World Eaters in 6th

[Slayer le Boucher]

I just don't want every Khorne army led by Kharne, he isn't the inspirational speech type

 

Dude..., seriously?, and what about his most outstanding speech, that is nearly a work of art ?" KILL!,MAIM!,BURN!!!"

[Caffeineated Chaos]

I just don't want every Khorne army led by Kharne, he isn't the inspirational speech type

 

Dude..., seriously?, and what about his most outstanding speech, that is nearly a work of art ?" KILL!,MAIM!,BURN!!!"

Only nearly? That is the Khornate equivalent of an elderly Samurai's final, perfect haiku before his death.

 

Yeah, I would like Khorne Lords to be more effective. I would actually like another World Eater special character, a (relatively) young World Eater Lord who seeks to repair Khârn's rent in the legion, subjugating other World Eater warbands and even other Khornate CSM warbands and merging them with his own attempting to rebuild the legion. Unlikely, considering how GW likes their fluff, but it would be cool.

[Caffeineated Chaos]

In a Khornate D Prince thos last two are of no significance(well in a Deamon army, if you give him a Fatal strike maybe...)

Even with Death Strike the Multi Targeting (2) rule is useless for Khorne; a model can't usually perform two Fire actions with the same weapon (Chaos Dreadnoughts being an exception).

Not useless, that would allow him to shoot one unit with fatal strike, and then because of multitargeting, charge a different unit.

[Cheex]

I just don't want every Khorne army led by Kharne, he isn't the inspirational speech type and he's one man, he can't be everywhere.

I agree, but I also think this fear is unfounded.

 

I hear a lot of players hoping that the Legions book doesn't turn out like the Space Marine book, where special characters are (supposedly) needed to represent specific Chapters. Personally, I think this is entirely false: the Chapters represented within the SM codex are all more-or-less Codex-adherent, meaning the main differences between them are preferences towards specific units and/or fighting styles. As such, you can easily represent Salamanders, or White Scars, or Imperial Fists, or Crimson Fists, all without using the associated special character; taking those characters simply improves armies that are themed towards those Chapters.

 

This might not actually be a bad thing for Chaos. If you're able to somehow apply Legion rules on a unit level rather than to the whole army, then you could easily create an army from one specific Legion without using special characters. The special characters could then simply have a rule that further buffs units from their Legion, and maybe even further restricts which other Legions can be present in the army.

 

Here's how I'd do it: you can align your HQ choices to any Legion, with certain limits (requiring a certain Mark of Chaos, and have some kind of Ancient Enemies rule, for example), or keep them unaligned to represent recently-turned renegades. Other units in the army may then be aligned with the same Legion as one of your HQ choices. This would allow you to field an army of renegades, an army from a single Legion, or an army from up to two Legions (in a standard game) plus any renegades, all from a single codex. Special characters like Khârn would tend to attract Berzerkers who are even less caring about their own personal safety and probably even more devoted to Khorne than other Berzerkers, so his presence could give all World Eaters in the army a certain bonus to reflect that.

 

IMHO, this would represent the "warband" nature of Chaos armies perfectly.

[Brother Aiwass]

Back from a hugue break from the hobby (sort of), i'd really like most of the ideas about WE in this thread, but wondering what nobody thought about just a simple add-on to our beloved zerkers: rending+fleet. I think that (fleet USR) would be enough for most enemies to step back of sight and fits pretty well with the eager to kill of our buddies (like the blood rage result of the chaos dread).

 

Cheers

[Canardwc]

Back from a hugue break from the hobby (sort of), i'd really like most of the ideas about WE in this thread, but wondering what nobody thought about just a simple add-on to our beloved zerkers: rending+fleet. I think that (fleet USR) would be enough for most enemies to step back of sight and fits pretty well with the eager to kill of our buddies (like the blood rage result of the chaos dread).

 

Cheers

 

Well, IMHO all the options of the death compagny would be just fine, rage and FNP included.

