DoW III

[MagicMan]

I mean you have the four you need right there, Orks/Chaos + Guard/Marines.

 

 

A man can dream.

[Rafen_2]

I hope with the slashes that you're not suggesting a campaign like Winter Assault? ;)

[The_son_of_Dorn]

galactic warefare, 3 different types of battle, fleet, massive force command and 1st/3rd person of your own custom captain, you can be space marines, guard, chaos, orks w.e develop and customise your on chapter/ regiment/ ork clan appoint captains, honour guards and such whilst battle can be simple, you can swith between character control and force control so you can direct your squads etc or leave the ai to do it for you and take to the battle field, be it in various terains such as monutains, snow on a set battle fields (kinda like battle field 2142). titan legions arent playable but you can gain favour with them and hope they lend you one from time to time.

 

or theres the massive kind of mmo (dark millenium online) which is rough around the edges in fluff but allows you to customise your character and just jump into real time events which makes you feel alot more connected with the one character you control.

 

Combat should be fluent and realistic for the forces you use, orks for example basic array of attacks but with heavy weapons where as eldar get a mortal combat style set of combos and devetating weaponry but are very few in number, space marines get obvious armour bonus's and are immune to small arms fire, whilst captain get a halo kind of re charge ability to an addition sheild, swaping between bolter and chainsword (both of which can be togle between 1st and 3rd person kind of view) to let you feel you are face to face with the enemy or so you are able to see enemies comming up behind you so you can vary your attacks, theres infinite possibilites really, just depends on development time and money available.

[MagicMan]

I hope with the slashes that you're not suggesting a campaign like Winter Assault? :yuck:

 

 

 

Hah no, just the two ''teams''.

 

 

That said, if they did cover a well known war, they couldn't exactly have the Space marines able to fight the guard...

 

Cool ideas Dorn, but thats not really a DoW game, you've suggested an entirely different game.

[Brother Nihm]

Is technical stuff allowed?

If so,

 

Better terrain engine and interactivity with the levels + better implementation of the cover system (the current one just doesnt work for me, it is clunky and silly).

Oh and, optimize the code this time around.

 

Better physics engine, aka no more floating/whirling corpses.

Tied to: awful vehicle movement. This needs to be redone imho.

 

A game should not take nearly 10 seconds to close and free up used memory after I've played for more than an hour.

(NB. this has been tested on various high-end systems with consistent results)

[Brother Valerius]

Cool ideas Dorn, but thats not really a DoW game, you've suggested an entirely different game.

 

In fairness, you can say the exact same about DoW to DoW 2. So Dorn's suggestion (while it's not the direction I'd like for the game) isn't unrealistic.

[Rafen_2]

I would like the type of game Dorn was suggesting but it would take a LONG time to finish and plus the battles would be long too which really isn't a bad thing...

 

@Brother Nihm: I agree with everything except the flying corpses. Those things were fun, especially when your teammates don't see it! :P

[Captain Juan Juarez]

DoW III

 

I'd like to see it without the Blood Ravens.

 

I hate to tell you this but that is never going to happen. What would we all do if they decided to use a legit Chapter and they butchered them fluff wise? We would all complain and probably stop playing. At least with the Blood Ravens they're fake and they can have their fun.

 

 

This is the bit where I shrug, right?

 

We have GW-endorsed authors who butcher the background for established Chapters, so doing it for one that was purposefully created for the game shouldn't bother me, yet it does.

 

If you creat something and then go on to ruin it and everything it stands for, at least do it creatively and artfully rather than with utter ineptitude and lack of knowledge.

 

Aside from which, it isn't so hard to come up with a game concept that doesn't "butcher them fluff-wise" for an established Chapter; they got a movie out of two Chapters, as I recall.

[skamp]

A game like the mods Warp Storm Over Auerila(dow retribution) and Fire Storm Over kronus(dark crusade) Purgation of Kauruva (soul storm) all top of the line mods

[Questioner]

About the Armageddon thing...

 

They could introduce a third war for Armageddon.

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

There is a third war for Armageddon. It's when Ghazghull came back. Orks, Guard, and Marines. 23 different chapters, so it should be easy to find one.

[Brother Immolator]

First,nice topic.Now onto to comments.

 

I want dawn 3 to return to its roots.A more RTS like of game.Dawn 2 was good but its replay value was not existant and tacticaly it was a big 0(in single player).

