Foot slogging army Questions

[For the Horde]

Hi all,

 

i am new to the forums here and was wondering if you could help me with your advice and knowledge of playing SW!! I am thinking of doing a foot slogging army of 1750pts for tournaments in the area.

 

Questions are:

 

do you think they are viable?

Do you think they can last the game?

What would you put in them??

 

Any advice would be great. Would like to try something new as the good old mech lists are getting a bit dry

 

FTH

[muadib02]

I do not own a single space wolf vehicle and my army does quite well.

The key us Long Fangs, Grey Hunters, Wolf Scouts or Dreadnoughts, and Rune/Wolf Priets

[Simo429]

As I said in another thread, there are a reason why no one is running them and getting to the top tables at tournaments.

 

This isn't an accident its because they aren't good enough.

 

They are probably very fun to play with but they aren't going to be consistent.

[Forté]

From what I can see, its all about supporting the footsloggers with fast units like swiftclaws and speeders.

[Grey Mage]

As I said in another thread, there are a reason why no one is running them and getting to the top tables at tournaments.

 

This isn't an accident its because they aren't good enough.

 

They are probably very fun to play with but they aren't going to be consistent.

Top tournaments are a horrible gauge for the game- theyre largely stagnant in list design and horribly meta'd. Not only that, but a cavalry list is going to be largely footslogging and those do in fact show up in the top lists this last year or so.

 

That being said, the key to running a good footslogging list is knowing how to counter its weaknesses:

 

Slow Speed.

Vulnerability to LR firepower.

 

On the speed issue-

-Wolf scouts OBEL can be used to help funnel your opponent towards the center of the board, wherein you can more easily come to grips with them.

-Swiftclaws make a good mobile reserve for their points, and are a great place to put your HQ in. This gives you more tactical options and and helps keep your opponent from outrunning you.

-Thunderwolf Cavalry are rock solid assault troops that can get where they are going in a hurry. While their standard move isnt any different than infantry that 24" assault range gives you alot of presence on the field.

-Fenrisian Wolves are great, theyre cheap, they can tie up enemy units, and they can be fielded in larger numbers.

-Landspeeders. Not only are these guys fast, but they pack good heavy weapons- the typhoon is a personal favorite for its versatility and power.

 

On firepower-

You need to have long range threats or your opponent will simply castle up and pound you as you run towards him. So what does this mean?

-Long Fangs. Everyone loves them this time around, and with good reason- theres no reason not to have these guys watching over your horde of greys and claws. Missile Launchers, lascannons, good LR anti-tank is usually best here.

-Dreadnaughts. Dreadnaughts can be hit or miss. On one hand theyre a great HW platform, and not slouches in assault. On the other hand they die to easily to monstrous creatures and massed anti-tank. I tend to always run a venerable, or two, with extra armor in footslogging lists, just to soak up the shots.

-Landspeeders. Get those weapons where you need them... now. Typhoons are good for missile shots to pop enemy transports early game, and to hunt down artillery peices and fast units like raiders.

 

So... what can we do here?

 

Well first off, target priority is important as always. First thing you need to do is protect yourself by removing any pie plates thatll be coming your way using your long range anti-tank. Shaken/stunned is as good as dead in the early game, so once it cant shoot move on.

Transports are priority 2. If your opponent has to get out and walk the playing field just got leveled. Alot of transports only have a 10 or 11, so quantity of fire is often better than quality. Make sure you know what units are where, and pop the transports on assault units and overwhelming firepower units *like dominions* first.

Set up mid field control. Your Grey Hunters should be taking cover in the mid are of the board, close enough to support each other as needed. If there is no midfield cover anywhere... well your table sucks, and often castling a bit can be more advantageous. Set up shop and take shots at your hopefully now footslogging opponents. If they refuse to advance at you then keep pounding them with the big guns while you continue to set up your GH emplacements and set up cavalry charges *if applicable*.

Then clean up broken units. Even taking an enemy down four or five models via shooting can make a huge difference when it comes time to assault them, or counter-attack as the case warrants.

