Vantius Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I have noticed some recent talk of using Jump Packs on different HQ choices for different reasons. I recently play a match where my rune priest had a JP, and I rather liked it. He was attached to a Blood Claw pack, along with a Wolf Priest. I liked that I could move him around to get the proper line of sight, and get him into position for One on One close combat. I realized afterwards, that I should have had him behind the Claws, unattached. He had been killed in close combat, which wasnt a huge game breaker for me, but I wanted to be able to jump him around and have some fun with Jaws. I dont think that having a JP on a Wolf Priest would make sense, if you are placing him with a pack of Claws. I dont see very many scenarios where he would be leaving the pack for any other reason other than that the pack is dispatched. Now placing him with Grey Hunters, as Mavgirl posted, can be quite awesome. So what do my fellow wolves think about the Jump Pack madness? Are any of you out there thinking of fielding them? If you already are, what are your tactics for using them? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Guard Nostromo Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I have several jump pack HQs and have had success (and failure I'm afraid) with all of them. In short they are: Wolf lord - TH, SS - Excellent to spereate from a unit at a key moment and charge in on his on his own, particularly if you can afford runic armour and a saga for him too. Pricey though, really pricey. Wolf Priest - Still a staple with 10 skyclaws - an excellent counter attack unit and pretty cheap points wise. Can also bounce around to provide the re-rolls where needed, which is handy. Again, runic armour Rune Priest - For jaws abuse, yeah it works, but otherwise not as effective as I had hoped. Now gathering dust... For me, you do well to look past the wolf priest, but then I think that about wolf priests as HQs more generally too. I have read several comments and posts about 'stand alone' jump pack characters and simply don't buy it I'm afraid. Interesting, yes, but their vunerability unless really pricey (the wolf lord above for example) just means its difficult to justify, particularly for a rune priest. Their place, as with all but the most unusual IC (e.g. T6!), is in a unit. There is far too much speed, reliable deep strike and outflanking in 5th to allow you to 'hide' a character behind a rhino effectively. Yeah, it will work at times, but do you really want your cool SW IC getting shot by a lascannon/meltagun? I'll pass. Best of luck to those that use them, and I'd be interested to hear of really regular and continuing success with them - I don't mind being proved wrong. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2807800 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulweih Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Well I only have one HQ with JP and that's a WP, he's leading the Skyclaws to battle and very effective I have to admit. Sure, sometimes he's the last man standing but only after dealing out lots of pain. However, when I have points left to spare and a spare WG or two, I tend to let them from the leash on JP's. I doesn't hurt as much when they go down compared to an HQ choice and they're a good distraction for the opponent, plus they pack some punch and are really fun to play. For my Apoc games I have a whole pack of WG with JP's, kitted out to the teeth and led by a Lord, but for normal games they are way too expensive pointswise :rolleyes: . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2807852 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Dammit Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I want a wolfguard battle leader to go with my wolfs. He'll be the only way to keep the ld up and he can sorta keep up if needed be, he can even charge, make people pile in and than the wolves can charge or the other way around Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2807889 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikeninja Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 I used Jump Packs on my guys often... I am using bikes now just playing things different but my jump packs have been very effective. I do Wolf Lords, Battle Leaders and Wolf Priests. I will have try the Rune Priest as that could be fun. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2808085 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted July 1, 2011 Author Share Posted July 1, 2011 Has anyone used a Wolf Lord with jp, along with SotWB? I'd like to hear about what sort of success has come from that combo. I'm not sure why I never though of using one on a battle leader, but this seems like an affordable way to do some damage. And about the fen wolves: do they still charge 12" when joined by ICs? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2808222 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulweih Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Units move and attack at the speed of their slowest, so that's a no for the fen. Wolves on the 12" charge when joined by an HQ. The answer to the other question is a big YES. The above mentioned Lord leading the "King Slayers" to battle is equipped with said Saga. As mentioned before I think he's too expensive outside of Apoc, but that's my personal opinion. A WG-Battleleader could do I guess. He often splits from the pack (as they reap a heavy toll all by themselves) and only leaves dead enemies behind, from the second round of cc upwards he's terrible. If memory serves his highest attack count was 18 on the charge in turn 4, which sadly was the last. It's a lot of fun seeing him devour whole infantry squads single-handedly, his Saga is long indeed :P . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2808344 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 Has anyone used a Wolf Lord with jp, along with SotWB? I'd like to hear about what sort of success has come from that combo. I'm not sure why I never though of using one on a battle leader, but this seems like an affordable way to do some damage. And about the fen wolves: do they still charge 12" when joined by ICs? i plan on trying this out sometime soon. i did try my dual JP toon list down sized a bit, it worked fairly ok. wasnt all to into the game though had a horrible day that day. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2808506 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freman Bloodglaive Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 One for a bit of fun I made a Wolf Lord, two power fists, jump pack, belt of Russ, runic armour, saga of the bear. Expensive, but he basically killed a 10 man terminator squad (well with help from some Skyclaws and a Wolf Priest who died) losing only two wounds. He then shepherded the terminator librarian off the table, surviving a plasma shot (lucky 44+ save). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2808512 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted July 2, 2011 Author Share Posted July 2, 2011 I had a friendly 1000pt point game last night. My list: Wolf Lord, JP, RA, FA, SS, SotWB Wolf Priest, JP, RA 8 Sky Claws, PF 6 GH, PG, MotW, WS 5 GH, Flamer Land Raider Fun list, obviously. My friend was playing a Tervagon Tyranid list. Long story short, My wolf lord ate two large squads of termigaunts (by himself), and the Priest and Claws took out another. My only concern with this setup is not having the strength to deal with larger opponents. My lord got bogged down by a hive tyrant with a lash whip, so the frost ax at initiative was useless. I would have much rather had a thunder hammer. However, had I been able to avoid the pesky tyrant, Im sure he would have gone on to slay many more bugs. I can see this setup working well against infantry. Perhaps even giving him melta bombs (or the trusty TH) for vehicle hunting as well. I guess it would be nice to have a FA and a TH (with the belt for the ++), but I dont know if the two weapons work together (ie i can choose what weapon I want to use, TH is Str9). I think a small retinue of wolf guard (1-3), would also be awesome. Another problem I had with the list I ran was pitting the lord against larger opponents (in number or strength/toughness). My goal was to make sure he mopped up in combat by the end of my opponents assault phase, leaving him free to move on to the next victims without the worry of being shot to death. 10 sky claws is just too many attacks, but a few guard would likely be able to finish of a very large squad in two rounds of combat. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809007 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bikeninja Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 I have done the Wolf Lord and the Wolf Guard Battle Leader with JP, BoR, x2 Wolf Claws, RA and Warrior Born. I would run behind my vehicle advance and allow him to support whatever unit needed him as we chugged up the field. He was pretty devastating. I have taken units of Khorne Bezerkers, Howling Banshees and all manor of SM assault squads. Usually he was teamed with a 6 man unit of Grey Hunters. I like the Jump Pack and still use it. If I had a complaint about the fluff it is the one about Wolves not liking jump packs. Makes no sense to me. As good as the JP is I really got to tell ya the Bike is really working for me right now. I run the same support roll with the WL and the WP (both on bikes) with my advancing units. They have been money. My next experiment is a 3 man unit of Wolf Guard on Bikes to run with them. Expensive yes but my hope is the flexibility will allow for some greater advantage. We shall see. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809051 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Guard Nostromo Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 As good as the JP is I really got to tell ya the Bike is really working for me right now. I run the same support roll with the WL and the WP (both on bikes) with my advancing units. They have been money. My next experiment is a 3 man unit of Wolf Guard on Bikes to run with them. Expensive yes but my hope is the flexibility will allow for some greater advantage. We shall see. Aye, this is a good point. The extra 10 points for the bike gives you the turbo boost movement and save + the invaluble toughness boost. While I'm an advocate of JP characters, I also still use my bike characters more - the wolf priest particuarly. He is very effective (and my favourite model!) :lol: Can I also advocate saga of the beastslayer for the PF/TH JP lord if you can't afford Saga of the bear - the speed usually gives you the ability to choose your target, and it is a great way of smashing a hive tyrant (and the synapse network) to pieces. Other monsterous creatures are available. Dreadknights don't like these guys either... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809245 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 but the T boost that the bike gives you doesnt protect you from missiles or las cannons any better. i do like the idea of it cause those pesky non PF having people now need a 5 to wound you if not more. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809273 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Guard Nostromo Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 but the T boost that the bike gives you doesn't protect you from missiles or las cannons any better. i do like the idea of it cause those pesky non PF having people now need a 5 to wound you if not more. You're right of course, but this is only applicable to a model with a 3++ already - it is a huge bonus to anyone with less potent (and expensive) wargear (particularly ICs who literally can't have a storm shield i.e. our rune priest and wolf priest). It is gold on a big unit of claws, though I realise that I'm far from topic now and won't continue that discussion here... Suffice to say its more relevant to 'budget heroes'. You are also assuming that the opposition is hitting at strength 4 - don't forget IG, DE and eldar will all need 6s - wyches really struggle unless they have an agoniser or two. Howling banshees just give up, go home and cry! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 You are also assuming that the opposition is hitting at strength 4 - don't forget IG, DE and eldar will all need 6s - wyches really struggle unless they have an agoniser or two. Howling banshees just give up, go home and cry! thats why i said or more. :tu: i will try this out, been kinda wanting to get a unit of bikes anyway. I had some in 3rd and it was awesome. would be a great delivery method for another melta gun. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809442 Share on other sites More sharing options...
commander alexander Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 If it werent't so ridiculously expensive, I would give a unit of wolf guard jump packs am]nd slap on the wolf priest. Maybe some day in an apocalypse game..... :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809604 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 If it werent't so ridiculously expensive, I would give a unit of wolf guard jump packs am]nd slap on the wolf priest. Maybe some day in an apocalypse game..... :D why not just do sky claws? or a small unit of WG with packs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809627 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted July 3, 2011 Author Share Posted July 3, 2011 If it werent't so ridiculously expensive, I would give a unit of wolf guard jump packs am]nd slap on the wolf priest. Maybe some day in an apocalypse game..... ;) why not just do sky claws? or a small unit of WG with packs. This is what im considering. A Lord or WGBL with jp and toys, and just 2 or 3 WG. Though 5 Sky Claws with a PW or PF would probably still be cheaper, if points are a concern.... <_<. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809641 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted July 3, 2011 Share Posted July 3, 2011 three WG would be a waste. but a pack of 5 SC with a MG wouldnt be bad if led by a WP. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809655 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted July 3, 2011 Author Share Posted July 3, 2011 I dont disagree with you toast. My plan though is to mop up the close combat in two player turns, rather than 1. 5 Sky Claws 19 attacks alone on the charge. For a Lord with SotWB, there arent many who will stand up against that. Though, without the saga, it may be more feasible to have the claws. Again, this reverts back to your comment about the WP with the sky claws, which would be much more efficient. I just like the idea of 3 WG with power or frost weapons with the lord. expensive, but brutal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809678 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted July 3, 2011 Author Share Posted July 3, 2011 double post. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809679 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 I dont disagree with you toast. My plan though is to mop up the close combat in two player turns, rather than 1. 5 Sky Claws 19 attacks alone on the charge. For a Lord with SotWB, there arent many who will stand up against that. Though, without the saga, it may be more feasible to have the claws. Again, this reverts back to your comment about the WP with the sky claws, which would be much more efficient. I just like the idea of 3 WG with power or frost weapons with the lord. expensive, but brutal. im not trying to say that you are disagreeing with me. in fact i just stripped an old paint job off my jumping chaplin to make it into my JP WP! I think warrior born on him would be, well, EPAWESOMEIC Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809723 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 Yes it would! I know that the problem I faced was trying not to get caught out inthe open on my opponents turn. Though, if your IC was surrounded by skyclaws, they might be able to take a few wounds to survive until the next round. And if your opponent is foolish enough to charge you, counter-attack should make things interesting again. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809741 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 im just thinking about having him with a unit of GH or even foot BC. i wish i could stick him in a transport (LRC) or something! i may have to experiment with a unit of SC for you to let you know how it goes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809754 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 i am now wondering if my tactic for employing warrior saga is flawed. perhaps the original idea (once again credit mavgirl) of hiding the IC in a squad is enough be a late game monster. i can see a WP being nasty in this way, especially with my foot slogging army. im quite sure your opponent will forget that he has the saga... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/233271-jump-packs-and-hqs/#findComment-2809764 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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