space marine schnauzer Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 I'm not sure if this has been discused before but here goes... If you were a part of a traitor legion, and survived any purges prior to the heresy going full on, and said this is crazy I love the Emperor and want to stay loyal..what would happen to you? Would you join a loyal legion or just get a bolter round in the back of the head by a loyalist SM. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Broker Posted August 20, 2011 Share Posted August 20, 2011 Make this topic, FAO of Garviel Loken. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2852454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
space marine schnauzer Posted August 20, 2011 Author Share Posted August 20, 2011 Make this topic, FAO of Garviel Loken. :) True enough, but you had to virus bomb an entire planet to do it... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2852456 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TennisBall Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I believe the purges were based on those that didn't join the various brotherhoods/lodges of the legions. The brotherhoods were chaos cults so your own squad mates would know who was a regular visitor to the cult meetings. If you didn't go then you'd have been killed by them or your commanding officer. If you did go regularly then you'd likely have been corrupted to worshiping chaos. Assuming you do somehow survive this and are not corrupted you'd then have to find a way to leave and if you're a lowly marine that is going to be difficult. You could get "lost" on a planet by slipping away during a battle and the rest of your mates might think you've been killed, that's the only option. You then have to get off the planet which would be harder as a planet that has had chaos marines on it is either under their command or blasted to bits. Possibly an Imperial scouting party may come by later to see the extent of the damage and see if anything is salvageable. They might get you off planet and then you've got some hard questions ahead of you as the Imperium decides if you're a spy or not and if you are free of taint. I'd imagine that marines in such a situation would be assigned to the Inquisition in one form or another, you wouldn't be put into a chapter as your gene seed would be incompatible and you'd have the fighting style of another legion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2852833 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codicier Lucion Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 If you were a part of a traitor legion, and survived any purges prior to the heresy going full on,and said this is crazy I love the Emperor and want to stay loyal..what would happen to you? Die probably. Either that or turn into a major saboteur and assassin then die. "Lord Horus? That scouting party we sent to Harad VI? They've run into an Iron Hands warfleet. No I don't know how they got there without us knowing or knew we were here at all. ... Well, I'm afraid we can't jump lord, the Warp engines have just mysteriously blown up." Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2852855 Share on other sites More sharing options...
space marine schnauzer Posted August 21, 2011 Author Share Posted August 21, 2011 If you were a part of a traitor legion, and survived any purges prior to the heresy going full on,and said this is crazy I love the Emperor and want to stay loyal..what would happen to you? Die probably. Either that or turn into a major saboteur and assassin then die. "Lord Horus? That scouting party we sent to Harad VI? They've run into an Iron Hands warfleet. No I don't know how they got there without us knowing or knew we were here at all. ... Well, I'm afraid we can't jump lord, the Warp engines have just mysteriously blown up." That's what I thought. I find it hard to believe that there would be so many legions going to chaos..but that's the fluff.. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2853035 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarbossBigBadJim Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I think a lot of it involves the division of loyalty between Primarch and Emperor. The impression given in most cases is that its loyalty to their Primarch that initially sways the traitors, until the taint of Chaos is set too deep for them to change their minds. Couple this and the deeply instilled requirement to obey orders, its a pretty good way to bring whole swathes of warriors over, even more so when they play on the 'Emperor has abandoned us' routine! :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2853112 Share on other sites More sharing options...
