DV8 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 What an amazing and tiring weekend! Nine of us went to the 40k Warmaster's Challenge this weekend (four Doubles games (1000 per player, 2000 per side) on Saturday, four Singles games (1850) on Sunday) representing Games Workshop STC (as the "Order of Chaos"), and we absolutely wrecked face! For Doubles, three of our teams took Second, Third and Fourth spots (Chris Slye (Manager GW STC) and myself placed Second with double Dark Eldar. For Singles, I took my Space Wolves (list below) and not only took the First spot for Singles, won overall Warmaster's Challenge for the weekend because of my score from the previous Doubles games. I was also slated to win Best Appearance Player's Choice and Best Appearance Judge's Choice, but both of those awards were given to the runner-ups because of their policy not to award a player more than one award (discounting the overall weekend prize). Second, Fourth, Fifth and Sixth spots in Singles were also won by the Order of Chaos (Third, Fourth and Fifth all tied with the exact same scores, tiering determined by Battle Points). My list for Singles was as follows: Wolves of Fenris HQ // Rune Priest - Chooser of the Slain, Jaws of the World Wolf, Murderous Hurricane HQ // Rune Priest - Jaws of the World Wolf, Tempest's Wrath Elites // 10 Wolf Guard - 3 Power Fists, 3 Combi-Flamers Rhino packs - 1 Power Fist, 1 Combi-Melta Wolf Scouts pack - 4 TDA, 4 Wolf Claws - 1 TDA, 1 Cyclone Missile Launcher, 1 Meltabomb Drop Pod pack - 1 TDA, 1 Cyclone Missile Launcher Elites // 5 Wolf Scouts - Meltagun Troops // 8 Grey Hunters - Meltagun, Rhino Troops // 8 Grey Hunters - Meltagun, Rhino Troops // 9 Grey Hunters - Meltagun, Rhino Troops // 8 Grey Hunters - Meltagun, Drop Pod Fast Attack // 2 Land Speeder Typhoons Fast Attack // Land Speeder Tornado - Multi-Melta, Heavy Flamer Fast Attack // Land Speeder Tornado - Multi-Melta, Heavy Flamer Heavy Support // Vindicator - Siege Shield Better believe it no Thunderlords/wolves or Long Fangs! Many users in the Space Wolves forum will know that I have been quite adamant in my opposition of excessive upgrades on Grey Hunters (amongst them Wolf Standards). However, in Doubles, having been on the receiving end of massed Grey Hunter charges with activated Banners, by the Holy Emperor, consider me a changed man. I must make all effort to acquire and place Wolf Standards in all my units. A block of 30 Grey Hunters with activated Wolf Standards is a TERRIFYING prospect to face, especially with DEldar! Brief summary, I was too tired/busy/focused to take pictures, and my memory of the exact details of enemy army lists are a little fuzzy, but I'll try and include specifics and highlights. There were no Primary, Secondary or Tertiary objectives. Each objective was equally weighted, and used only as tie-breakers in instances where players scored equal wins/losses/draws. GAME 1 Objectives: - Kill Points - Seize Ground (5 objectives) - Control Terrain Opponent: Black Templars HQ // Emperor's Champion - Accept Any Challenge Elites // 5 Terminators - 2 Cyclone Missile Launchers, Tank Hunters Elites // Dreadnought - Twin-Linked Lascannon, Missile Launcher Troops // 5 Crusaders - Meltagun, Power Fist, Razorback with Twin-Las Troops // 5 Crusaders - Meltagun, Power Fist, Razorback with Twin-Las Troops // 5 Crusaders - Meltagun, Power Fist, Razorback with Twin-Las Troops // 5 Crusaders - Plasmagun, Power Fist, Razorback Troops // 5 Crusaders - Plasmagun, Power Fist, Razorback Heavy Support // Predator Destructor - Two Lascannon Sponsons Heavy Support // Vindicator Heavy Support // Vindicator My first game was actually against one of the people representing GW STC, great guy. I've been trying to help him optimize a mech gun-line army, and while he still has a ways to go, he played the list fairly well (he placed 26th overall for Singles out of 53 opponents). The scenario involved Dawn of War, and my opponent took first turn. I started everything off the table (driving on first turn), with the Drop Pod arriving via Drop Pod assault and my Wolf Scouts Outflanking. Acute Senses and Searchlights were amazing, and allowed me to knock out a Las-Razorback and the Vindicators from the get-go. It went downhill quickly for my opponent from there, as I simply outmaneouvered him, pincered with the Wolf Scouts on the opposite flank (took out the Predator, 2 Razorbacks, and a Crusader Squad), and blitzed with 30 Rhino-borne Grey Hunters. Tornados ran amuck, while the Wolf Guard and Typhoons sat back throwing Krak missiles everywhere. I wiped my opponent by Turn 5, winning 3-0. GAME 2 Objectives: - Victory Points - Capture and Control - Capture the Flag (center of the board, Scoring units can capture, within 6") Opponent: Chaos Space Marines (I'm fuzzy on the exact specifics of gear, but I've put what I remember he used) HQ // Daemon Prince - Tzeentch (Warptime), Wings HQ // Chaos Lord - Mark of Khorne, Plasma