 

Some other notes:

 

Tempests Wrath is awesome, if only for the fact that it hurts enemy mobility. I love this power.

Stormcaller is also awesome, because a 5++ helps when you dont quite get to cover.

Taking TDA WG leaders for your GHs can help lower your casaulties- just make sure to keep him cheap! Able to ignore those AP 3 wounds that have been popping up alot lately is helpful, and if nothing else hes twice as likely to survive torrenting fire. Best part- you dont need to pick between leaders and 2nd special weapons this way.

Keep it lean. Dont spend your extra points on toys, spend them on bodies and cheap support units. Less per unit means more for the army.

[Simo429]

As I said in another thread, there are a reason why no one is running them and getting to the top tables at tournaments.

 

This isn't an accident its because they aren't good enough.

 

They are probably very fun to play with but they aren't going to be consistent.

Top tournaments are a horrible gauge for the game- theyre largely stagnant in list design and horribly meta'd. Not only that, but a cavalry list is going to be largely footslogging and those do in fact show up in the top lists this last year or so.

 

That being said, the key to running a good footslogging list is knowing how to counter its weaknesses:

 

Slow Speed.

Vulnerability to LR firepower.

 

On the speed issue-

-Wolf scouts OBEL can be used to help funnel your opponent towards the center of the board, wherein you can more easily come to grips with them.

-Swiftclaws make a good mobile reserve for their points, and are a great place to put your HQ in. This gives you more tactical options and and helps keep your opponent from outrunning you.

-Thunderwolf Cavalry are rock solid assault troops that can get where they are going in a hurry. While their standard move isnt any different than infantry that 24" assault range gives you alot of presence on the field.

-Fenrisian Wolves are great, theyre cheap, they can tie up enemy units, and they can be fielded in larger numbers.

-Landspeeders. Not only are these guys fast, but they pack good heavy weapons- the typhoon is a personal favorite for its versatility and power.

 

On firepower-

You need to have long range threats or your opponent will simply castle up and pound you as you run towards him. So what does this mean?

-Long Fangs. Everyone loves them this time around, and with good reason- theres no reason not to have these guys watching over your horde of greys and claws. Missile Launchers, lascannons, good LR anti-tank is usually best here.

-Dreadnaughts. Dreadnaughts can be hit or miss. On one hand theyre a great HW platform, and not slouches in assault. On the other hand they die to easily to monstrous creatures and massed anti-tank. I tend to always run a venerable, or two, with extra armor in footslogging lists, just to soak up the shots.

-Landspeeders. Get those weapons where you need them... now. Typhoons are good for missile shots to pop enemy transports early game, and to hunt down artillery peices and fast units like raiders.

 

So... what can we do here?

 

Well first off, target priority is important as always. First thing you need to do is protect yourself by removing any pie plates thatll be coming your way using your long range anti-tank. Shaken/stunned is as good as dead in the early game, so once it cant shoot move on.

Transports are priority 2. If your opponent has to get out and walk the playing field just got leveled. Alot of transports only have a 10 or 11, so quantity of fire is often better than quality. Make sure you know what units are where, and pop the transports on assault units and overwhelming firepower units *like dominions* first.

Set up mid field control. Your Grey Hunters should be taking cover in the mid are of the board, close enough to support each other as needed. If there is no midfield cover anywhere... well your table sucks, and often castling a bit can be more advantageous. Set up shop and take shots at your hopefully now footslogging opponents. If they refuse to advance at you then keep pounding them with the big guns while you continue to set up your GH emplacements and set up cavalry charges *if applicable*.

Then clean up broken units. Even taking an enemy down four or five models via shooting can make a huge difference when it comes time to assault them, or counter-attack as the case warrants.

 

Some other notes:

 

Tempests Wrath is awesome, if only for the fact that it hurts enemy mobility. I love this power.

Stormcaller is also awesome, because a 5++ helps when you dont quite get to cover.