[Muskie]

Back from a hugue break from the hobby (sort of), i'd really like most of the ideas about WE in this thread, but wondering what nobody thought about just a simple add-on to our beloved zerkers: rending+fleet. I think that (fleet USR) would be enough for most enemies to step back of sight and fits pretty well with the eager to kill of our buddies (like the blood rage result of the chaos dread).

 

Cheers

 

Why can Bezerkers run faster than other Chaos Space Marines and why do they get rending, special red paint? Ork vehicles that were painted red used to travel one inch further in a given turn, back in the day, but I just don't see why the World Eaters or servants of Khorne in general would practice running all the time, nor have sharper fingernails and teeth. Surely you're not saying they are better at building chain swords?

 

Khorne Bezerkers aren't bad under the current rules, the problem is so many loyalist and other armies have better close combat troops that their in-game effectiveness does not match perceived fanboy performance parameters. If they were a point or two cheaper per model it might even out the odds some and Chosen or an actual Elite choice could be better and cost more and come all armed with chainfists or something and then they would really rend...

[Brother Aiwass]

Meh.

 

WE zerkers had, back in 2ed IIRC, a rule that, they can move normally but charge (assault) double of the normal distance. Fleet is there just to avoid make up a new USR. Rending is just for chainaxes. We used to have chainaxes with nice juicy rules too.

 

TL;DR yes, special red paint :)

[Slayer le Boucher]

Forget the Chainaxes, i want my Khonre's Ax back!, the ability to end up with 17 attacks!!!

 

But as the DE Incubis stole this ability with their Blood Orgy rule, i begin to doubt that we will see it again...

 

Back from a hugue break from the hobby (sort of), i'd really like most of the ideas about WE in this thread, but wondering what nobody thought about just a simple add-on to our beloved zerkers: rending+fleet. I think that (fleet USR) would be enough for most enemies to step back of sight and fits pretty well with the eager to kill of our buddies (like the blood rage result of the chaos dread).

 

Cheers

 

Why can Bezerkers run faster than other Chaos Space Marines and why do they get rending, special red paint? Ork vehicles that were painted red used to travel one inch further in a given turn, back in the day, but I just don't see why the World Eaters or servants of Khorne in general would practice running all the time, nor have sharper fingernails and teeth. Surely you're not saying they are better at building chain swords?

 

Khorne Bezerkers aren't bad under the current rules, the problem is so many loyalist and other armies have better close combat troops that their in-game effectiveness does not match perceived fanboy performance parameters. If they were a point or two cheaper per model it might even out the odds some and Chosen or an actual Elite choice could be better and cost more and come all armed with chainfists or something and then they would really rend...

 

Just like dogs do with licking their crotch...its because they can.

[Hellios]

In my fan dex I had three levels of dedication.

 

Icons - Much like they are..

 

Marks - Each individual model must take them if a squad takes them... A Marked squad can only take an Icon of the same god except for those with the Undivided mark. Unmarked may also take any icon.

 

Cult - Marks can be used on almost any unit and in any number while for most armies cult upgrades can only be put on basic CSMs and in limited numbers.

 

I then also had HQ upgrades that could be brought for a Lord or a lieutenant but not by a prince.

4 cult upgrades that restrict a lot of options in the list but remove the number limits on cults and allow the cult upgrade to be applied to most units and not just CSMs. So if you want Rubric terminators or Zerker bikers you needed to take one of these.

 

I then had a number of combat specialities that could be brought instead of the cult upgrades for the HQ... Designed with certain legions but which can be used by any army.

 

So I would like a codex that allows you to take cult versions of various units but that allows you to take a mix of stuff if you wish giving you the choice when you make your army if you want to fully dedicate yourself to a god, a certain style of warefare or if you want to be a mixed bag. I think the mixed bag can't have all the options that the cult lists have if all lists are to be equally viable and cult units not insanely expensive.