 

As for races,first of all it should be marines and guard.

 

Why?Just think for a minute...How do all kinds of war start in the imperium?Thats right an imperial planet is invaded the guard gets smacked down and space marines intervine.

 

For a third race i would like to see tau.Remember that loading screen in Dawn2?Something about angelos kicking their butts in the targa or something sector?That can be a nice plot hook.Perhaps the tau try to 'annex' more planets in the damocles gulf and the blood ravens go to clean them up and reasert imperial dominion.Plus i liked wacking the midgets with the force commanders hammer in the Dow.

 

And now onto realistic thoughts.We are going to see the SOB and Necrons into the next game.Why?Cause by the time Dawn 3 will be ready SOB and necs will be the new armies in the table top and they would need some promotion.

 

And for coolness sake bring back the chaplain ok?

[Marshal Rohr]

I want something more like Empire Total War. A Strategic Map, Fleets, Guard Battlegroups, Chapter Fleets, Sieges, Open Warfare, Trench Fighting, over a hundred worlds to fight on, with multiple maps.

 

Use a system that blends the unit selection from Endwar with the tactical compnent of Company of Heroes and Blitzkrieg.

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

Yes. That would be incredible. It would make more of a strategic game and less of a chuck unit x at unit y game that's so common in strategy games. And if they could take it one step further and add in things like supply lines, chain of command, and so on, many more peole than just the 40k fans would buy it, and in droves.

[Rafen_2]

Cool ideas and Son_of_Dorn suggested something like that. The only issue I see with it is the amount of power and time needed to play the game. What would, let's say, one match be? Otherwise I agree full heartily.

 

@ Brother Immolator: Thanks man! :D I created this topic since people tend to complain about the DoW games so I wanted to hear what others thought. Plus I'm happy that you suggested some races which I wish others would do also so we get a sort of poll going.

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

The match could be more like a normal DoW game, but the overall strategy would be the important bit. Galactic domination takes a while, and so will this. They could probably build in things like skirmish battles and campaigns with smaller areas.

[Dark Apostle Thirst]

Yes. That would be incredible. It would make more of a strategic game and less of a chuck unit x at unit y game that's so common in strategy games. And if they could take it one step further and add in things like supply lines, chain of command, and so on, many more peole than just the 40k fans would buy it, and in droves.

What, you mean kind of like Sins of a Solar Empire (which is pretty awesome)? Sins gets pretty complex (strategy wise) as it is, if there were more variables than that (which you seem to be suggesting/promoting?) I think it would detract from the strategy as too complex. There's a fine line between too little strategy and too much, and while I prefer too much to too little it's still too much :cuss

 

Also, marine forces in fluff are both much smaller and pretty much point and click, individual forces wise, makin for a slightly worse and unbalanced strategy game. Perhaps being an Guard General, Chapter Master or Lord Inquisitor charged with the protection of a certain area of Imperial space, and the Space Marine chapter is the main tool you can use, while still being big enough to require forces outside of the chapter?

[Chapter Master Ignis Domus]

I've never heard of it, but I'll check it out. I'm thinking something like a Guard General, where you have to request aid from the marines and hope they arrive, with your main force being the Guard regiments and PDF. If you wanted to go really complex, the annual number of regiments raised each year could fluctuate based on pirates, food growth on planet, warfare, etc. Actually, this could probably be infinitely complex.

[A_POINTED_STICK]

Dream Edition: I'd like to keep it reasonably small scaled but really really really fleshed out.

 

10 Factions!!!

 

ORDER - DESTRUCTION (only to balance themes, everyone hates everyone, it's Warhammer not Teahammer. However there will be situation alliances during the respective campaigns. Yes, 10 different campaigns...)

 

Space Marines - Chaos Space Marines

Imperial Guard - Lost and the Damned

Craftworld Eldar - Dark Eldar

Tau Empire - Orks

Necrons - Tyrannids

(Yes, Necrons are Order)

 

I want the RTS put back in the game, but in a more fluid way. For example, Marines wouldn't build a barracks, but they might deploy Planet Strike styled stuff. So there may be a Skyshield landing pad, Bastions, Aegis Defense Lines, Turret Emplacements, Saber Platforms, or even a Fortress of Redemption. Essentially you need to landing pads for landing reinforcement filled aircraft and you would be able to have tech marines and servitors throwing up defensive structures as you await tides of enemies or on the fly to claim objectives as you move ahead to secure territory. CSM would mirror them with some Daemonic advantages of course at a cost.