Taking TDA WG leaders for your GHs can help lower your casaulties- just make sure to keep him cheap! Able to ignore those AP 3 wounds that have been popping up alot lately is helpful, and if nothing else hes twice as likely to survive torrenting fire. Best part- you dont need to pick between leaders and 2nd special weapons this way.

Keep it lean. Dont spend your extra points on toys, spend them on bodies and cheap support units. Less per unit means more for the army.

 

The lad asked specifically about tournaments,

 

If you want to do well at a tournament you have to ask yourself why others aren't running that sort of list.

 

For over a year I ran a tournament list with a thunderlord and 4 thunderwolves in which was ~ 550 point unit and I came middle table every time, I then had to look at what I wanted from tournaments, whether I wanted to play with a fun hard hitting unit or play with a slightly less fun list and look to win more games.

 

The meta is there because its currently winning games, if people find ways around it then the meta will change and continue to evolve, the space wolf codex has been out for coming up to two years I believe and people are still basing their lists around rune priests, grey hunters in rhinos and long fangs because it works.

[Grey Mage]

Everyones entitled to their opinion, but Ive seen this work, and take top 3 at a 20 strong tournament.

 

Theres alot of things people dont run that can be worked, and theres a number of things that people do run that dont work in my area- but do elsewhere because of the kinds of lists people use in general.

 

Like razorspam. Razorspam is the most overrated list option out there and around here it doesnt hold up- but apparently its working for someone because the lists keep popping up.

[Simo429]

Everyones entitled to their opinion, but Ive seen this work, and take top 3 at a 20 strong tournament.

 

Theres alot of things people dont run that can be worked, and theres a number of things that people do run that dont work in my area- but do elsewhere because of the kinds of lists people use in general.

 

Like razorspam. Razorspam is the most overrated list option out there and around here it doesnt hold up- but apparently its working for someone because the lists keep popping up.

Razorspam works at certain points levels.

 

I can understand why people talk about it for Ardboyz because of the amount of lasplas you can put down.

 

One tournament does not make a trend, every tournament I have been to since wolves have come out as seen them do well with vehicles because a wolf army wins by controlling the midfield and if you can't get into the midfield you can't control it.

[Forté]

The problem with tournament play is that people go to win. Using the most powerful list with the most powerful army they can find.

 

Personally, take something that isn't a meta list and you may find that they don't know what to do against it because they've not thought about using it.

 

I hate meta gaming myself and rather see a fluffy army which looks good and players having fun. Laughing at there own mistakes and not being rules/ loop hole lawers.

 

And thanks for the ideas Grey Mage on the support side of foot slogging.

[commander alexander]

All I can say is it will be difficult, but viable. Your army will be of course much slower now, and getting to objectives, and getting into range will take more time. Because it will take more time, and you do not have the protection of a vehicle, making use of cover and staying out of LOS is critical. DO NOT FORGET TO RUN when shooting isn't possible, or wouldnt do any good. If you at all possibly could, take a unit of skyclaws, or swift claws and a wolf priest. The use of cover and LOS is still critical with those units, but they will give you some much needed speed, and distraction for your troops to move forward. In this instance of pure footslogging, I woud also recomend a full unit or two of blood claws for troops. Due to lone fact of having more numbers than grey hunters, they are more likely to survive if cover is scarce. Attaching rune priests with whichever of the powers it is (I can't remember off the top of my head) to get cover saves.

 

 

*Deep, gasping breath*

 

Ok I think I'm done.... For now at least :tu:

[Voracioustigger]

See, I think all the other posters are just flat out wrong...

 

A footslogging army is perfectly viable IN THEORY. In my experience, the tournament troubles they have is that it takes a LOT longer to move 40 Grey hunters than 4 rhinos... Especially when you often move them twice a turn (move, then run). When you're only given 2 hours to play an 1850pt game, you will find it VERY difficult to play a complete game and THAT is why footslogging armies have such a huge problem. By footslogging, you get a few more bodies to do damage later in the game, but generally, they do less damage early on. By having time called in turn 3 or 4, you're just in bad shape. The best you can hope for is a draw in C&C, or maybe get REALLY lucky in Objectives or KPs.

