Ash Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Hey, guys. I was thinking about elite lists and decided to look into doing an AV2 spam list, when I found myself wondering what AV2 would protect you from that AV3 doesn't. Obviously you get a better save against anything that can't auto-penetrate the armour, but I was wondering if there were any particularly common weapons that are AP3 you'd bypass nasty wounds on by taking exclusively AV2. Anyone got any info on this? If you wanted to know a troops choice that shoots a lot of AP3 its thousand sons, those chaos guys are bad news for 3 plus armour save marines. Blood Angels don't get too upset by them as they are prime meat for a VV strike. :( 3 plus save vs 2 plus is a good discussion. I guess its worth taking into account when you talk about it how many models you get on the board with 3+ as against 2+ as well. There is also the invun save which is big. With Blood Angels in my current learning mode I lean more towards using Storm Shields as a modifier its 3+ invun on a 3+armour model. Otherwise if you ignore Sang Guard with no invun its terminators at 2+ and 5+ unless you pay for the Storm Shield on top of an already costly model that is less mobile. All round which is better? a termie with a 2+/3+ and a storm shield or a VV or honour guard on a 3+/3+. I lean towards the HG or VV because sweeping advance favours HG and VV and gives maybe 1 or 2 extra models on the table for the same price ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother_Byhlli Posted June 20, 2011 Author Share Posted June 20, 2011 Interesting to think about VV with SS as a mobile alternative to Terminators. I'd never quite made that step before when I was considering options and alternatives. I shall go away and look at my C:BA again a little more closely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindhamster Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I have a unit of Honour Guard that run with Dante consisting of: 2x Honour Guard with Storm Shield and Power Weapon 1x Blood Champion 1x Sanguinary Novitiate 1x Chapter banner bearer with infernus pistol + melta bomb totals to 300 points on the nose (505 with Dante). Which is a fair bit more expensive than a unit of Terminators, but they pack a punch and have a good number of attacks as well as having pretty good survivability. The above unit only sees the light of day in 2000 point games however. in anything smaller I stick with Sang Guard (which a single unit has become a staple of my army for the last 6 or 7 games now). I'm inclined to believe that having an invulnerable save is better than having a 2+ save, as most enemies that can kill models with a 3+, just as easily kill those with a 2+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breng77 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 3 plus save vs 2 plus is a good discussion. I guess its worth taking into account when you talk about it how many models you get on the board with 3+ as against 2+ as well.There is also the invun save which is big. With Blood Angels in my current learning mode I lean more towards using Storm Shields as a modifier its 3+ invun on a 3+armour model. Otherwise if you ignore Sang Guard with no invun its terminators at 2+ and 5+ unless you pay for the Storm Shield on top of an already costly model that is less mobile. All round which is better? a termie with a 2+/3+ and a storm shield or a VV or honour guard on a 3+/3+. I lean towards the HG or VV because sweeping advance favours HG and VV and gives maybe 1 or 2 extra models on the table for the same price ? Except that you don't get better value for VV or HG if you want all storm shields. You can argue that you can get better mobility for a price, you can take SS with weapons other than THs, and you can sweeping advance. But Point for point the termies win out. 5 TH/SS termies = 225 points 5 VV with storm shields (only PW on sarge, and no JPs) = 215 5 VV with JP and SS = 265 5 VV with PW and SS = 275 5 VV all PW, SS, JP = 325 5 HG (only 4 storm shields)= 195 (no power weapons) 5 HG 4 SS 4 PW = 255 5 HG 4 Ss 4 PW, JPs= 305 Not at all as affordable as termies (7 TH/SS termies are 315 points) I'm not saying that the other units don't have a use, but TH/SS termies are either slightly more expensive, (and slightly more durable), but way better offensively, than either other squad. Or more durable and stronger due to more models. The only argument for the other squads is that with JPs they don't need to buy a transport which will run the termies at least 200 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I'm not saying that the other units don't have a use, but TH/SS termies are either slightly more expensive, (and slightly more durable), but way better offensively, than either other squad. Or more durable and stronger due to more models. The only argument for the other squads is that with JPs they don't need to buy a transport which will run the termies at least 200 points. Plus it's another 75 points if you actually want the hammers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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