Pistol, Daemon Weapon - Blood Feeder (or something, roll 2D6, hurt yourself on rolls of a 1) Troops // 9 Khorne Berserkers - Champion with Power Fist Troops // 10 Plague Marines - Champion with Power Fist, 2 Meltaguns, Rhino Troops // 10 Noise Marines - Champion with Power Weapon, Doom Siren, 9 Sonic Blasters, Blastmaster, Rhino Heavy Support // 3 Obliterators Heavy Support // Defiler Heavy Support // Land Raider I don't know how this guy got a 3-0 massacre in the first round, but the match-up was not at all even. I scored first turn, and while my Drop Pod failed to kill the Land Raider, they made perfect bait for the Chaos Lord + Berserkers (who got shelled by a Vindicator and pretty much completely destroyed). Bolters dropped the Daemon Prince in short order, while Jaws took care of the Obliterators. The Defiler was immobilized on the first turn, and Wolf Scouts came in turn 2 to finish off the Land Raider and in turn 3 the Defiler. His army was completely destroyed by the end of my turn 3 (so he got two turns of play). I felt kind of bad for him, but he was an amazing sport, took it like a champ, and we were laughing till the end. Great game, and I move to round 3 with a perfect score. GAME 3 Objectives: - Victory Points - Capture the Flag (three Flags, one in the center, each side assigns the Flag to a scoring unit; flags can only be picked up by Scoring, will move with the unit, and cannot be dropped unless broken or destroyed). - Spearhead (Table Quarters) Opponent: Dark Eldar HQ // Asdrubael Vect HQ // 2 Haemonculus - 2 Webway Portals Elites // 4 Incubi Troops // 15 Wyches - Hekatrix with Agoniser, 3 Shardnet Impalers, Haywire Grenades Troops // 10 Warriors - Sybarite, Blaster, Dark Lance Troops // 10 Warriors - Sybarite, Blaster, Dark Lance Troops // 8 Wracks - Acothyst, Flamer-gun (S3, D6 AP), Raider with Dark Lance, Flickerfield Troops // 8 Wracks - Acothyst, Flamer-gun (S3, D6 AP), Raider with Dark Lance, Flickerfield Fast Attack // Beast Unit - 3 Beastmasters, 3 Razorwing Flock, 7 Khymerae Heavy Support // Ravager - Flickerfield Heavy Support // Ravager - Flickerfield Heavy Support // Cronos Pain Engine This was by far the most mentally stressful game (my opponent - also representing GW STC had also scored perfectly thus far, and had in fact placed third in Doubles the previous day...the loser would be knocked out of the running for overall WMC weekend champion). He placed the Wyches (with Asdrubael), the Incubi, the Beast unit, and the Cronos Pain Engine in Reserve. Not only that, but with two portals (Haemonculus with Wracks in Raiders) and first turn, he was in prime position to place the portals almost in the center of the table. He grabbed the center Flag turn one. I placed my Tornadoes in Reserve, Outflanked Wolf Scouts, and the rest started on the table with tons of cover (walls for my Wolf Guard, who in turn screened my Rhinos) I got INCREDIBLY luck because his Dark Lances were firing silly string all game (in the end he immobilized 1 Rhino and 1 Tornado), and his Reserve rolls were atrocious (Vect + Wyches and Cronos on turn 2, Beast unit on turn 3, Incubi on turn 4), allowing me to pick apart his army piecemeal. Still, he played it incredibly well and by Turn 5 we were 1-1 on objectives (I had Victory Points, having only conceded half points for 3 immobile vehicles (Rhino, Tornado, and Drop Pod), half my Drop Pod squad, and 1 Rhino squad (in return, he had only a unit of Wracks, a unit of Warriors, and 1 Raider left alive), and I let him have the Flags objective). It came down to my having to kill a Flat-Out Raider to take Table Quarters (managed it with Bolters scoring one glancing hit and rolling a 5, which goes down to 4 because of being open-topped). Amazingly well-played game, and that game fried my brain, but I moved into the fourth round with an almost perfect score (3-0, 3-0, and 2-1) GAME 4 Objectives: - Seize Ground (5 Objectives) - Kill Points - King of the Hill (any unit, including vehicles, can control this objective; placed in the center of the board, cannot be moved, control range is 6") Opponent: Imperial Guard HQ // Command Squad - Straken, 4 Meltaguns?, Chimera Advisors // 2 Commissars - Power Weapons Advisors // 2 Priests - Eviscerators Elites // Psyker Battle Squad - 5 Psykers, Chimera Troops // Platoon Command - 4 Grenade Launchers, Chimera -- // Blob Squad - 3 Combined Infantry Squads - 3 Power Weapons, 3 Meltabombs, 3 Autocannons, Frag Grenades Troops // Platoon Command - 1 Flamers, Chimera -- // Blob Squad - 3 Combined Infantry Squads - 3 Power Weapons, 3 Meltabombs, 3 Lascannons, Frag Grenades Heavy Support // Manticore Heavy Support // Leman Russ Squadron - Executioner with Plasma Cannon Sponsons - Demolisher with Heavy Bolter Sponsons This was a ridiculous game. Literally an almost open field, deployed against an Imperial Guard line, and he STOLE THE FREAKIN' INITIATIVE! His opening volley killed 3 of my Terminator Wolf Guard (including