 

Also, you can basically forfeit right off the bat if you're deploying 2nd in a DoW mission. Even just charging every model forward 3 turns will only get you 30" or so (if you're lucky!) and they'll take 3 turns of fire during that time.

 

So, IMHO, If you have 2.5-3 hours for each game, and there's no chance of a bar mission set-up like DoW, then I think footsloggers can be viable. There's so much Anti-tank spam now, that when the best the enemy can do is shoot a lascannon at a 15pt model with a 4+ cover save, you should be able to walk across the battlefield pretty safely.

[Kami]

I think they are viable.

Have you considered taking Logan in your foot list? He boosts your long fangs with tank hunters or relentless, lets you take more scouts, lone wolves and of course more wolf guards to give some terminator armour and cyclones. Combiplasmas fit well on those. You should have a good long range firepower by then. A weakness is lack of 12-24" range. But honestly I'm not good with boltguns anyway- guess thats because I'm still a Blood Claw.

Once big pie plates are no longer a threat, keep the army close together for Logan's Living Legend ability. The amount of attacks is now 5 if your running power armoured wolf guards.

So far I had only success with it.

Hope it helps, brother!

[Simo429]

The problem with tournament play is that people go to win. Using the most powerful list with the most powerful army they can find.

 

Personally, take something that isn't a meta list and you may find that they don't know what to do against it because they've not thought about using it.

 

I hate meta gaming myself and rather see a fluffy army which looks good and players having fun. Laughing at there own mistakes and not being rules/ loop hole lawers.

 

And thanks for the ideas Grey Mage on the support side of foot slogging.

Tournament play does't mean that that doesn't happen.

 

The internet is full of stories of that guy but how many times do you speak to people who meet him? The UK tournament scene is a friendly place where there are great looking armies and a lot of great looking armies.

[ilnar]

This. While h

There's always "that guys" at tourneys. Most aren't to bad at the moment, the carnage and GT's at WW were mostly full of good guys with decent lists, and stupidly young children who shouldn't have been there.

[Grey Mage]

Everyones entitled to their opinion, but Ive seen this work, and take top 3 at a 20 strong tournament.

 

Theres alot of things people dont run that can be worked, and theres a number of things that people do run that dont work in my area- but do elsewhere because of the kinds of lists people use in general.

 

Like razorspam. Razorspam is the most overrated list option out there and around here it doesnt hold up- but apparently its working for someone because the lists keep popping up.

Razorspam works at certain points levels.

 

I can understand why people talk about it for Ardboyz because of the amount of lasplas you can put down.

 

One tournament does not make a trend, every tournament I have been to since wolves have come out as seen them do well with vehicles because a wolf army wins by controlling the midfield and if you can't get into the midfield you can't control it.

I wonder how people moved around the 6x4 before run, or rhinos.... seemed to fight still.

 

An infantry unit moves 6+d6, only about 2" less than a rhino per turn on average. You lose out on one turn of mobility over the course of a game. Its really not as huge a liability as people make it out to be- if your supported by truely fast units in the army.

[Simo429]

Everyones entitled to their opinion, but Ive seen this work, and take top 3 at a 20 strong tournament.

 

Theres alot of things people dont run that can be worked, and theres a number of things that people do run that dont work in my area- but do elsewhere because of the kinds of lists people use in general.

 

Like razorspam. Razorspam is the most overrated list option out there and around here it doesnt hold up- but apparently its working for someone because the lists keep popping up.

Razorspam works at certain points levels.

 

I can understand why people talk about it for Ardboyz because of the amount of lasplas you can put down.

 

One tournament does not make a trend, every tournament I have been to since wolves have come out as seen them do well with vehicles because a wolf army wins by controlling the midfield and if you can't get into the midfield you can't control it.

I wonder how people moved around the 6x4 before run, or rhinos.... seemed to fight still.