 

Guard are kind of like marines only they have bigger vehicles to deploy and bigger infrastructure to deploy them. Instead of bringing in a Caestus Assault Ram full of troopers they might land a drop ship full of an entire platoon of squads, or a transporter bringing in a Baneblade chassis or emplacing weapons as heavy as Earthshakers or Manticores. Plus infantry can dig trenches or entrench heavy weapons as light emplacements or place (and clear...) minefields.

 

The Eldar would be less obvious, but warp gates and turrets would exist. Eldar would be able to dance around other factions through well hidden portals. Eldar would be fragile and few in number although their warriors hit hard and fast. Whether it's banshees leaping from the back of a Wave Serpent on a flyby, or scorpions emerging from a portal to carve open the throats of an enemy squad, or surprisingly lithe Wraithguard shaking the earth with the hellish thunder of their warp based hand cannons. Dark Eldar likewise offer Wych cults, kabals, Covens, and all manner of hellish options in a similar framework although generally being even more fast and lightweight.

 

The Tau rely on their massive multipurpose drop ships and drone turret rather than real infrastructure. Orcas can deploy most units and Mantas can basically operate as a base on their own. The Tau don't plan to stay anywhere for long, but they bring a lot with them, be it tanks, battlesuits, or infantry and drones or auxiliaries.

 

The Orks probably build the most infrastructure due to it's ramshackle nature. Grots and their ilk are constantly trying to put barricades between themselves and enemy guns, while their brethren crash roks into the terrain creating instant strongpoints from which to surge forth in a tremendous waaagh! Hordes of boys surge over barricades to chop the hell out of the enemy.

 

Necrons basically just use their monoliths and Pylons, their formidable heavy infantry are a bastion in their own right.

 

Finally Tyrannids actively change the very terrain of the map to make it a weapon. While the first waves will land in spore pods eventually rippers and gaunts will be crawling out of the woodwork and massive living war engines will descend to inspire fear and wreak havoc.

 

Sisters of Battle and Arbites would be available under the Guard bubble and Deathwatch and Grey Knights could appear with other marines as allied units (at least in the campaign modes.)

 

Yeahhh

 

Oh and structures on a given map would be persistent in the campaign, but the enemy would have ways to clear, overwhelm, or even take advantage of existing structures. So leaving massive defenses everywhere on a map might be foolish since the enemy can interact with them and make use of them unless you actively control it. So for example an Aegis defense line is cover for invading orks as surely as it was for the marines who deployed it before, and leaving webway portals everywhere could give the enemy a route into your command center.

 

Did I mention the maps are huge? At least a square kilometer to scale.

[Brother Immolator]

Sorry to brake it to you but thats neither an RTS in the strict form nor i can see it happen.And the reason isnt that the idea is not nice.

It is but in order to flesh it out you need huge work on the balance perspective alone.Also whats the point of throwing in all the new races at once?What will they do in the expansions?

 

Plus if they do it that way the campaign mode will be 10 missions of totaly scripted events and each mission will be 15 minutes.Just as in dawn 2 series.Nothing for replay value.

[Dark Apostle Thirst]

I've never heard of it, but I'll check it out. I'm thinking something like a Guard General, where you have to request aid from the marines and hope they arrive, with your main force being the Guard regiments and PDF. If you wanted to go really complex, the annual number of regiments raised each year could fluctuate based on pirates, food growth on planet, warfare, etc. Actually, this could probably be infinitely complex.

Here's where we don't see eye to eye, I think. RTSs should never, ever, ever let factors outside of the player's control affect the things the player has to do (the opposing factions don't count). Things like food growth and pirate raids should be roughly controllable, and if things get that complex, they would probably be better of tieing in with supply lines, no? :cuss

 

Again, Sins has an excellent example of this with pirate raids. The pirates were a random (and very annoying) force, but the player could still roughly control it. A 40k and DoW take on it would probably be more like increasing the number of Arbites on your planets and being able to set a Guard regiment and elements of your Naval force on 'Pirate Hunting' stance, keeping planets within X range safe from pirates.

[The_son_of_Dorn]

Cool ideas and Son_of_Dorn suggested something like that. The only issue I see with it is the amount of power and time needed to play the game. What would, let's say, one match be? Otherwise I agree full heartily.