the Cyclone), destroyed all the weapons on my Vindicator, wrecked one Rhino, immobilized another, and killed one of my Typhoons. I had both my Tornadoes in Reserve and my Wolf Scouts were Outflanking. Despite that TERRIBLE first turn, the scenario was incredibly in my favor. He had deployed in a 1' by 3' formation in his back left corner, and all the objectives were on the other side of the board/flank. I basically funneled him in and kept him boxed into a corner, Wolf Scouts taking out the Leman Russ squadron and pulling one blob squad into the far corner (essentially pulling them out of the game). I will say this, blob squads with Furious Assault and Preferred Enemy - Everyone are just balls-out ridiculous. I lost more models (infantry and vehicles) in this one game alone than in my first three games combined. Props to the Priests for using both Jaws to pick out the Commissars, Sergeants, Priests, and Heavy Weapon teams (they accounted for one Commissar, 4 out of 6 Sergeants, 2 Autocannon Teams, 1 Lascannon Team). Jokes on the Vindicator that tank-shocked a blob squad, knicking a Sergeant, and being destroyed by a Meltabomb in Death or Glory (my plan was to tank-shock the unit off the objective, forcing a break test on Leadership 8, and chasing them off the table with a weaponless Vindicator ... having not bothered to look carefully over his list (I was so mentally and physically exhausted by this point), I didn't realize that his Sergeants had Meltabombs). In the end, my opponent's deployment proved his undoing, and my army actually did VERY well, destroying every unit by Turn 5, although I only had enough models left to control 2 of the objectives and claiming the central flag. I ended the game with both Rune Priests, 1 Typhoon, both Tornadoes, my Drop Pod, 1 functional Rhino (auto-repaired turn 4), and a grand total of 7 Grey Hunters split across 2 packs (one had Wolf Guard + Grey Hunter, the second had Wolf Guard + 5 Grey Hunters). I finish round 4 and the Singles portion with a score of 3-0, 3-0, 2-1 and 3-0. I'm tired now, so I'm gonna go pass out. Frakkin' work tomorrow too :*( FOR RUSS AND THE ALLFATHER! DV8 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Volsung- Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I'm curious what kind of prizes are usually won for placing in these events? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2853681 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DV8 Posted August 22, 2011 Author Share Posted August 22, 2011 My prize for placing First in Singles was $50 Gift Certificate for Battlefoam, and $150 Gift Certificate for Games Workshop (the Singles entrance fee was $30). My prize for being crowned Warmaster's Weekend Champion was a Forgeworld Gargantuan Squiggoth. I didn't want it, so I gave it to a friend of mine (he plays Orks, wants it, can't afford it) as I had no use for it, and couldn't be bothered to try and sell it. It was funny because a friend had bet me that if I placed in the top three over the weekend, that he would buy me two Vampire Count Terrorgeists. So I kind of also win that as well (although that's not an "official" prize). DV8 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2853684 Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Volsung- Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Wow, what a haul! That is some swag, indeed! Congratulations, sir! ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2853685 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forté Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Congrats on the overall win. No suprise on the painting wins and nice to see our lists can work without LF. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2853727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Solid work DV8. Wolf Standards are a solid choice. I had two Grey Hunter packs in cover pop banners and then were assaulted by two 30 strong mobs of Orks. Complete devastation. I am looking at getting rid of MoW in some games, but will never give up the Wolf Standards. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2853747 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Wilhelm Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Better believe it no Thunderlords/wolves or Long Fangs! Many users in the Space Wolves forum will know that I have been quite adamant in my opposition of excessive upgrades on Grey Hunters (amongst them Wolf Standards). However, in Doubles, having been on the receiving end of massed Grey Hunter charges with activated Banners, by the Holy Emperor, consider me a changed man. I must make all effort to acquire and place Wolf Standards in all my units. A block of 30 Grey Hunters with activated Wolf Standards is a TERRIFYING prospect to face, especially with DEldar! Good work bro! Yeah, that many games is like sitting exams, imo. :P It is nice to see someone brave enough to take to the field without the heavy lifters of the