 

An infantry unit moves 6+d6, only about 2" less than a rhino per turn on average. You lose out on one turn of mobility over the course of a game. Its really not as huge a liability as people make it out to be- if your supported by truely fast units in the army.

How many good truly fast options do wolves have?

 

I don't rate sky claws, thunder wolves are situational and die too easily to torrents of fire even with wound allocation and while speeders are good they are also fragile.

[For the Horde]

mmm some good points all round

 

i was considering thunderwolves (x3) with the lord with a wolf mount as well

probably 5 squads of grey hunters and 2 squads of long fangs and a rune priest, wolf scouts, wolf guard and a lone wolf terminator.

 

i have seen some SW lists which are just purely foot slogging do well, but like you guys say everyone takes mech lists. the tournament scene in my area is usually BA, IG, SM, SW and the odd ork, eldar, demons and GK.

 

the majority of those lists are mech, vary rare that they are foot slogging.

 

i think i may drop the thunderwolves, as in the games that i have played they are dead by turn 2!! so much gets shot at them. may swap them for a squad of termies wolf guard in a drop pod!!! see how that goes.

[Valerian]

Every now and then another thread will pop up with a footslogging discussion; I'll continue to quote myself:

 

You can do "footslogging" and be successful, but you'll still need mobility. A lot of the game is about getting where you need to go. 2 of 3 standard Missions require you to get your units to Objectives to control them, while the final mission still requires you to get into position to destroy enemy units for Kill Points.

 

Mobility comes in two forms: Operational Mobility (getting to the battlefield), and Tactical Mobility (moving around on the battlefield). With Behind Enemy Lines, our Wolf Scouts have excellent Operational Mobility, and can arrive usually right where you want them on any board edge; but once the arrive they only have average Tactical Mobility. Drop Pod deployed units are similar with good OM, but average TM. It's a good idea to have one or more of these units in your footslogging lists.

 

Swift Claws, And Thunderwolf Cavalry have average OM (nothing special), but have great TM (especially Swift Claws with ability to Turbo-boost.

 

Sky Claws and Land Speeders have excellent TM, and with ability to Deep Strike, can have improved OM, as well.

 

You will need several units with good mobility to perform the tasks that your otherwise footslogging infantry will not be able to do for you. You won't be able to walk Grey Hunters all across the board to control enemy objectives or assault enemy support units. However, your units with good mobility can take care of those tasks (at peat contesting objectives for you), while your Grey Hunters, Wolf Guard, and others work on preventing the enemy from achieving his goals.

 

Many folks go "pure" and try to footslog every unit, Drop Pod every unit, or go mechanized and put every unit in a rhino or razorback. I go hybrid, with a little of each, in an attempt to get the exact capability that I think I need for each unit. My "typical" list consists of one unit in a Land Raider, three in Pods, one on Bikes, two coming in Behind Enemy Lines, and the rest just walking. Works well for me.

 

Valerian

[ilnar]

You should also follow the imperial guard tank Rules, one is bad, two is good, three is better. Make sure youre enemy has to engage multiple threats at once

[maverik_girl]

I don't rate sky claws

why not?

 

one is bad, two is good, three is better. Make sure youre enemy has to engage multiple threats at once

still never good enough for some people.... *simo*cough*cough* :)

[Vantius]

I just tested these two armies. The 2000 point was against C:SM, and the 1500 was against Tyranids. I won both games, and did quite well. I am definitely going to tweak these lists a bit, but I liked them. They were very fun to play. The reason I wanted to try a foot slogging army was because I have no vehicles, but enough models to make lots of foot-lists. The nice thing about these lists is that I have over 50 wolves in each army. This will be difficult for a lot of armies to deal with.

 

ANd just for the record, I never want to leave the house without a full pack of Blood Claws and a Wolf Priest! They were so much fun to play with, I may even consider play with nothing but them for a few fun-games.

 

Whatever you decided, just remember to have fun and enjoy the lists you put on the table.

