Davylove21 Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 My question is thus: Once a new chapter is forged, how/who/when is the chapter's banner artwork decided? Are there artists withing SM chapters that do this sort of thing? Having asked that I'm also struck by the question of Armour colours etc. Do space marines just have unpainted armour until they fall into something pretty and say 'Buenisimo! Let's be pink!'? I'd like to know because I'm thinking maybe some sort of chapter historian is sent/assigned to new chapters to do this sort of thing and I want to include it in my fluff, without incurring wrath Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 Banners are up to the chapter (the Ultramarines have had several). Symbols, I'm not sure. Colors are assigned on their founding (there's a quote from a founding charter kicking around somewhere in the fluff). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2851429 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioldanach Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The first Chapter Master picks the Chapter name, badge, and colors. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2851830 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davylove21 Posted August 19, 2011 Author Share Posted August 19, 2011 That helps in terms of fluff but out of pure interest, what if he's artistically inept?! It's not part of his or any marine's remit to be gifted artistically, so who paints these banners?! I'd like to believe that Human familiars paint them, seeing as they revere the Space Marines as Gods amongst men, they'd paint suitable banners Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2851852 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 That helps in terms of fluff but out of pure interest, what if he's artistically inept?! It's not part of his or any marine's remit to be gifted artistically, so who paints these banners?! I'd like to believe that Human familiars paint them, seeing as they revere the Space Marines as Gods amongst men, they'd paint suitable banners Eh, no banner. Only badge or symbol, ie. that thing on the shoulder pad. Of course, banner is created or sewed :) by someone artistically gifted. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2851907 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The first Chapter Master picks the Chapter name, badge, and colors. Does he? The Mentors ended up reusing the Star Scorpions' number and colors, for one example. Deathwatch: Rites of Battle says the High Lords may assign a name (or it may be chosen later). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2851940 Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightrawenII Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The first Chapter Master picks the Chapter name, badge, and colors. Does he? The Mentors ended up reusing the Star Scorpions' name and colors, for one example. Errm, name obviously not, the number and colours were re-used. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2851947 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 I know. I fixed it before you posted. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2851964 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioldanach Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 The first Chapter Master picks the Chapter name, badge, and colors. Does he? The Mentors ended up reusing the Star Scorpions' number and colors, for one example. Deathwatch: Rites of Battle says the High Lords may assign a name (or it may be chosen later). Indeed, young padawan. :huh: From Insignium Astartes, page 36 (very bottom of the page in annoying script font): At a Chapter's Founding the newly assigned Chapter Master must name his regiment and choose its heraldry. There are strict rules to govern this process. The Codex Astartes provides the Chapter Master with a roll of approved naming elements and also forbids the use of certain names. New leaders are careful to try to avoid duplicating the name, icon and livery of an existing Chapter. However, this is more difficult than may be imagined. There are approximately a thousand Chapters spread across the galaxy and only the priests of the Adeptus Terra on Earth have anything approaching a complete catalogue of these units and their heraldry. Many new Chapter Masters therefore create new heraldries to avoid any possible duplication. Over the millennia this has led to a vast proliferation of icons and liveries. While I doubt that the Mentors are unique in adopting some element of an older Chapter's number, heraldry, etc., I would guess that they are an example of an exception rather than a rule. In the case of Deathwatch: Rites of Battle, I think that the operative word is "may". This implies a possible practice, but when taken in conjunction with the quote from Insignium Astartes, is likely indicative of another exception. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2852031 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octavulg Posted August 19, 2011 Share Posted August 19, 2011 They just called a chapter a regiment, though. How can we trust anything they say! :blush: (On a completely unrelated note, that font makes my head hurt. A lot.) RoB also mentions that it can happen long after the chapter becomes active, too. Which definitely sounds fast and loose compared to what Insignium Astartes would suggest (with the strict rules, and all). I remember a big quote from a chapter's founding charter that went into their heraldry, number, name, and colors, but I can't remember where I found it (and, of course, I can't find it again). I think Insignium Astartes' POV seems excessively strict - and I honestly can't think of an example of it actually working that way off the top of my head. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236576-new-chapters-and-heraldry/#findComment-2852157 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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