Dex, in Missile Fangs. Then without that other expected unit, TWC, you got to bring along Speeders, which I have found to be one of the best units available to any of the Marine Dexes. I find them really fun to use. Also surprised to see no LL on the Rune Priests. Between that, and the above two things, you only ran Grey Hunters, making it fairly different from regular Wolf lists indeed. :P How did you keep the Vindi functioning? Did you run it in a sandwich of Rhinos? How did you use the Wolf Guard, and how did they go? Yeah Wolf Standards are pretty boss. All you need is one failed save made, and you've more than paid it off. Then when you consider terrain, to hit, to wound & Mark of the Wulfen rolls, it becomes Saga creating ;) Does it also work for initiative tests to run down the enemy in combat, and then also the consolidate roll? And they look really good too :D I bet that Templar player won't forget to deploy >12" from table edges the next time his opponent is bringing Wolf Scouts :) I think the Chaos guy would have been better off the the predictable Lash+Oblits+Plague marines ad naseum approach, but I guess that gets boring after awhile. Playing Deldar is actually my most fun games. They can blow you away and be blown away in the drop of a hat, and even if you/they look out of the game, you cannot count your chickens. A very good Codex from Phil Kelly. Excellent work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2853885 Share on other sites More sharing options...
hendrik Posted August 23, 2011 Share Posted August 23, 2011 congratulations on you victories mate! but the following really worried me! I was also slated to win Best Appearance Player's Choice and Best Appearance Judge's Choice, DV8 i always thought you shared some familiarities with an ice troll! :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2854801 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DV8 Posted August 24, 2011 Author Share Posted August 24, 2011 Good work bro! Yeah, that many games is like sitting exams, imo. :P It is nice to see someone brave enough to take to the field without the heavy lifters of the Dex, in Missile Fangs. Then without that other expected unit, TWC, you got to bring along Speeders, which I have found to be one of the best units available to any of the Marine Dexes. I find them really fun to use. Also surprised to see no LL on the Rune Priests. Between that, and the above two things, you only ran Grey Hunters, making it fairly different from regular Wolf lists indeed. ;) Yea, it's a lot of fun and the adrenaline keeps you going (sorta), but by game 7 or 8 it's like your mind is on auto-pilot and you miss a lot of things if you're not careful. I've never been a fan of Long Fangs (more-so static firepower), especially in the meta of 5th Ed, and I'd rather pay a little extra to have that mobility. Land Speeders are such gorgeous models it's a shame to not include them whenever I can. It's funny because the night before, after doubles, a whole bunch of us were just eating dinner in the hotel room discussing the shenanigans of the day and getting all fired up for singles, and one of my friends (Jordan Volpe) goes to me and asks "what's in your list?". His reaction to my inclusion of Land Speeders, a single Vindicator and complete lack of Long Fangs can only be described as a cross between disappointment and disgust. I just shrugged and laughed... And then went on to be crowned "Warmaster". :P How did you keep the Vindi functioning?Did you run it in a sandwich of Rhinos? It really depended on the scenario. Because the tables lacked a lot of terrain (barely 10-15% coverage, and mostly "forests" and low hills), I ended up using the Wolf Guard Terminators as a shield quite often when deploying. Against the Black Templars, I used my Vindicator as the tip of a spear that I thrust straight at the enemy, using it to provide cover for 2 of my Rhinos as they advanced up with my infantry (the last Rhino stayed back to protect my home objective). Against the Chaos army, I advanced the Vindicator up a flank to box in the Daemon Prince/Khorne Berserkers, while my Rhinos blitzed up the center and my Land Speeder Tornadoes advanced up the opposite flank. Typhoons stayed back to provide suppressive fire while my Scouts closed the box from behind. Against the Dark Eldar, my Vindicator again advanced up the flank, staying well clear of any Webway Portals and Haywire Wyches. I used Smoke Launchers and cover to keep it alive against all those Dark Lances (thankfully he only managed one Penetration hit against the vehicle all game, and only achieved a Crew Shaken result). Once I had destroyed his Dark Lance Warriors (Deep Striking Tornadoes with Heavy Flamers) and his Ravagers/Raiders (Typhoon sexiness), my Vindicator blazed straight up the center to contest his quarter. Against the Imperial Guard, it didn't. I had literally no cover, his Executioner destroyed my Terminator screen, at which point