Tycho6 Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I was just wondering what a typical troop (not an officer, elite etc) would look like colour, marking and weapon-wise before the Heresy and then after it. Also did their style of battle/tactics change too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AustonT Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 No Black Rage. You can probably still use libbys but not chaplains. There was an article in Index astartes II or III with BA that had a pre heresy scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonaides Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 they'd look pretty much the same, they still use pretty much similar tactics, there would be chaplains, there may or may not be librarians- depending on when you are talking about in relation to nikea- they did have baal preds, they probably only had heavy plasmas on dreads, no assault cannon(tho this might conflict with the baal pred- possibly the original turret had twin reaper autocanon?). Also, no death company. Any help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Chris Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 How do we know all this? Was there a pre heresy codex? The Index astartes article shows the preheresy marine with Codex tactical marking. I don't understand why they didn't have chaplains or Librarians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebG Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 Librarians were banned in all Legions after the Council of Nikea thing where Magnus and the Thousand Sons spoiled it for everyone. As was mentioned above, if it was a pre-heresy, pre-Nikea (spelling?) force then they could have Librarians but in the direct run up to the heresy then no Libbys I guess. I don't know exactly why no Chaplains is being mentioned. Maybe as pre-heresy good ol' Emperor wasn't viewed as a God as he is 'now' so I guess Chaplains weren't quite as common, though I thought they did exist. Apart from the previously mentioned Index Astrates there's no/very little official pre-heresy BA info. The Horus Heresy Collected Visions book might be worth a try? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AustonT Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 Librarians were banned in all Legions after the Council of Nikea thing where Magnus and the Thousand Sons spoiled it for everyone. As was mentioned above, if it was a pre-heresy, pre-Nikea (spelling?) force then they could have Librarians but in the direct run up to the heresy then no Libbys I guess.I don't know exactly why no Chaplains is being mentioned. Maybe as pre-heresy good ol' Emperor wasn't viewed as a God as he is 'now' so I guess Chaplains weren't quite as common, though I thought they did exist. Apart from the previously mentioned Index Astrates there's no/very little official pre-heresy BA info. The Horus Heresy Collected Visions book might be worth a try? "Some [sanguinius, Vulkan, Fulgrim, and Horus] desired to extend their librarians departments and recruit even more Psychers whilst other Primarchs were vehemently against the entire notion of librarians. Leman Russ argued that the librarians were simply warlocks by any other name. Corax and Rogal Dorn refused to commit their legions to battle alongside those fielding librarians." (Horus Heresy, Collected Visions p.92) "...Malcador ordered the other Space Marine Primarchs to appoint chaplains who would ensure the spiritual well-being of the Lengion, and Enforce the Psycher ban..."(Horus Heresy, Collected Visions, p 124) Methinks that a legion led by a psychically gifted primarch so strong his death throes echo through the ages might be a little hesitant to appoint chaplains and abolish Librarians. Loyal yes, but resistant. Since the Heresy came shortly after the Chaplain Edict the only legion with any real numbers of chaplains should be the Word Bearers. Since GW is just now really fleshing out the HH background a lot of stuff you have to guess at. I would say the number and strength of psychers in the BA as supported by the current codex and fluff indicates a higher likelihood of finding Libbys in the IX rather than Chaplains. While post heresy and therefor post Sanguinus' death adherence to the Codex Astartes and the emerging Black Rage gives the chaplains the essential role they have in the 41st millennium. Once upon a time preheresy marines were painted as blood red with no rim on their shoulder guards in all red. The IA article allowed that both black rimmed and red rimmed shoulder pads were common in 41M. Using older schemes from previous Heavy Metal squads is a good start at pre heresy scheme. The Grail is probably less prevalent in a PH army but blood drops and wings are in. Since black is usually a color for mourning you could go back to yellow chest eagles and call that PH too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castiel Posted July 12, 2011 Share Posted July 12, 2011 In Fallen Angels I believe Nemiel is a Chaplain. Not sure if this is before or after Nikea, but this could mean that they could be used together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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