 

@ Brother Immolator: Thanks man! :cuss I created this topic since people tend to complain about the DoW games so I wanted to hear what others thought. Plus I'm happy that you suggested some races which I wish others would do also so we get a sort of poll going.

 

 

doesnt really have to be too mental, immagine a rome total war kind of game with armies and forces etc, and space is the ocean in which you can make transport ships and etc, you make an army (say 2000 point limmit perside so the armies you can make and sustain vary including which foces face of) and when battle starts its in some contained map like setting in which you lead your commander unit who can respawn, in which case you just fight and kill until both of your forces are depleted or unless you call for a tactical withdrawl, this would be rts meets dow.) then you have bases and realms in space in which you can make alliances with other regiments space marine chapters or w.e or even go from loyalist to renegade, then complete repentance quests to make up for it to retain loyalty etc (your usual 40k motifs and twists), and if you kept graphics down and gameplay simple it really wouldnt take too long to develop, but I wouldnt expect it to make for a best seller, just a hidden gem kinda game, unless you got to kept buying expansions.

[Perrin]

I want it to be more like Warcraft 3, espeically the Hero leveling system, but also to keep its own DoW style. Space Wolves would be so much fun to play as but can't see how it would fit into the game. Multiple faction campaigns like WC3 would be nice, but also to keep the squad units. More researchable upgrades would be nice, and chaos marines should have upgrades for each chaos god that change their appearance and behaviour if they are cpu.

Hopefully not much like Dark Crusade, there was a complete lack of storyline and it got boring after a while, R:TW gets boring eventually as well. Warhammer:Battlemarch for the xbox360 has got a really good system actually, a battle map that you move around, squadunits that lvl up, heros that lvl up, and upgrades can be bought for units outside of battle. + Its got 3 different campaigns with 6 controllable factions.

[MagicMan]

Gotta admit i never got bored of RTW. :|

 

 

 

I still go back and play it (with mods) after i get bored of whatever new game ive bought.

[Valtonis]

2. Gamestyle

If anyone ever played the Warhammer games something similar to that. For those that didn't it is tabletop based. Before each battle you choose what squads to bring in with you so ex. 2 generals, 5 troops, 3 fast, and 2 heavy. Each squad/hero gets exp which can be used to upgrade things like weapons, armor, and abilities. For actual battles just watch the Warhammer fighting style:

 

4. Important Things to Add-on

1. For Space Marines have option to choose what Chapter play style. So when you set up your army choose maybe Blood Angels to receive Death Company and Sanguinary Guard. Or maybe Black Templars for Sword Brethren and the Emperor's Champion. Ultramarines would be for the normal set.
   
2. Do the same thing for Chaos except with gods (all 4, stop being lazy Relic) or Undivided.
   
3. For Tau let the leaders be able to choose out of a bunch of armours. Also add more xenos that turned to the Greater Good. We all like Kroot but we need more Vespid and maybe some Guardsmen who turned.
   

 

 

2. Not ever gonna happen, GW would never allow Relic to make a game that is so similar to TT as has been mention lots of times before since DoW1

 

4. Not ever gonna happen, because that would make every single Chapter basically a new race.

4 gods + undivided = 5 races, not just one race

SM - Black Templar, Space Wolves, blood angels, codex chapter would already make it 4 different races

the balance issues would be a nightmare

 

I want them to return to the gameplay of DoW. That game was the perfect RTS in my eyes, and not only was DoW 2 a major departure (which is a big enough sin, as I feel that sequels should bear more than a passing resemblance to the prior games), the gameplay was just... bad compared to DoW 1. Resource management, base building, and large-scale tactics (as opposed to micromanaging a team of 4 guys) are the bread and butter of a good RTS. DoW 2 has none of those things. They just need to forget it like the mistake it was, and give us a worthy game again.

 

Relic, I know you can do it. You did it before. Don't let me down here.

 

 

DoW1 was a spam fest and apparently that is what you like so go back to DoW1 or SC2.

the best thing about DoW2 was NO base building, go play some other RTS if you want an out dated system that just slows down gameplay and encourage turtling

 

DoW1/SC2 is like using a dial-up as compared to the Broadband of DoW2.

i can never go back to the crappy style of old school RTS after DoW2

 

they should continue to evolve the RTS genre instead of being like Blizzard and just add some shinies and call it a sequel.