[Brother Ambroz]

@Muskie- While I agree with you on the fleet portion, the rending chainaxes actually do make sense to me. Chainaxes should be a tad bit more powerful in my opinion than your traditional CCW. As such rending is a appropriate way to show this, rather than the old overpowered rule that it the best possible save becomes 4+.

[Muskie]

@Muskie- While I agree with you on the fleet portion, the rending chainaxes actually do make sense to me. Chainaxes should be a tad bit more powerful in my opinion than your traditional CCW. As such rending is a appropriate way to show this, rather than the old overpowered rule that it the best possible save becomes 4+.

 

There used to be special rules for Chain Axes. I played all Nurgle for so long even though I own a lot of old books, I don't always remember the non-Nurgle rules. Didn't Chain Axes used to add +1 or 2 Strength when wounding? I forget what Rending does exactly but it is similar, helps penetrate armor. The only problem I have is I modeled some of my Bezerkers with chainswords or even regular axes. I don't think I'm the only one.

 

Plus I don't want World Eater specific rules, I'd prefer not to be forced to play a specific Legion or have to take a specific special character to get the cool rules.

 

I doubt Chain Axes will be that special, ever since 3rd edition they've moved to generic CCWs, in 2nd edition swords could parry and axes had +1 Strength, maybe +2 for Chain Axes. The Blood Angels got lots of special two handed H2H weapons, maybe Khorne could get the 'uge Frickin' Axe rule, sacrifice attacks or initiative in exchange for say rending.

 

Maybe Khorne could get a rule like the Waaagh! A true Blood for the Blood God charge, callable once per game. That would be cool, you have to have a Khorne Lord leading your army, maybe a extra special BFTBGC for armies led by Kharne.

[Brother Aiwass]

They have already +1S with FC, so rending is a valid option and not a weird rule (still cool) about diminishing armour saves. I have half of my zerkers with chainsword but still, i'd love if they can get rending chainaxes. Or call it khornate weapons if you like.

 

Plus, since this thread is specifically about World Eaters in 6th, so yeah, we're talking about World Eaters specific rules :D

 

Not sure about the whaaagh rule. Also i can't see why this is right and fleet/double assault range is not (don't remember Whaagh rule, just fighted orks once). Anyways, with the new Chaos Storm Eagle maybe we don't need that ;)

[Cheex]

Forget the Chainaxes, i want my Khonre's Ax back!, the ability to end up with 17 attacks!!!

I see what you did there :)

 

(Unless it was a legitimate typo?)

[fenhold]

Its makes no sence what so ever that a DEMON prince can't take a DEMON weapon.

 

I just envisioned a demon prince reaching to pick up his weapon while a couple of snickering Grey Knights hiding in the bushes complete rituals of binding........ trapping him in his own weapon. :)

[Brother Aiwass]

A bit of wishlisting and nostalgia.

 

World Eaters special rules:

 

1 World Eaters Legionnaires are subject to Preferred Enemy (both in close combat and shooting) of al mortal followers of Slaanesh, Space Marines, Inquisitors, psykers and spellcasters of any type.

 

2 World Eaters Legionnaires are subjetc to Counter-Attack.

 

3 All members of the World Eater Legion recieve an special save of 6++ against psychic powers.

 

4 Legionnaires from the Company of the Chosen are subjecto to Fleet, Fearless, Furious Charge and Rage when within 12" of any enemy model.

 

World Eaters New Units:

 

Scribe of Khorne (World Eater Librarian) HQ

Long ago, World Eater librarians lost many of their recording duties as scribes and all of their psychic abilities. They now serve only as tally-keepers recording the numbers slain in Khorne's name by individuals and squads. Their other duty is to provide valuable communications support on the battlefield.

 

Special rules: Independent Character. Can designate one unit to gain Infiltrate. If you deploy one or more Scribes of Khorne, you earn double KP per enemy HQ and Elites killed if the Scribe survives the battle.

 

Techmarine ELITE

Techmarines in the World Eaters Legion are among the favoured of Khorne, as they have the specialist knowledge that allows them to make the heaviest of death-dealing devices. It is the number of Techmarines within a detachment that determines the amount of support equipment and number of Slave Squads that are available.

