NOVA Open FAQ - Grey Knights

[Adir]

Any "big ticket" questions for the Grey Knights that need to be answered? I know there are some minor issues that come up but it seems like the GW FAQ resolved the heavy hitters.

 

Let me know if you think something NEEDS to be addressed and I will try to get it into the NOVA FAQ.

[Inquisitor Fox]

The biggest one I can think of is concerning Cleansing Flame. Do we roll a d6 per enemy model to determine if it is hit, or do we roll a single d6 for the entire enemy unit to determine if it is hit.

[Adir]

The biggest one I can think of is concerning Cleansing Flame. Do we roll a d6 per enemy model to determine if it is hit, or do we roll a single d6 for the entire enemy unit to determine if it is hit.

Yep, that is a good one! Thats going in. The RAW seems to be a single die roll for the entire unit (as much as I would like it to be otherwise). If anyone has major heartburn with this feel free to PM but don't post it as part of this thread please.

[thade]

You guys might run into this (as I've juggled it in at least two threads this week): Librarians equipped with Teleport Homers and the Summoning.

 

Some assert it works (the unit is teleporting); others assert that it doesn't work (the Summoning does not specifically state "This is teleportation" nor does the teleport homer specifically state "I work with the Summoning"). Someone is bound to want this to work, and others will oppose it.

[jeffersonian000]

Here's an interesting: Can IC's join with Mordrak when he is not accompanied by Ghost Knights?

 

As Mordrak can be purchased with a unit, and therefore can be a unit of more than one model, he might not qualify as a single-model unit that is alway purchased in units of 1, the restriction that could prevent IC's from joining with him when no Ghost Knights are active in game.

 

While my previous position has been against IC's joining him on his own, there is enough argument for IC's joining him do to his ability to apart of a Ghosts knights unit.

 

SJ

[Deamon Wolf]

the digital weapons on the Brotherhood Champion are redundant is this a typo for master crafting ???

[Reclusiarch Darius]

The biggest one would be how teleport homers, servo-skulls and 'Summoning' all interact. Right now the power itself is unclear as to whether it's a Deepstrike move (and thus requires scatter to be rolled for), whether it counts as 'teleporting' as it pertains to the aformentioned wargear items (which eliminate or reduce Deepstrike scatter near them).

 

As a sorta side-question to that, if you Summon a Stormraven or Landraider, can it use POTMS to still fire one weapon? Doing a 'flat-out' with the Stormraven by moving 24" has been FAQ'd to allow it, but does Summoning?

 

I don't use Mordrak so I largely don't care about his rules lol, but I guess thats a point of contention.

 

Can you make use of your teleport shunt move from a personal teleporter, when you move onto the board from Reserve? I've done this a few times now and people cry foul, but the rules seem to allow it (I know you're not allowed to Scout shunt).

Also, does making a shunt move trigger a Dangerous Terrain test for the unit if it ends the move in difficult terrain/a building/on top of impassable terrain?

 

Do multiple 'Hammerhand'/'Might of Titan' stack?

 

Do blind/psychostroke/rad grenades affect other enemy units assaulting a unit equipped with them, if they're already engaged in close-combat by another (or several other) enemy units?

 

Can the nemesis warding stave invulnerable save, or the bonus applied to existing invul from a force sword, be utilised against a 'Perils of the Warp' attack?

 

When resolving 'Warp Rift', is your opponent allowed to allocate 'hits' on anyone in the unit, or do the specific models hit by the template have to take the Initiative test? Secondly, do models test on majority Initiative or on their own Initiative value? Furthermore, are Initiative bonuses from wargear or special rules factored into the Initative test, or do you use the 'base' Initiative found in the targets profile?

[nurglez]

a few of those questions have been answered by the grey knight and rule book latest versions of the faq.

 

being summoned means a vehicle counts as moving flat out, therefore it can use potms to shoot.

 

Multiple psychic spells stack, unless they specify otherwise, and only if from different psykers.

 

Nemesis warding stave can be used for perils of the warp, but only if you are in combat (2++ vs all wounds when in combat), the bonus from the force sword doesn't work as it specifies close combat attacks only.

 

I shunt when coming in from reserves, because it is a once per game move that replaces your normal move, its like turbo boosting on from reserves.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

a few of those questions have been answered by the grey knight and rule book latest versions of the faq.

 

being summoned means a vehicle counts as moving flat out, therefore it can use potms to shoot.

 

Multiple psychic spells stack, unless they specify otherwise, and only if from different psykers.

 

Nemesis warding stave can be used for perils of the warp, but only if you are in combat (2++ vs all wounds when in combat), the bonus from the force sword doesn't work as it specifies close combat attacks only.

 

I shunt when coming in from reserves, because it is a once per game move that replaces your normal move, its like turbo boosting on from reserves.

 

Ah k, thanks dude. Does anyone know how Warp Rift is resolved properly? Not an urgent thing, I'm just curious because it does (and doesn't) follow the rules for shooting, and neither me nor opponents are sure of how to resolve the Initiative tests. We usually do 'models hit, majority/highest if not majority'.

[jeffersonian000]

Same way as any template attack: number of models cover = number of attacks = number of saves > opponent assigns saves > save are made > failed saves are distributed.

 

SJ

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Same way as any template attack: number of models cover = number of attacks = number of saves > opponent assigns saves > save are made > failed saves are distributed.