his heavy weapons blew off the Demolisher Cannon and Storm Bolter. Since he basically ignored it the rest of the game, I used it as an AV13 shield to protect my infantry from his ordnance (at the very least, get a cover save). Having two Vindicators can be a huge liability, but I find fielding one and being able to drop a Strength 10 AP2 blast template can be mighty handy at times (or the ability to drive 12" straight through terrain unhindered to contest an objective). How did you use the Wolf Guard, and how did they go? As outlined above, Combi-Flamer Wolf Guard are attached to the Rhinos, Combi-Melta Wolf Guard to the Scouts, TDA + CML + Meltabombs to the Drop Pod, the rest (5 TDA, 4 Wolf Claws, 1 CML) remained as a squad. The pack leaders, as always, serve me well. Given the choice, I will always take squads with pack leaders because of the flexibility they afford me. And having a Drop Pod squad with Cyclones is amazing, landing side-armor shots on the first turn pure gold. The Terminator squad didn't perform so well. The extra missiles I can throw at a target can sometimes be handy, but the unit is so small, expensive, and fragile (evidently I can't make 2+ saves) that it's far too easy to kill them before they really impact the battle. At best, I was able to consistently get cover for my vehicles in deployment where I normally wouldn't be able to. I've already written up a new 1850 list that drops the 5 excess Terminators for another 5-man Scout squad (with Meltagun), a Pack Leader with Power Fist and Combi-Melta, and Wolf Standards in all my Grey Hunter units. Yeah Wolf Standards are pretty boss. All you need is one failed save made, and you've more than paid it off. Then when you consider terrain, to hit, to wound & Mark of the Wulfen rolls, it becomes Saga creating ;)Does it also work for initiative tests to run down the enemy in combat, and then also the consolidate roll? I will have to double-check the Codex, but I think it does. The Standard allows you to re-roll all 1's for the phase, after all. I bet that Templar player won't forget to deploy >12" from table edges the next time his opponent is bringing Wolf Scouts :) The problem is that I didn't give him much of a choice. My first turn knocked out almost all of his long-ranged firepower (both Vindicators, his Dreadnought, shook a Twin-Las Razor, destroyed another) and my units all entered play on the opposite side to his Predator, so it had no range), and I threw almost my entire army at him in a blitz down the center. He lacked the firepower and the numbers to hold me back, so he did the only thing he could...he maneuvered away. It just so happens that this maneuver pushed him either straight towards the table edges, or further down the center into my waiting Typhoons/Terminators. I think the Chaos guy would have been better off the the predictable Lash+Oblits+Plague marines ad naseum approach, but I guess that gets boring after awhile. To be fair, that wouldn't have fared much better either. The benefit to being entirely mechanized (and having almost all my long-ranged firepower completely mounted on vehicles) is that stupid things like Lash don't affect me. Long Fangs would be easy pickings, but good luck Lashing my Typhoons hugging the back edge. Coupled with Rune Priests firing Jaws at Oblits, I think Chaos has a VERY tough time with Space Wolves in general, no matter what they field. A more balanced, utilitarian list is probably the better route to take for Chaos, but everything in their book is just so expensive... Playing Deldar is actually my most fun games. They can blow you away and be blown away in the drop of a hat, and even if you/they look out of the game, you cannot count your chickens. A very good Codex from Phil Kelly. Excellent work. It's very stressful, playing Dark Eldar. Their vehicles are covered in paper armor (AV10 for the win!), and they lack the numbers/durability to play the attrition game or to trade shots with the enemy. So a lot of the game is maneuvering and target selection/target denial. In fact, my Space Wolves are very similar with tons of light armor. The only difference is I back it up with 50 infantry. But my Wolf army still depends heavily on maneuverability, target selection/denial, and objectives, less on pure killing power (which is why all those Long Fang spam armies at the tournament suffered heavily. My friend Jordan Volpe took a Long Fang list and placed 6th. The next Space Wolves player was about 15 spots down. Disappointing, but not surprising given what kind of boring lists they were all fielding. i always thought you shared some familiarities with an ice troll! :P Ouch...just...ouch... DV8 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2856352 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Very well done, DV8; it's always enjoyable to read posts like these and learn (or indeed relearn) a thing or two. I also find it especially satisfying for folks to demonstrate