 

Unit of 1-3

Special rules: Independent Character. You can deploy a Slave Squad per each Techmarine in your army. Slave Squads do not count against the FOC slots available. Each Techmarine unlock for your army one HEAVY SUPPORT vehicle.

 

Chaplain ELITE

Distinguished by their utter ferocity in battle, Chaplains move among Legionnaires inspiring further devotion to Khorne. Their acts of insane bravery in spilling blood - and their habit of slaying the tardy in the Legion rank's - give new mettle to any squads to which they are attached.

 

Unit of 1-3

Special rules: Independent Character. Rest of special rules as normal per chaplains.

 

Devastator Squad (Havocs) HEAVY SUPPORT

As the teeth of the World Eaters, Devastator Squads rarely limit themselves to providing tactical support. They are often found in the thick of any fight, taking blood with as much abandon as their comrades-in-arms.

 

Special rules: As per havocs. Counter-Attack.

 

Assault Squad (zerkers) FAST

Assault Squads are drawn from the

Company of the Chosen.

Altered by psycho-surgery, they find pleasure only in bloodletting for Khorne. Assault Squad Legionnaries are subject to

Rage

when within 12" of an enemy model.

 

Wargear: Can take jump-packs or bikes.

Special rules: Fearless, Fleet, Furious Charge, Rage (when within 12" of an enemy model).

 

Slave Squads TROOPS

Slaves are pressed into service as cannon fodder by the World Eaters and are driven into enemy postions where their ferocity (and the explosive collar that each wears) can be put to good effect. Each Slave Squad must be controlled by a World Eater Techmarine.

 

Profile: As per Penal Legionnaires from the IG codex.

Special rules: Explosive collar: If the unit fails any Ld test when in combat, the Techmarine punishes them making the collars explode, tearing their heads appart. Any enemy in base to base contact with a model of the Slave Squad that had exploded, recieve one hit of S4 AP6, then proceeds to retire the Slave Squad from the table.

 

Nostalgia out, I also would include the Contemptor dread, the Decimator and of course the Storm Eagle ;)

 

Special rules for the wishlisting is just what I had at the top of my head, italics are actual quotes from the book Realms of Chaos, Slaves to Darkness.

 

[/dreaming]

[Scribe]

Scribe of Khorne (World Eater Librarian) HQ

Long ago, World Eater librarians lost many of their recording duties as scribes and all of their psychic abilities. They now serve only as tally-keepers recording the numbers slain in Khorne's name by individuals and squads. Their other duty is to provide valuable communications support on the battlefield.

 

Get out of my head! :sick:

 

What I hope to see is REALLY just a bit of a re-imagining of the fluff.

 

HQ

Support HQ's (Scribe = Lib, Blood Priest = Tech, Skull Priest = Chaplain)

 

Chosen

Cult Terminators

 

CSM

Berzerkers

 

Chaos Assault Marines (not Raptors as those would be different)

 

Havocs

 

I want all of those to be written in as 'fluffy' World Eater units, and I want a Chapter (Legion) tactics rule applied to all Marines.

 

Furious Charge, +1WS, the only difference being Havocs, which would get Counter Charge +1BS. The berzerker entry can stay as it is, to represent the final stages before true madness (Rage), while Cult Terminators would just be Berzerkers in TDA.

 

Skull Priests = Prefered Enemy + Rage, in a bubble

Blood Priests = Techmarine + ? I dont see adding fortifications being all that key.

Scribe = Some kind of support role, Stubborn + FnP in a bubble?

 

With a repricing on Havoc upgrades like seen in the recent SM books, they would be a great support choice, if Dreads are made more viable in a shooting/support role, they will become a great support choice, and if the fluff just bends so that Marines with Special Weapons are again welcomed into the fold well then we will be well on our way to rampaging through the stars...

 

I suppose this turned more into a post about what I hope to see out of the next CSM book.