 

2000

HQ

Njal Stormcaller

TDA

270

Rune Priest

Living Lightning, Tempest Wrath

100

Wolf Priest

Saga of the Hunter

110

ELITES

10 Wolf Guard

-6 TDA: 90

-1 WC/SS 20

-1 WC/AC 35

-1 PF/CbP 15

-1 HF/WC 10

-1 CF/SS 30

-1 PW/CbP 5

-4 PA:

-3 CbM/PF 75

-1 CbP/PF 25

485

5 Wolf Scouts

Meltagun

85

TROOPS

2x 10 Grey Hunter

-2x Meltaguns

-MotW

-Standard

180

10 Grey Hunters

-2x Plasma guns

-MotW

-Standard

185

15 Blood Claws

-1x Meltagun

-1x Flamer

-Powerfist

250

HEAVY SUPPORT

6 Long Fangs

-5 Missile Launchers

155

-

1500

HQ

Rune Priest

Storm Caller, Jaws

Jump Pack

125

Rune Priest

Living Lightning, Jaws

Chooser

110

Wolf Priest

Saga of the Hunter

110

ELITES

5 Wolf Guard

-1 TDA/AC/CF: 60

-4 PA:

-1 CbM/PF 25

-1 CbP/PF 25

-1 CbM/PF 30

-1 BP/CCW

225

1 Lone Wolf

TDA

CF/SS

85

5 Wolf Scouts

Meltagun

85

TROOPS

10 Grey Hunter

-2x Meltaguns

-MotW

-Standard

180

10 Grey Hunters

-2x Plasma guns

-MotW

-Standard

185

15 Blood Claws

-1x Meltagun

-1x Flamer

-Powerfist

250

HEAVY SUPPORT

6 Long Fangs

-5 Missile Launchers

145

[elithren]

Just because I hate people not liking them, I'm on the side that they are viable, just need firepower support. Just this last Saturday, we won our doubles tournament with a mainly footslogging force. People charged at us and we just had to hang back a bit for the missiles to soften them up.

[Theis]

Wandered over here from having read Simo's blog post, and, in all fairness, he makes some good points. I know he's UK based, and he may well be one of the few people over there that has played a large number of games with large numbers of twolves. Knowing some of my brit buddies the way I do, I believe he's probably wrong, but they don't participate in the tournament scene at all. So, I'm sure he's making accurate statements from his experience.

 

Here in the states, I can name three players in my local environment, other than myself, who have enough to field two max sized squads, associated hqs and iron priests. I've played and fought pure beasts, hybridized mech and beasts, and everything in between. My local environment borders on insanely competitive, even during the Saturday pick up games at the flgs, as there's often folks practicing for their next tournament. Though most of the travelers, those that go to every local tournament within driving distance, are moving away from space wolves entirely, grey knights are definitely the flavor of the moment there. Caveat, these are also some of nicest guys I've ever met, competitive does not mean being an ass.

 

As an aside, it is my opinion that you don't see many twolf lists out there in part due to the expense, and in part to there being no official model for them yet, which in turn opens you up to the tournament organizer requiring x percentage of gw bits per model, and disallowing your third party twolves.

 

I've also played and fought pretty much every variation of space wolf build that has appeared in competitive circles. Simo is not wrong in that if we just look at space wolf lists, hybridized or razor spam wolf lists are dominating right now. They are, by far, easier to do decently with than footslogging lists. Consistency wins tournaments. Known units, ones you are familiar with, performing in a well established fashion, generally giving the same performance time after time will get you great results over the long run.

 

Fifth edition 40k makes metal boxes pretty nice on a multitude of levels, the extra mobility is a huge boon in the tournament environment, the contents of those same metal boxes become much more survivable, particularly given the sparsity of terrain that is all too common in the tournament scene, though that's been getting better over the last couple of years.

 

Mech lists are also much more scalable at various points levels. My foot slogging lists don't do as well at 1500 points as they do at 2k or 2.5k. There's just not enough room to bring all the tools required at lower points levels.