space marine schnauzer Posted August 21, 2011 Author Share Posted August 21, 2011 I think a lot of it involves the division of loyalty between Primarch and Emperor. The impression given in most cases is that its loyalty to their Primarch that initially sways the traitors, until the taint of Chaos is set too deep for them to change their minds. Couple this and the deeply instilled requirement to obey orders, its a pretty good way to bring whole swathes of warriors over, even more so when they play on the 'Emperor has abandoned us' routine! :) I can see this also, loyality to the primarch would be first in their mind. And if the primarch said this is what is going on they would follow without any question. I'm not sure how long the Emperor was gone before the heresy, but there would be some question on the legions minds about "where is the Emperor". Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2853188 Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolf2.3 Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 A space marine doesn't need to be with other loyalists to fight. We naturally asume so cos its "Safe". As far as thier concerned they were born to fight to the death so if they thought "sod this, I'm a loyalist," they would then endevour to kill as many traitors as possible before death. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2853437 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Mad Balrog Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 That's what I thought. I find it hard to believe that there would be so many legions going to chaos..but that's the fluff.. Let's not forget that at the time of the Heresy, Legions were composed of ten thousand Space Marines, not just a thousand. So even if they killed off half of their own legion for being Loyalist, that's still 5,000 Traitor Marines running around causing havoc. And as of the Isstvan Dropsite Massacre, the Loyalist Legions lost a good portion of their defense. What may seem like a lot from the perspective of the 41st millenium was a crippled, small number compared to Heresy-era Legions. For the few Loyalist Marines who escaped the purges, I bet they ended up a lot like Captain Garro of the Death Guard: alone, shamed, treated with hostility by other Primarchs. Based on what I just read in the Deathwatch RPG book, I'd also be willing to bet a lot of them ended up in what would become the Deathwatch, possibly even these "Black Shield" types. A lot of others probably became what the Deathwing are to the Dark Angels: hunters and inquisitors in their own right, with a special hatred for their original Legion. I think it really depends on the culture of the respective Legion. If you promote a culture of independent thought and critical thinking - like the Thousand Sons - your Marines will adapt differently when you tell them their leader has gone rogue. It'd still be a ridiculously hard sell, but I've heard speculation that the Blood Ravens are the remnants of the Thousand Sons, and their history was wiped from the record for that reason. On the other hand, if you're from a Legion that literally worships its Primarch, like the Word Bearers, you have a much lower rate of "defections". Yet other Legions, like the Iron Warriors, who were split up all across the galaxy, each captain made the choice for himself and the warriors under his command. (Ref: "The Iron Within", Age of Darkness anthology.) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2857884 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artein Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 Let's not forget that at the time of the Heresy, Legions were composed of ten thousand Space Marines, not just a thousand. 100'000. An average Legion had about a hundred thousand Marines, with Ultramarines and Word Bearers having twice as that or more and Thousand Sons having much less. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2858262 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Mad Balrog Posted August 27, 2011 Share Posted August 27, 2011 Even worse for the Loyalist Legions, then. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2859113 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TennisBall Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Even worse for the Loyalist Legions, then. How do you mean worse? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2861621 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gop Posted August 30, 2011 Share Posted August 30, 2011 Whether I rejoined a loyal legion would depend if they could remove my Nurgle buboes, lesions, diseases etc. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2861675 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Mad Balrog Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 How do you mean worse? Because there are 50,000 Traitor Marines running around, instead of 5,000! 5,000 Traitor Marines are already worth 5 of any Loyalist Chapter in the 41st millenium (except maybe the Space Wolves, but they cheat a little.) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2863455 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Himinaru Kyosuke Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 That is indeed an interesting question. I would have to agree that it really just depends on what Legion I hailed from, but I can easily see myself being under Loken's command. I find that irl I would rather die for what I believe in then live a traitor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2865876 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeaponAdept Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 What about the fallen? They don't activly oppose the Imperium do they? They don't deliberatly fight the enemies of man nor do they seek to sabotage the empire. They just wander around trying to fix what went wrong and find salvation and peace and loves labours lost or something right? I guess we hit the area of "Renegade". A loyalist Alpha Legion marine would surely be a Renegade and not a traitor? Help from true DA fluff-masters needed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2865911 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitchen Knife Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 As far as I know (starting with Codex 3rd ED), the Fallens have split in more or less three major groups: - 100% chaos, WOHOOOO!! - renegades who follow their own agendas (mercenaries, pirates...) - the marines, who search for redemption for their" betrayal" on Caliban. I don't know, which of these fractions is the biggest. So far I haven't read anything about the percentage of these groups. ;) Funny thing is, that the AL is (regarding the current fluff) the only legion, who sided willingly and complete (meaning they hadn't an intern cleaning off some sort) with Horus, and making them traitors. For more informations about the unique situation of the AL, I highly recommend "Legion" from Abnett Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236649-traitor-legions/#findComment-2866922 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.