[Northstar]

keep in mind... alot of you are talking about upgrading troops to have strength comperable to elites. zerkers are a good CC TROOP choice, and as such, would have a high degree of difficulty with ELITE choices. Now granted, there should be more choices out there for those that would like to feild a fully kitted cult army. but trying to OP a troop choice for fighting elite choices, to me, is asking too much. The only armies that at all can stand toe to toe with a zerker army and have some measure of success I have seen are armies that are also CC dedicate armies... It only just so happens that those same armies are full codex armies... Khorne is simply one aspect of chaos.

 

That said... Cult armies DO need a boost...

[Scribe]

CSM with Furious Charge (even with +1A) vs CSM with Counter Attack, henceforth known as Grey Hunters.

 

I dont think my suggestion is that overpowered at all considering Codex Creep. :angry:

[Brother Ambroz]

Um..... So you don't think zerks should be elite worthy in CC? Just out of curiosity what do you think of grey knights? The same grey knights who outshoot ANY chaos army and beat in CC even the most powerful close combat opponents in the game (khornate marines).

[Brother Aiwass]

Scribe of Khorne (World Eater Librarian) HQ

Long ago, World Eater librarians lost many of their recording duties as scribes and all of their psychic abilities. They now serve only as tally-keepers recording the numbers slain in Khorne's name by individuals and squads. Their other duty is to provide valuable communications support on the battlefield.

 

Get out of my head!

 

Yeah, sorry... (damned psycho-surgey... xD)

 

CSM with Furious Charge (even with +1A) vs CSM with Counter Attack, henceforth known as Grey Hunters.

 

I dont think my suggestion is that overpowered at all considering Codex Creep.

 

/Agreed

 

Um..... So you don't think zerks should be elite worthy in CC? Just out of curiosity what do you think of grey knights? The same grey knights who outshoot ANY chaos army and beat in CC even the most powerful close combat opponents in the game (khornate marines).

 

Zerkers must be a monster-combat unit. Like they're now plus fleet, rending and fnp (i know i know... lot's of fnp atm, but they had before)

 

About the GK :wub: I just pretend that the :P GK Codex full of ;) is not even writed and the :cuss Matt Ward is just a :cuss being :cuss in the Warp :angry:

 

But yeah, the GK should not be comparable in CQC to the WE ^_^

[Muskie]

keep in mind... alot of you are talking about upgrading troops to have strength comperable to elites. zerkers are a good CC TROOP choice, and as such, would have a high degree of difficulty with ELITE choices. Now granted, there should be more choices out there for those that would like to feild a fully kitted cult army. but trying to OP a troop choice for fighting elite choices, to me, is asking too much. The only armies that at all can stand toe to toe with a zerker army and have some measure of success I have seen are armies that are also CC dedicate armies... It only just so happens that those same armies are full codex armies... Khorne is simply one aspect of chaos.

 

That said... Cult armies DO need a boost...

 

Hmm... I have to agree that Elites should beat up Troops in H2H. Now if you moved the four god specific units to Elite like I said and then make them count as Troops if you have general who worships the same god. Nobz/MegaNobz I imagine beat up Bezerkers pretty well and I'm fine with this, they also cost more with all the bells and whistles.

 

The other option I'm OK with is awesome Chosen. Chosen of Khorne should be better than ye old average chaos warrior of Khorne, that is the way it is in WFB now. If Chosen got better and became a much feared unit, then all Chaos Legions would/could spend plenty of points on an Elite unit of CSM. If they wanted to go all Khorne err World Eaters they then could have two units of Bezerkers as their mandatory Troop choices.

 

I don't think Bezerkers will ever get 4 universal special rules. What unit in the game currently has 4 USRs?

[Brother Aiwass]

Death Company

 

EDIT: Checked the dex: Fearless, FnP, Relentless! & Furious Chaerge. THAT'S what a Zerker is meant to be!. And still TROOPS choice. :confused:

[Scribe]

And one point cheaper, aaaaaand with multiple CC special weapons! The only downside, and its huge, is Rage making them not score. If not for that single rule they would be so great and fun.