 

Yeah, but they're not wounds, they're Initative tests, and no saves are involved whatsoever (if you fail the test, you are removed from play). Hence why I'm unsure as to whether it functions like a flamer would. 'Wound allocation' implies wounds are inflicted, in the case of Warp Rift, none are. You could be right <_< I'm just trying to explain my reservations about going with that interpretation.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Each model that fails the I test is removed.

 

G <_<

[jeffersonian000]

What I'm curious about is why you would think the standard method doesn't work?

 

SJ

[thade]

Because they're not wounds, they're init tests; perhaps he wonders if they're treated as Dangerous Terrain tests.

 

My impression is you can (and should) batch roll them and allocate them per normal. Terrain tests are a weird exception as the controlling player decides, for example, whether his power fist model steps in that terrain or not. Template attacks don't let you single out upgrade models as an attacker, typically.

[Valerian]

I'm open to other arguments, but I'd say it works just like JotWW, except models are hit based on being covered by a template, instead of having a 24" line pass through them. In both cases, the models actually "hit" take their own Initiative tests individually, and are removed from play if they fail.

 

Valerian

[thade]

Valerian's version is the opposite of mine :tu: and is much more powerful.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I agree with Valerian's interpretation.

 

G :D

[Crynn]

Just a few simple ones that are actually perfectly described by using the normal rules.

 

1. teleport homer does not work when using the summoning. ery simple to jsut read that

2. Indipentent characters can join mordrack. Also completely viable by just reading the base rules.

 

The others I can see are not covered correctly or can be read in multiple ways.

 

Regards,

 

Crynn

[bl00d bath76]

summoning question is not easy. Read carefuly and you will realise that. It should work just GW failed to re-read the rules. Thats why it needs to be FAQ'ed so that you can use it, just like GW intended.

[Adir]

Thanks for the insight on open questions. The major one I am seeing is Summoning in general and specifically how it works with a teleport homer.

 

Until GW releases an errata on this one, the RAW seems pretty clear:

 

-Summoning uses the Deep Strike rules with the additional caveat that the unit must be place within 6" of the Librarian

-A Summoned unit is placed within 6" of the Librarian and then you roll for scatter via the Deep Strike rules

-The presence of a servo-skull within 12" reduces the scatter of a summoned unit by d6 as the Servo-skull rules encompass any unit arriving by Deep Strike

-A teleport homer has no effect on the Summoned unit as Teleport Homer rules explicitly state that units "teleport onto the battlefield" and Summoning does not indicate that the Summoned unit is teleporting

 

For a corollary entry, take a look at the difference between a locator beacon versus a teleport homer in C: SM.

 

I truly want the RAW to be otherwise, as I had visions of Mordrak and a Librarian whipping a land raider across the table on turn 2 with no scatter. But I just don't see that the RAW supports it.

 

As to the other issues, I didn't really see anything brought up that isn't already answered in the BRB or codex (trying to keep the FAQ small):

-Mordrak by himself can be joined by an IC as Mordrak is a unit that doesn't always consist of a single model (i.e. whether you give him Ghost Knights or not, the fact that he "could" take the knights means he is not "always" a single model unit) BRB pg 48

-Warp rift is a template attack that works against the unit as a whole and does not single out individual models; the only difference is that you use majority Initiative rather than majority Toughness to determine "unsaveable" wounds - the same goes for the Neural Shredder, except that rolls against majority Leadership (and you get invul saves); again this is standard wound allocation per the BRB; nothing in either rule states you roll against individual models, unlike JOTWW where the rule and FAQ explicitly state you roll against single models

 

I may clarify Warp Rift and the Shredder if folks really think the need is there.

 

Just as an editorial aside, C: GK has been a very powerful list for me and I haven't really found the need for the added advantage granted from opposite rulings to the above.

 

Keep the questions coming!

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

If you were thinking summoning should work for a landraider it's fairly obvious you don't truly understand the heart of the issue.

 

Good though to see you will go with the GW FAQs. Are you gonna use the INAT FAQ?

 

G :confused:

[Adir]

If you were thinking summoning should work for a landraider it's fairly obvious you don't truly understand the heart of the issue.

 

Good though to see you will go with the GW FAQs. Are you gonna use the INAT FAQ?

 

G :P

I must be missing something... give the land raider a warp stabilization field and let the libbie sling shot it across the battlefield... hilarity ensues...

 

We are not using the INAT. We use the GW FAQs supplanted with a smallish tournament FAQ to clarify the most glaring holes in the ruleset.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Cool bro . I am not a fan of the INAT... way too many rule changes.

 

G :P

[Adir]

We are very hesitant to provide too many "clarifications" in our FAQ. As mentioned initially, I am really only looking for the most obvious problems and not interested in the esoterica of situations that likely won't occur or ruling on something that has already been spelled out in a GW rulebook or FAQ.

 

NOVA will have experienced judges and referees on hand to make sure that cases of RTFM are handled at the various tables.

 

For example, the notion of a GK raven hitting an enemy GKSS squad with all four mindstrike missiles - do the perils tests cascade down starting with the justicar and being "inherited" by other knights once he is gone? For me the answer doesn't matter so much as the incredibly negligible likelihood that this would occur during a game. I just don't see this as truly a FAQ-able issue (feel free to post if you disagree with me).

 

At any rate, that is the general philosophy behind the NOVA FAQ. It seemed to work out fine last year...

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Glad to hear that. In fact I have only heard good things about NOVA.

 

G