 

To say footslogging is not viable at a competitive level though is probably overstating the point. It does demand a certain degree of familiarity and a more deliberate, less reactive play style. There is less room for error. Shooting becomes even more emphasized, and one must be able to plan where you're going to be in five turns, and how you're going to get there. Worst case you've only got 30" of guaranteed movement during the game. If it's like most tournaments, that may be even shorter as your full five turns isn't a sure thing by any extent of the imagination.

 

This in turn will create some tactical dilemmas, count on it. Personally, when running foot lists I loathe table quarters missions. In case you're not familiar with this, many tournaments run scenarios that are not the ones from the 40k rule book. Table quarters missions means an objective in each table quarter, or "controlling" a table quarter is in some way essential.

 

So, in summary, footslogging takes a few tools out of the purely competitive player's tool box. Less mobility, less survivability (debatably, but sparse terrain happens), more random performance based on run rolls and the like and thus less consistency, are all things tournament players try to avoid.

 

If you're committed to building as competitive foot list as is possible, I think the buffs Logan brings to a list are irreplaceable. Relentless longfangs when you need them are priceless. You get to play games with mixed power armor and terminator armor, you've room for more wolf guard battle leaders, for what he brings to the table he's probably under costed a bit. Wolf scouts are also critical. You want the opponent concerned about where they'll be showing up at. I run mine with an attached wgbl with wolf claw and combi-melta. Rune priests with living lightning are fun too. I run two of them.

 

At 2k, In my optimized, most cut throat list, with average rolls for the living lightning shots, my wolf guard list has 27 shots with a range of 48" or greater all at least str 7. The vast majority of which are str 8 or greater and ap3 or better. From those shots, up to 11 different targets can be engaged. At 2.5 I bring twolves along to address some of my mobility issues.

 

That said, if I were to build the most competitive lists I could they'd look more like these;

http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2011/06/ard-bo...e-space-wolves/

http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2011/02/space-...for-ard-boyz-2/

 

On the second link, scroll through the first list and get to the second one the blog owner creates. Stelek has an interesting take on 40k, and while not one of his devotees, his input on making things competitive as possible is invaluable. The first article is mech, the second article is mech and twolves. If you search through the site you will find a huge number of lists for every army, space wolves in particular, go to categories -> space wolves and start reading.

[maverik_girl]

I feel special, maybe I should hide behind a blog and write about people who have prejudices against a mainly foot slogging list. Ignoring the fact that maybe....just maybe, I play against the opponent. Playing on their over-confidence, and against an inexperienced WOMAN, at that. Enough for them to make a mistake, any at that, for me to capitalize on. Yes, I know about threat ranges and threat projection. But I don't sit and wait for my opponent to move towards me for the entire game! that's dull. Nor do I have my heavies at the farthest edge of the table closest to me, some of them are at the edge of my deployment, closest towards my opponent at the start of each game. I play my wolves in the mid-field... playing my wolves to their strengths. I play my wolves both defensive and offensively. And no my opponents don't always get distracted by long range fire power, they don't always leave my troops free to run around, who would? and why would simo all of a sudden assume that was always the case? some of my Grey Hunters get shot up, most of them are inside rhinos, or behind one. But while that's all happening, at least one of the Grey Hunter packs get where I want them to be.

[Grey Mage]

Theis, I was enjoying your post.

 

And then you brought up YTTH. I cant abide stelek, the mans a tool.

 

I am suprised however at your comment on sparse terrain. Ive rarely been force to play in such situations at a gaming store and even less frequently at friendly clubs. So do tell me what you mean by sparse.

 

I find that the suggested 25% is enough to make footslogging viable, and that it actually starts getting to be painful for footslogging lists if the terrain covers more than half the board as it starts cutting heavily into mobility without increasing the availability of cover saves.

 

In fact, in the 15-25% range I find mech armies have a horrible time getting cover to their vehicles, wich in turn makes them vulnerable and quite often dead quickly. Your average rhino on a 15% field wont make it past the 2nd round of shooting.