that you don't have to go with the "internet standard" to have success. Land Speeders are iconic Space Marine war-machines for me, as much as Dreadnoughts; it's almost a shame to field a force without them. I'm not knocking Long Fangs by any stretch (love them, too), but they aren't the only choice for long-ranged fire support in the list. I'm surprised that you weren't a Wolf Standard proponent until now, but I'm also pleased to see that you've reassessed their value, too. For only 10 points per unit, they can have a huge impact on the outcome of any close combat; I think that you'll really be glad that you've decided to add them in. Regards, Valerian Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2856597 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karack Blackstone Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Very well done, DV8. I'd say the ale and tables of flavorful meat are in their usual places. As for the Wolf Standards, aren't they triggered at the beginning of the assault phase, and then last until the end? That should grant rerolls of 1 to pursue to annihilate and such; it lasts the entire phase, however, once used, is gone for the remainder of the game. I may have to include some now. Your list not having a single Long Fang or Thunderwolf is a heartening move. I'm debating using a Predator in my lists since there's so much it seems to excel at, even the Annihilator models. Plus, it doesn't hurt that the Space Wolves invented the thing (Annihilator) in I believe the Skaros Rebellion (the info is on the Predator poster for those that have it, maybe in another source depending). Again, congratulations DV8! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2856648 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 As for the Wolf Standards, aren't they triggered at the beginning of the assault phase, and then last until the end? That should grant rerolls of 1 to pursue to annihilate and such; it lasts the entire phase, however, once used, is gone for the remainder of the game. I may have to include some now. Once triggered, the Wolf Standard starts affecting the next Assault Phase. Therefore, it is usually best to interrupt your opponent before he finishes his Movement, to declare which Wolf Standards you are activating, so that the "next" Assault Phase is the one that occurs moments later, rather than waiting until an Assault Phase has started to announce it. Many players won't care, but if someone wants to be a pain, they could delay the effects of the Standard by a full Game Turn if you don't get the timing right. They do count for every roll of a 1 (and not just d6 rolls) in the Assault Phase, so almost anything goes. We built a list once to capture everything that might entail; good Search-fu would probably pull it up. Valerian Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2856663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Wilhelm Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 Very well done, DV8; it's always enjoyable to read posts like these and learn (or indeed relearn) a thing or two. I also find it especially satisfying for folks to demonstrate that you don't have to go with the "internet standard" to have success. Land Speeders are iconic Space Marine war-machines for me, as much as Dreadnoughts; it's almost a shame to field a force without them. I'm not knocking Long Fangs by any stretch (love them, too), but they aren't the only choice for long-ranged fire support in the list. I'm surprised that you weren't a Wolf Standard proponent until now, but I'm also pleased to see that you've reassessed their value, too. For only 10 points per unit, they can have a huge impact on the outcome of any close combat; I think that you'll really be glad that you've decided to add them in. Regards, Valerian I had been trying to encourage those on The Space Wolf blog to try out "UltraWolves" [named because I like nicknames and to distinguish it from the Missile Fangs and TWC lists, which are extra "Wolfy"] which is pretty much what you are talking about. Dreads and Speeders. This makes it fun for both those playing with and against the list, as they get to see something different. Whilst the UltraWolves might be veering away from being loaded up with unique C:SW units and more into the realm of C:SM [hence the name] considering that the Wolves don't have Tacticals, Combat Tactics, Null zone or Hammernators, will make for a very different playstyle, even with the overlap in Dreads and Speeders. +++ I had good success in running Dreads with my Templars. Having them along with Rhinos gives AV saturation to protect them. Likewise with the Speeders. Dreads are good at protecting things without ++ saves from mean units like Sang Guard, Incubi and other >i1 power weapon units, as the usually are well armoured but without ++ saves themselves. Perfect for DCCW to squit them :) As most Greys are packing Mg, having a HF on the Dread helps for clearing enemies out of cover, etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2856860 Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlbitz Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 Nicely done DV8! Well deserved on all fronts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2856893 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 I love your list. I may have to use it as a guide for my army. Congrats on the total domination. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2856949 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donutzot Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 ok very solid. maybe I should also let my long fangs at home could do alot more with an extra tank or skimmer oh btw gz DV8 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2857395 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 Before some of you start jumping on DV8's list, understand that DV8 knows the synergy of his list and is also a skilled general. They go hand in hand to be victorious. Don't fall into the Razorspam trap, going out and buying 9 Razorbacks and then wondering why youare not instantly tabling people. DV8 is not successful because he doesn't use boring Long Fangs, he is successful because he knows what will work in their place with the rest of his army. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2857422 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantius Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 Before some of you start jumping on DV8's list, understand that DV8 knows the synergy of his list and is also a skilled general. They go hand in hand to be victorious. Don't fall into the Razorspam trap, going out and buying 9 Razorbacks and then wondering why youare not instantly tabling people. DV8 is not successful because he doesn't use boring Long Fangs, he is successful because he knows what will work in their place with the rest of his army. Very good points, Ramses. What I don't like is that many people don't believe or understand those ideas, with respects to long fangs, razorbacks, and TWC. I hate when people think those units are the only way to make your list successful. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2857629 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimtooth Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 Before some of you start jumping on DV8's list, understand that DV8 knows the synergy of his list and is also a skilled general. They go hand in hand to be victorious. Don't fall into the Razorspam trap, going out and buying 9 Razorbacks and then wondering why youare not instantly tabling people. DV8 is not successful because he doesn't use boring Long Fangs, he is successful because he knows what will work in their place with the rest of his army. Very good points, Ramses. What I don't like is that many people don't believe or understand those ideas, with respects to long fangs, razorbacks, and TWC. I hate when people think those units are the only way to make your list successful. For the longest time, I only ever used one pack of Long Fangs at 1750pts. I used the points elsewhere in my army and was winning just fine. However as games went on I begin to sometime see things that were just superfluous. As I started to trim here and there, cultivating an army list that fit me, the points for an additional pack of Long Fangs came up. I have no problem winning with one unit of Long Fangs, I just enjoy running two. I won't run three except in 2500+ Ard Boyz or Apoc games. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2857728 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DV8 Posted September 6, 2011 Author Share Posted September 6, 2011 They've now uploaded some pictures from the event; two photos show game 1 (against Aaron's Black Templars) and game 3 (against Adam's Dark Eldar). Note in the latter the wall of Rhinos directly in front of the portal (his Wyches + Vect came on from there, so I'd moved up and formed a wall from where I shot Combi-Flamers to reduce the squad to Vect + 3 Shardnets). http://www.warmasterschallenge.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=3100 http://www.warmasterschallenge.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=3133 As for my list itself, yes it's definitely not a net-list I field, and there is a steep learning curve because it requires a very particular style of play. Particularly with the Land Speeders, because they are definitely not durable units. However, they are very powerful assets, as it's not typical for a Space Marine army (of any variety) to be able to throw a unit 24" across the table to contest an objective (Blood Angels/Grey Knights being notable exceptions). DV8 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/236756-honor-and-glory-for-the-wolves-of-fenris/#findComment-2868145 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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