - but that unit meets anything hard with fast initiative and power type weapons (Nids, grey Knights etc) and it will be wiped out (other than Arjac) in the 1st round. At over 600points - that's a major loss. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2785870 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted June 8, 2011 Author Share Posted June 8, 2011 Ya that is one reason I thought about using him as a distraction unit in a drop pod because there are so many high initiative units in the game now that can put a hurt on our I4 guys that I can't see dedicating a land raider to Arjac unless I plan to make use of more than one. Maybe it is just me but I have had terrible luck with 1 land raider from immobilizing it on a piece of terrain to getting blown up in the 1st 2 turns. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2786122 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted June 9, 2011 Author Share Posted June 9, 2011 Well in my 1st go around the unit was a disappointment, but I'll try him in a few more games and see how it works out. I faced GK's and dropped the unit by my opponents objective in a nearby building. The plan was to keep them in cover while adding some support bolter fire until late game to contest the objective. In turn 5 and 6 they had to engage a GK terminator unit for the objective. Shooting had wittled the unti down to Arjac+3 grey slayers. The halbreds killed the slayers at I6 and Arjac took a wound from the Justicar's hammer. Arjac had 5 attacks, wiffed on 3 and my opponent made a 5+ invul on 1. The next round Arjac failed both I6 3++ saves and died to halberds. The unit did a good job in making my opponent divert some of his forces, however, it just couldn't stand up to GK's. I may substitute the melta gun for plasma and see how that works. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2787040 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kassill Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 Well in my 1st go around the unit was a disappointment, but I'll try him in a few more games and see how it works out. I faced GK's and dropped the unit by my opponents objective in a nearby building. The plan was to keep them in cover while adding some support bolter fire until late game to contest the objective. In turn 5 and 6 they had to engage a GK terminator unit for the objective. Shooting had wittled the unti down to Arjac+3 grey slayers. The halbreds killed the slayers at I6 and Arjac took a wound from the Justicar's hammer. Arjac had 5 attacks, wiffed on 3 and my opponent made a 5+ invul on 1. The next round Arjac failed both I6 3++ saves and died to halberds. The unit did a good job in making my opponent divert some of his forces, however, it just couldn't stand up to GK's. I may substitute the melta gun for plasma and see how that works. Just out of curiosity, you were counting in Arjac's Wolf Tooth Necklace werent you? My first ever round of Combat using Arjac I had forgotten about it, and he just may have killed the Nightbringer then too if I had... ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2787276 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodgambit Posted June 9, 2011 Author Share Posted June 9, 2011 I rolled a 1, 2, 2 and then rolled another 2 on standard re-roll, but ya i remembered the necklace ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2787297 Share on other sites More sharing options...
HERO Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 Well in my 1st go around the unit was a disappointment, but I'll try him in a few more games and see how it works out. I faced GK's and dropped the unit by my opponents objective in a nearby building. The plan was to keep them in cover while adding some support bolter fire until late game to contest the objective. In turn 5 and 6 they had to engage a GK terminator unit for the objective. Shooting had wittled the unti down to Arjac+3 grey slayers. The halbreds killed the slayers at I6 and Arjac took a wound from the Justicar's hammer. Arjac had 5 attacks, wiffed on 3 and my opponent made a 5+ invul on 1. The next round Arjac failed both I6 3++ saves and died to halberds. The unit did a good job in making my opponent divert some of his forces, however, it just couldn't stand up to GK's. I may substitute the melta gun for plasma and see how that works. Sorry to hear, but you wiffing badly has nothing to do with whether or not Arjac performs well ;) Bad luck =/= tactical application of the Man-Mountain. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2787303 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WG Vrox Posted June 9, 2011 Share Posted June 9, 2011 Arjac in a LRC MM+EA w/ 10 GH, MotW, Banner, Flamer/Melta, Since the LRC is a fire magnet I have put in a RP with Storm and Temp Wrath. The RP pretty much stays inside the LRC casting storm or wrath and canceling psychic abilities on the front lines. I try to spread out my points in a list and find the unit very effective against most anything without going total Death-Star point wise. I usually combine it with three drop pods and a wolf scout unit, makes for a great shock and awe 2k list. I love when the LRC get focused on by my enemies entire ranged capacity on turn 1 and only comes out with scratches, Vrox Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/231183-anyone-use-arjac-much/page/2/#findComment-2787349 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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