[Muskie]

Scribe of Khorne (World Eater Librarian) HQ

Long ago, World Eater librarians lost many of their recording duties as scribes and all of their psychic abilities. They now serve only as tally-keepers recording the numbers slain in Khorne's name by individuals and squads. Their other duty is to provide valuable communications support on the battlefield.

 

Furious Charge, +1WS, the only difference being Havocs, which would get Counter Charge +1BS. The berzerker entry can stay as it is, to represent the final stages before true madness (Rage), while Cult Terminators would just be Berzerkers in TDA.

 

Why do World Eater Havocs have better aim than any other Havoc? BS5 Heavy Weapons are extremely rare in 40K, I'm not sure I can think of one off the top of my head that isn't a special character.

 

I think the more elaborate a wish list you guys come up with the more disappointed you're going to be. I don't think we'll see a return to multiple special army lists in single codex. There were 3 army lists in the 2nd Edition Codex, I'd completely forgotten about the second two as I never used them. GW doesn't want to write and test rules most people will never use. There will be one army list with likely a rule that if you have special character A or better still Mark of Chaos X you unlock blah, blah, blah. I just can't see GW making a page plus of special rules for 9 separate legions. Each legion might get one rule but that's about it. Something like World Eaters have been practicing their close combat skills for 10,000 years, every World Eater gets +1 WS or Furious Charge in the entire army. Death Guard would be, 10,000 years of devotion to Nurgle has resulted in +1 T or Relentless maybe I don't know.

 

One universal special rule per Legion doesn't seem too crazy and as they are universal special rules people are already familiar with them, 9 or more new special rules seems unlikely in the era of 40K simplification. I think new models and rules that sell new models are more likely rather than just retroactively up powering your existing models which generates zero sales let alone bringing back rules for models GW no longer make. I stripped about half or more of my Nurgle guys as they were armed with heavy weapons or jump packs or whatever prior to the current codex. Now I can have Nurgle Renegades with heavy weapons again and I don't want to lose that. If Deathguard become the only Nurgle army and they decide guns that shoot over 24 inches are a bad idea, I won't be fighting the good fight for another decade plus. I'll pick another Legion or go Orks or maybe just play some other game. I haven't played in over a year.

 

I have Khorne models with bolters unpainted and bolters were a squad upgrade in 2nd Edition so maybe that will come back, but in 2nd Edition you could have a whole squad of CSM with plasma pistols. I never had one like that and I think the plasma pistol is currently over priced but... I think new rules for new models that will generate sales is more likely than making Bezerkers or 1000 Sons so awesome everyone will want them. All the people in the Chaos Legion forums already own too many Chaos models. GW releases new rules to sell new (more) models. The plastic bezerker kit is an old box. It came out in the 90s.

 

I already own pretty much every Bezerker ever made and doubles of a few. I think I have all the Nurgle CSM models. I have unpainted Bezerkers and Plaguemarines and I may need to paint one or two of each to fine tune my squad. That's right at most under the current rules at 1500 points I'm thinking one squad of each, plus one of Noise Marines (same deal own them all, just haven't painted them all). I doubt I'll go back to pure Nurgle, in Vancouver mobility is necessary due to fancy missions being used in tournaments. I'm seriously thinking Storm Eagle, Blight Drones, Bikers, Chosen with some mobility boost. I have enough painted Troops to last me maybe forever. I spent a lot of time painting one of something because I didn't have it. Now most squads that can be dreamed up I can just take off the shelf. I've done one squad of 20 guys before and I thought about doing the huge foot slogging Bezerker squad, but it just doesn't work in a game with so many big guns and armored vehicles. New Flyers/Skimmers and demon engines plus maybe super chosen/possessed will get all the cool rules, not old plastic Bezerkers.

 

My opinion based on watching many Chaos codices get released.